swingin' the ftse: 2009

Going to enter: 4375
Stop loss: 4345

Going to let it run, trailing stop below each swing low. Only hoping for 1:1 risk reward because i'm confident price will reach 4000. And my confidence should never affect my trades but oh well!
 
Going to enter: 4375
Stop loss: 4345

Going to let it run, trailing stop below each swing low. Only hoping for 1:1 risk reward because i'm confident price will reach 4000. And my confidence should never affect my trades but oh well!


If price reaches 4000, you will be out. You meant 4400 I suppose?

4400 is achievable but I think we might have to drop back very soon into the low 4200's if NY falls back on profit-taking. Yesterday's Dow power spike looks isolated.
 
If price reaches 4000, you will be out. You meant 4400 I suppose?

4400 is achievable but I think we might have to drop back very soon into the low 4200's if NY falls back on profit-taking. Yesterday's Dow power spike looks isolated.

200 MA 4420 eesh. was hell bent on getting there. us markets not going past highs yet. however we havent pulled back eeeeenuff for me to be completely confident holding this short off the tops.
 
Although we had a weak finish yesterday and the Dow closed down, we're making up the lost ground today. US bank stress test relief rally?

On a more general note, I am looking at ways of combining TA of the FTSE100 and the Dow or S&P. We will have all seen the FTSE close up, suggesting we should be long, only for a weak NY finish to counter the bull signal that evening, leaving us hung out to dry as London drops immediately next morning. I'd be glad to have anyone's thoughts on this experiment - Print the last month's Dow candlestick chart onto a transparency and overlay it onto the FTSE chart on-screen for the same period. Shift the Dow transparency a half-day to the right to allow for the time difference. Don't worry about vertical scale, move the transaprency up or down as needed. This gives you two candlesticks per 24 hours. Does this help you confirm the FTSE performance signalled for the next day?

(PS - Beware of Sharescope US charts this week - they have bunged in Wednesday's performance twice so there is an extra day's candlestick in this week)
 
On a more general note, I am looking at ways of combining TA of the FTSE100 and the Dow or S&P. We will have all seen the FTSE close up, suggesting we should be long, only for a weak NY finish to counter the bull signal that evening, leaving us hung out to dry as London drops immediately next morning. I'd be glad to have anyone's thoughts on this experiment - Print the last month's Dow candlestick chart onto a transparency and overlay it onto the FTSE chart on-screen for the same period. Shift the Dow transparency a half-day to the right to allow for the time difference. Don't worry about vertical scale, move the transaprency up or down as needed. This gives you two candlesticks per 24 hours. Does this help you confirm the FTSE performance signalled for the next day?
Do you mean like this Tom?

FT is brown/grey candles - DJ is yellow/dark grey candles. It's 24 hr data btw. I'll make you a market hours version if that would help.

I can't read it myself - let me know what you make of it though.


Next fib extension is also 4600 for FTSE btw guys.
 

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Geofract - Yes, that is it. You have slid the overlay to the right to replicate the time overlap between London and NY.

I find the overlay has to be free to slide vertically until it makes a sensible pattern. This gives the chart a third dimension of course so hard to replicate in a 2D screen image. It would be nice if we had another type of chart for this purpose, especially for us FTSE traders - it makes no sense to trade the FTSE using blinkers to see only London's prices, when what happens in NY for the 5 hours after we close can have such big influence.

My first idea actually was to normalise the FTSE and Dow daily OHLC values say to a combined 10,000pt scale and re-plot a resolved single candlestick for both onto a new chart, but its too much work and mathematical accuracy isn't the point here, its tomorrow's market direction I want to identify.
 
tomo/geo

just back from a few weeks in madeira (i see ftse gone into swing uptrend and you should all be locked into a long from about 3960 or so after the retracement)

On the ftse/dow thing, i think it's a bit more complicated than trying to do it via overlap charts since you also have to consider what dow futures have done overnight (after dow close). It's probably better to use figures.

