The Next US President

Must be one of the muckiest elections yet. More like a 3rd world one with all the low blows struck, claims of ballot rigging etc. Not decided on policy issues, just personal ones. With one candidate constantly contradicting himself.

I think I was right to suggest a nice front man should have been used like George Cloony etc. Would have walked it into the WH.
 
Me, too. A lot of posters have bet money on a Clinton win. Also, on a Brexit loss. Those same posters, now, express their oipinions as if they are somne kind of oracle.
 
What I like about Farage is that he sets the agenda and others have to respond.
He is very good at steering and shaping the debate, forcing the issue.:LOL:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37965089

Farage & Trump together in the golden lift is highly symbolic and probably repulsive to Sir Humphrey and the government apparatchiks in Downing St.

Just been watching Farage interview on Sky http://news.sky.com/video/farage-its-time-to-build-bridges-with-trump-10656265 He is running rings round the Downing St politicos who don't seem (want?) to understand his influential position. Perhaps they just can't climb down & exploit his usefulness. I've personally experienced this sort of behaviour many times in Establishment "official" circles, where pride and the inability to admit one's position is flawed, are more important than common sense. That's politics for you! (Bit like us when we find it difficult to quit a losing trade?)
 
Last edited:
Hillary is blaming everyone but herself for her epic failure. Now she is saying the media was against her! Crooked 'til the end...
Thank goodness no more Obama or Clintons.

Peter
 
At least we have the right to directly elect our presidents and vice presidents, even if they may be bad choices sometimes. Freedom to make bad choices. May is an unelected Prime Minister.:-0
I actually am not against May. I just find it strange that she is not the people's PM.

Theresa May 2016
John Mayor 1990
James Callaghan 1976
Alec Douglas-Home 1963
 
Here is a fact. Russia has enough ground forces to invade most of Europe in a matter of days. Trump wants to pull out of Nato. This should be a worry for Europeans.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b081tkmc

That was always the case throughout the duration of the Cold War. The deterrent was US & UK nuclear weapons which would have been resorted to fairly quickly to halt any Soviet advance. Since the Wall came down NATO has been an organisation looking for a purpose. The Europeans ought to be worried by Trump's NATO remarks - they've been freeloading on Defence for a long time.
 
At least we have the right to directly elect our presidents and vice presidents, even if they may be bad choices sometimes. Freedom to make bad choices. May is an unelected Prime Minister.:-0
I actually am not against May. I just find it strange that she is not the people's PM.

Theresa May 2016
John Mayor 1990
James Callaghan 1976
Alec Douglas-Home 1963

And don't forget 2007: our Gordon (Brown) - who bottled out of his election. (But we have different rules this side of the Pond).
 
Here is a fact. Russia has enough ground forces to invade most of Europe in a matter of days. Trump wants to pull out of Nato. This should be a worry for Europeans.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b081tkmc

Why would Putin want to invade Europe?
Makes no sense at all.
His agenda is to become a player on the world stage once again. The problem is, he has no economic strength whatsoever.

The more relevant point is.

Why do the countries of Europe expect Nato to provide their defence, when they themselves don't stump up their fair share of the cost.
If the US under Trump decides they really have had enough of paying a disproportionate share, then Europe's troubles start matey.
Again this is all down to the EU elites living in cloud cuckoo land and not taking responsibility for their defence and borders.
Europe's troubles are just starting and will escalate very rapidly. All of it will be their own fault.
 
Last edited:
That was always the case throughout the duration of the Cold War. The deterrent was US & UK nuclear weapons which would have been resorted to fairly quickly to halt any Soviet advance. Since the Wall came down NATO has been an organisation looking for a purpose. The Europeans ought to be worried by Trump's NATO remarks - they've been freeloading on Defence for a long time.

Europe doesn't see Russia as a threat anymore. I don't believe it is either.

Ukraine is 95% Russian and belongs to Russia.

US has been cranking up encroaching on Russia's interests and pursuing an economic and military campaign against it for yonks.

Economics and Trade now taking precedence over military aggression, which is the future. Not wars and weapons of mass destruction.

Moreover, for US or Trump to stipulate Nato members spends money on weapons is effectively asking European countries to spend money on weapons pruchased from US, UK or France.

The old USSR has disbanded and don't think anyone envisages it being enforced in the future.

US fiddling with Nato will only undermine and harm itself imo.
 
Europe doesn't see Russia as a threat anymore. I don't believe it is either.

Ukraine is 95% Russian and belongs to Russia.

US has been cranking up encroaching on Russia's interests and pursuing an economic and military campaign against it for yonks.

Economics and Trade now taking precedence over military aggression, which is the future. Not wars and weapons of mass destruction.

Moreover, for US or Trump to stipulate Nato members spends money on weapons is effectively asking European countries to spend money on weapons pruchased from US, UK or France.

The old USSR has disbanded and don't think anyone envisages it being enforced in the future.

US fiddling with Nato will only undermine and harm itself imo.

