The Great Global Warming Swindle

[laptop1]

It was Carl Wunsch - story here: http://environment.guardian.co.uk/climatechange/story/0,,2031457,00.html

Thanks for the link.he also said this

We know that it is capable of remarkable
changes without human intervention.
Professor Wunsch

I still hold my view, its a New carbon Tax and an excuse to put some sanctions on the developing country's, they want to keep them subdued and not to mention China, the USA will put the breaks on China through the UN sometime in the future..just my opinion

 

[laptop1]

Chancellor of the Exchequer Brown will also say the United Nations should make the fight against global warming a core "pillar" of its international mission.


lol, first in the dock for crimes against humanity, The United States Of America please, with continued attitudes of "we are only a small part of the problem, therefore up yours..."

This attitude needs to be dealt with .

This UN recommends ( based on the U.S.A and its lack of any intentions to comply with UN sanctions regarding control of emissions) the immediate use and discharge of 1000 M.O.A.B 's targeted on installations that fail to meet compliance of UN resolutions regarding world legal requirements of emission control from industrial output installations.

In short these will be flattened, to make way for greener business which meets with UN regulations, however you will be charged with the demolition fee's ,namely the cost of the UN delivering (1000 M.O.A.B. 's ) the ordanance, which we hope will run into billions of Euro's.

Er, we also have the contractual rebuild rights over the new installations worth Billions again.

"Gentlemen ,we force Green, We get Green $, its as simple as that."

I concur

 

[Crap Buddist]

The Oil Endgame has already been won . Liquid green means what it is.

Lets assume the new world order stategists have done the big blue on the liquid black gold (oil )game, surely thats check mate-A -Rooni already, just the moves to watch and play out.

They've already won.


Green issues, mean Green Dollars, lots of them.

Lets us pause for a moment, with the new world orders national anthem, they asked me to commission...

# "We'd like to teach the world to live , in perfect harmony , but it just dont pay as well. "

It's short precise, and honest. The best I could do, sorry.

 

[Jack o'Clubs]

GGWS programme being discussed on R4 now, pros and cons


EDIT - blink and you'd have missed it. Basically an opportunity for R4 to plug The Independent who are publishing a big piece on global warming tomorrow

 

[JTrader]

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/march2007/130307_b_Climate.htm
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/march2007/130307Homes.htm
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/march2007/130307doanything.htm

 

[Jack o'Clubs]

and on R4's Today programme again now...


EDIT: Just two people with opposing views shouting at each other. Not enlightening unfortunately.

 

[blackcab]

The only thing that strikes me as remarkable is the coincidence of government action on climate change and "peak oil". Maybe it's coincidence that governments have woken up to climate change caused by burning fossil fuels at around the same time that oil extraction at current cost efficiencies has, roughly, peaked, or maybe the two are directly related.

Then again, maybe either climate change or "peak oil" or both are fictions invented by those in charge, and promulgated by commercial and citizen media, in order to increase the level of control they can exert on the world population, possibly with a long term aim of totalitarian-style government.

The problem with this kind of thing, as with much else, is that unless you do the science yourself you're relying on trust in others, and that's a weak link in the chain. I "believe" that climate change is real and not invented because I trust at least some of the organisations reporting on it, but I don't really know. Large, non-linear chaotic systems are so complex that no-one can trace the underlying causes and dynamics, and that goes for independent film-makers, scientists and world leaders.

The only thing that makes sense to me is a kind of Albert Camus absurdist position, mixed with small-scale personal science. Everything else is Kafka, Carroll and Orwell.

 

[chump]

Black,
You know how the market moves and then later you read it was XYZ responsible...well in similar fashion as we meet a potential issue regarding energy usage the XYZ responsible in this case is "GBW".....every song has it's day when the time is right and this appears to be right for "GBW".....like the guy who wins the lottery and suddenly realises he always knew he was a 'genius' there's just no limitation on people's ability to make the facts fit the situation ! Any answer it seems is better than answer at all.

 

[Splitlink]

The only thing that strikes me as remarkable is the coincidence of government action on climate change and "peak oil". Maybe it's coincidence that governments have woken up to climate change caused by burning fossil fuels at around the same time that oil extraction at current cost efficiencies has, roughly, peaked, or maybe the two are directly related.

Then again, maybe either climate change or "peak oil" or both are fictions invented by those in charge, and promulgated by commercial and citizen media, in order to increase the level of control they can exert on the world population, possibly with a long term aim of totalitarian-style government.

The problem with this kind of thing, as with much else, is that unless you do the science yourself you're relying on trust in others, and that's a weak link in the chain. I "believe" that climate change is real and not invented because I trust at least some of the organisations reporting on it, but I don't really know. Large, non-linear chaotic systems are so complex that no-one can trace the underlying causes and dynamics, and that goes for independent film-makers, scientists and world leaders.