A well-reasoned view with which I'm inclined to agree if you believe that Russia just wants recognition/respect and is not intent on territorial expansion. As I think you have said previously – they are broke; and much of their equipment is very old but that doesn't stop it having very good effect: remember SCUD missiles during the 1st Gulf War? Totally obsolete Cold War stuff but they sure scared the $hit out of many people. Their fleet steaming down the Channel recently, is all old stuff from the eighties but it looks good.

I think the key here is Putin: he wants to be taken seriously and portrays himself as a big, strong and tough man (remember all that bare-chested exhibitionist stuff ? – And yet still he only looks like a better-fed version of Andrew Marr!). Trump is the first western politician to have given him any kind of respect and despite the enormous difference between East and West and as you rightly say, our pursuance of disadvantaging them at every opportunity, there is the paradox that Trump may lead to a better relationship – possibly?

As I said before, the basic problem with NATO is that nobody knows what to do with it. The military love it (especially UK) because it's a really good club for military types. The European politicians have never been serious about defence (excepting the French – who were never fully paid up members of NATO anyway) since the Americans looked after them – so why should they change. The European army is just the latest idea to prop a failing EU.

There is an enormous opportunity here for some different thinking. Is there anyone with the foresight and vision to carry it out? I live in hope. :)
 
Last edited:
A well-reasoned view with which I'm inclined to agree if you believe that Russia just wants recognition/respect and is not intent on territorial expansion. As I think you have said previously – they are broke; and much of their equipment is very old but that doesn't stop it having very good effect: remember SCUD missiles during the 1st Gulf War? Totally obsolete Cold War stuff but they sure scared the $hit out of many people. Their fleet steaming down the Channel recently, is all old stuff from the eighties but it looks good.

I think the key here is Putin: he wants to be taken seriously and portrays himself as a big, strong and tough man (remember all that bare-chested exhibitionist stuff ? – And yet still he only looks like a better-fed version of Andrew Marr!). Trump is the first western politician to have given him any kind of respect and despite the enormous difference between East and West and as you rightly say, our pursuance of disadvantaging them at every opportunity, there is the paradox that Trump may lead to a better relationship – possibly?

As I said before, the basic problem with NATO is that nobody knows what to do with it. The military love it (especially UK) because it's a really good club for military types. The European politicians have never been serious about defence (excepting the French – who were never fully paid up members of NATO anyway) since the Americans looked after them – so why should they change. The European army is just the latest idea to prop a failing EU.

There is an enormous opportunity here for some different thinking. Is there anyone with the foresight and vision to carry it out? I live in hope. :)


Isn't this new vision already playing out? European countries like Germany, France and the UK are more likely to fight together than against each other. This includes Italy and Spain.

It is the US and EU who are the aggressors against Russia for no gain other than upsetting balance of power and global trade and subsequently our own economies.

The demise of any bordering neighboring nation inevitably effects each other. Ukraine issue impacting Russian and EU trade being one example. For EU to annex Ukraine and making it a member of Nato is just fool hardy and stupid to say the least. Russian main fleet port is there and Nato thinks it's going to simply buy it out. Of course Russia will object.

Talking of visions, the future is neighbouring countries instead of being at war with each other through the centuries are now uniting into trading blocks and likely to cooperate in military or economic terms.

Whilst we have Nato the Russians and Chinese are also in alignment with their foreign policy and joint military exercises against the perceived enemy; ie US aggression.
 
There was never a great logic behind the old USSR invading western Europe - except to annex West Germany as then was. But hard now to see an invasion of Germany as sufficiently attractive to Russia.

At some point they would run the risk of the UK and France deploying nuclear weapons in order to halt the Russian advance, with or without NATO sanction, with or without the US. The likely nuclear attacks would be aimed at eastern / northern German territory in order to interdict Russian advances and disrupt their armoured forces, while avoiding a direct attack on Russian sovereign territory which could only lead to an asymmetrical Russian nuclear retaliation on sovereign British or French territory.

It has been very foolhardy of the west to push NATO membership to the very borders of Russia.
 
And don't forget 2007: our Gordon (Brown) - who bottled out of his election. (But we have different rules this side of the Pond).

I noticed that. Why don't you directly elect your heads of state? The PM is usually an MP of the House of Commons. That would be like having a president who was always a senator first. Do you guys vote on local laws? Do you think MPs have greater power than senators because the UK does not have states like the US to contend with. There is only the federal power.

An interesting thing of note is the lack of the Exclusionary Rule. If a cop (there) illegally obtains information that you broke the law, the judge can still choose to use that information. In such an event, both the cop and criminal will be in trouble. Criminals get off on technicalities here.
 
As has been said, Russia has an interest in Ukraine. If US pulls out of Nato, the defence of Ukraine would depend on Europe.

No action, on the part of Europe, is a sign of strength, or weakness?
How would Putin assess that?
 
An interesting thing of note is the lack of the Exclusionary Rule. If a cop (there) illegally obtains information that you broke the law, the judge can still choose to use that information. In such an event, both the cop and criminal will be in trouble. Criminals get off on technicalities here.

The US has one of the highest proportion of prisoners in jail. Why is that ?
Even with the 5th amendment which has let off many a criminal. Trump could do something here of some use and save a load of money.
 
Top