The only thing that makes sense to me is a kind of Albert Camus absurdist position, mixed with small-scale personal science. Everything else is Kafka, Carroll and Orwell.

I go along with your first paragraph and disagree with the second. World shortages of everything, except pollution, are evident in our everyday lives. We should not need politicians to tell us at this stage. Nations' budgets are going up every year but we see no improvement in the standards of the services provided, only deterioration of them. Hospital services, schools, social welfare, even our armed forces, although we have the biggest and best, have a shortage of everything. So, I don't think that anything is being invented, except by those who do not want to see the danger signs.

The US Secretary for the Environment has said that we have only ten years left in which to reverse this situation. How on earth can that be done when the developing nations, with populations far in excess of ours, are hellbent on raising their own standards of living to our level? How can they do that without the use of fossil fuels? So we are going to cut back over thirty years what they are using to expand in just a few.

If there is a solution, it is not apparent in any new invention that is on the horizon, yet.

There was an interesting documentary the other day on the use of all types of insects in our daily diets. All kinds of oriental gentlemen saying "Yum, yum" and smacking their lips in anticipation of a plate of fried cockroaches.Full of proteins, we were informed. Guess what MacDonalds will be advertising next!

Split

 

[JTrader]

The only doubts i have about GW being part of a NWO effort to tax us more, enslave us further & reduce our freedom is that the US have been slow to embrace C02 reductions - the US Administration has just started to do this.

Perhaps the NWO were slow to see the potential benefits of GW in in their bigger plan?

Perhaps it was a double bluff - pretending they weren't interested in reducing C02 in the early days of the hysteria, embracing it further down the line, to help hide its links with the broader NWO movement/policy?

 

[Splitlink]

The only doubts i have about GW being part of a NWO effort to tax us more, enslave us further & reduce our freedom is that the US have been slow to embrace C02 reductions - the US Administration has just started to do this.

Perhaps the NWO were slow to see the potential benefits of GW in in their bigger plan?

Perhaps it was a double bluff - pretending they weren't interested in reducing C02 in the early days of the hysteria, embracing it further down the line, to help hide its links with the broader NWO movement/policy?

Politicians are never going to be the first to admit that we have to make changes. That would be political dynamite. Most of the Western ministers, in power, have a close eye on their reelection prospects. The problem is that the rest of us will not make a move, either, without a lead from the political groups. However, how is an mp from a heavily industrialised constituency going to relate to making remarks that are not in his voters' interests? There is a similar problem in the fishing industry. Everyone keeps buying smaller and smaller fish, when we know that the seas are being fished out. The Spanish fishing fleet is one of the largest in the world and the government has to tread a thorny path to scrap fishing vessels that are going to put whole towns out of business.

This is why I am saying that it is all too late, now. We are, all, too engrossed in preserving our own interests.

Split

 

[JTrader]

The fact that such an important film as TGGWS has been ignored (as far as i know, i may be wrong) by BBS, ITN Sky news etc. just shows how such organisations are there to promote the govt's. propaganda.

Newspapers have done a whitewash/hit job on TGGWS. Not challenging the program on the science, trying to discredit it as one scientist is arguing his comments were taken out of context.

The TGGWS scientists were all very credible. NASA etc......

 

[Atilla]

The fact that such an important film as TGGWS has been ignored (as far as i know, i may be wrong) by BBS, ITN Sky news etc. just shows how such organisations are there to promote the govt's. propaganda.

Newspapers have done a whitewash/hit job on TGGWS. Not challenging the program on the science, trying to discredit it as one scientist is arguing his comments were taken out of context.

The TGGWS scientists were all very credible. NASA etc......

Would you say the same about the air time allocated for British National Party and it's racist propoganda.

Most believe them to be a wolf in sheeps clothes with dark pasts and interests.

Perhaps the problem is when the government twists the information on issues like WMD and Iraq people lose start applying their criteria to all aspects of administration. (BTW anybody see Panaroma last night - shocking. Talk about winning hearts and minds Now I know how it's done).

Bring on anarchy.

 

[JTrader]

There was also a recent Horizon program I think it was, about 3-4 weeks ago that proposed about 5 alternative yet credible & simple ways of tackling "GW as caused by C02".

The scientists here were also of the opinion that if left for politicians to decide what's best
A) Their ideas may not see the light of day
B) The wrong conclusions may be reached.

These include man made turbines that convert CO2 to oxygen
Plankton/algae type stuff in the oceans to absorb C02
Water vapour sprayed in the air to deflect the suns radiation (or something similar)....

 

[Jack o'Clubs]

Would you say the same about the air time allocated for British National Party and it's racist propoganda.

Most believe them to be a wolf in sheeps clothes with dark pasts and interests.

Perhaps the problem is when the government twists the information on issues like WMD and Iraq people lose start applying their criteria to all aspects of administration. (BTW anybody see Panaroma last night - shocking. Talk about winning hearts and minds Now I know how it's done).

Bring on anarchy.

The problem is having other people decide what you should hear. If the BNP are allowed a platform people quickly realise they're a bunch of incompetent racist nutters and it works against them. If the BBC, the government, or whoever else, bans their access to the media, it has the opposite effect and drives people to them.

The best atmosphere for enlightened debate is when programmes like TGGWS can be aired and people discuss the pros and cons. If those sceptical of man-made GW put their points across and they are argued against successfully then the climate change lobby will win the day. If there is a feeling that the BBC, for example, has taken 'a line' and will only promote that agenda, then that is likely to promote the TGGWS lobby far more effectively than they might do themselves.

Personally, in the current climate (pun intended), with politicans of all parties hypocritically trying to be greener-than-thou, with the British public bearing the brunt of it*, I think there could be a huge public backlash against environmentalism, which is to nobody's advantage.



* eg, when discussing their new flight tax proposals, Cameron kept remarking that how could it be right that it cost more to go by train by Glasgow than to fly? And therefore taxes were needed to normalise that cost. How many more hearts and minds might have been won had he argued that therefore it was important to invest in rail so that the price of a train ticket came down below that of an aircraft... ie why does all this stuff have to inevitably lead to prices/taxes going up? How about rewards for good behaviour, not punishment for bad?

 

[Atilla]

The problem is having other people decide what you should hear. If the BNP are allowed a platform people quickly realise they're a bunch of incompetent racist nutters and it works against them. If the BBC, the government, or whoever else, bans their access to the media, it has the opposite effect and drives people to them.

The best atmosphere for enlightened debate is when programmes like TGGWS can be aired and people discuss the pros and cons. If those sceptical of man-made GW put their points across and they are argued against successfully then the climate change lobby will win the day. If there is a feeling that the BBC, for example, has taken 'a line' and will only promote that agenda, then that is likely to promote the TGGWS lobby far more effectively than they might do themselves.

Personally, in the current climate (pun intended), with politicans of all parties hypocritically trying to be greener-than-thou, with the British public bearing the brunt of it*, I think there could be a huge public backlash against environmentalism, which is to nobody's advantage.



* eg, when discussing their new flight tax proposals, Cameron kept remarking that how could it be right that it cost more to go by train by Glasgow than to fly? And therefore taxes were needed to normalise that cost. How many more hearts and minds might have been won had he argued that therefore it was important to invest in rail so that the price of a train ticket came down below that of an aircraft... ie why does all this stuff have to inevitably lead to prices/taxes going up? How about rewards for good behaviour, not punishment for bad?

I'm all up for taxation. The problem with reducing rail fares is the money has to come from somewhere else. Hence, tax flight and subsidise rail.

Talking economics, there is always going to be a price difference between Social Cost & Private Cost. Here is the theory of toll roads.

Let's assume there is society and traffic is a cost.

Traffic is measured in cars. One unit car.

If you are in a car you do not consider your self to be a cost to society.

If somebody is in a car in front of you then there is a social traffic cost to you +1.

However the social cost is your car and somebody else's car.

Social Cost of Traffic = Your Car + Somebody else's car

What this means is social cost will always be greater > than > your individual cost (measured in cars)

Hence to bring this model to equilibrium you would have to tax the individual and redistribute to society to have good economics.

 

[JTrader]

Daily Mail article - http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/march2007/140307Eco-Snoopers.htm

 

[Hook Shot]

Enviromental/Green/GHG/GW.................

Very clever.........well organised....very lucrative.............for those who can see the cogs moving.

When will they start pounding the table for Nuclear Power as The Solution ?

Smart Money knew this was coming a while back ........ hence the rocket in Climate Exchange plc (up over 1000%)....... but they're not done so after hearing Uncle Tony today or was is yesterday... I'm waiting for Nukes - to come to the fore........bigtime!

Big Money in Nuke investments....still........ but that's another story...

 

[Splitlink]

India says that it needs to increase its fuel consumption four fold by 2020 to continue its growth.

Split

 

[JTrader]

Enviromental/Green/GHG/GW.................

Very clever.........well organised....very lucrative.............for those who can see the cogs moving.

When will they start pounding the table for Nuclear Power as The Solution ?

Smart Money knew this was coming a while back ........ hence the rocket in Climate Exchange plc (up over 1000%)....... but they're not done so after hearing Uncle Tony today or was is yesterday... I'm waiting for Nukes - to come to the fore........bigtime!

Big Money in Nuke investments....still........ but that's another story...

Thats one of the main things isn't it. At £20 billion, Trdent alone, will cost every man woman & child in the uk £333 each.

It's OK for the UK ( i won't use the term us) to have nukes though, but not anyone else.

The UK is a mess, run by criminals.