I quite simply use the SB dow quote (which will be proxy dow during dow open and a proxy based on dow futures afterwards). ie:

1. ftse close 4000 when dow is 8000
2. dow (proxy futures) the next morning at ftse open 8100 therefore ftse should open 4050 (2pts dow = 1pt ftse)
3. say ftse opens at 4010 - rather than the "forecast" 4050 - then it is likely to play catch up and move up towards the 4050 level ASSUMING dow holds at the 8100 level. The dow will, of course, move but - in this catch up phase - ftse is likely to exaggerate (on a relative basis) dow up moves and be reluctant to follow dow down moves.
4. Keep your eye on the dow - it's only rarely that it doesn't lead.

good trading

jon
 
Jon et al – I understand the concept here and barjon’s explanation but my question is: how would you trade this?

If, like me, you’re spread betting then surely the SB price would already be showing 4050 on the open, effectively pricing the move in.

Not being a CFD expert from a pricing point of view, would the opportunity come from the fact the CFD process ‘lags’ the SB price so giving an opportunity to trade the gap as it closes?

On another topic: has anyone been on Marc Rivalland’s course?
 
tca

the SB company will be adjusting their "ftse" prices to the opening they anticipate prior to open. If they get it wrong they'll adjust to nearer the real thing immediately after the open - usually when they are "phone only" so you can't trade it!!!! This morning, for example, they (or mine, anyway) opened at 4448 and then knocked off 20 or so points before you could turn round.

What I was saying wasn't about trading on the open (even if you can), more about helping determine the initial direction that tomo was talking about.

good trading

jon
 
My first idea actually was to normalise the FTSE and Dow daily OHLC values say to a combined 10,000pt scale and re-plot a resolved single candlestick for both onto a new chart, but its too much work and mathematical accuracy isn't the point here, its tomorrow's market direction I want to identify.

Is this is of any interest Tom? I have overlayed the FT/SP/DJ into relative percentage values - SP is blue/grey candles. DJ is green/red candles. FT is dark grey/grey candles. This is easily done with the 'compare security' feature in Pro-realtime - and it's free for EOD data.

Actually I don't think it answers your conondrum, but I'm posting it anyway :) SP relatively speaking, leading the way.

Thanks Jon for the comments btw.
 

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Morning all.

I think there is real value in pursuing ways of drawing FTSE action 'tomorrow morning' from FTSE and US action 'today'.

Jon - I recognise what you say about the futures market as an 'intra-night' factor driving the SB quotes when NY has closed. I have totally banned myself from setting SB stops or orders when London is closed as the SB quotes are so unpredictable when compared only with the underlying indices. I cancel stops overnight (heresy I know) or set them many hundreds of points out so they cannot possibly be hit - if not I will be taken out every night. I restore sensible stops or orders when London re-opens.

Geo - Looks like a nice programme (I had registered but never got to grips). I am always in doubt as to whether its Dow or S&P that drives. Possibly its a joint effort, but I am hoping that the FTSE is the back seat passenger who occasionally points out the window and says 'we should be going that way'.

There is an issue with SB FTSE quotes tracking the Dow after the FTSE closes. That was an early lesson for all of us I am sure in how to set a sensible stop only to find next day it was hit before bed-time. So, if Dow goes up 100pts after 1630, we should see the FTSE rise 50pts next morning, but the SB quote is probably already there - marginal profit only on the over-shoot. I bet we have all seen the FTSE open high after a strong NY evening session, over-shoot and bring a modest profit, then fall back by late morning and hit all sell stops, only to rocket as the Dow opened and built up on its strong previous close in the pm/evening. Frustration all round.

What might be a worthwhile target would be when the FTSE closes showing potential trend changel, the Dow does likewise or shows neutral but does not actually start its move. Look at the FTSE 28/04 - a weak day in an uptrend with an unusally narrow range but a relatively strong Close compared with intra-day range, suggesting bear power weakening. This pre-cursor pattern was not negated by the NY Close, where the day resembled a doji in a downleg in an uptrend, and the US indices showed no major upward move that evening. So it would have been easy to take a long position on the FTSE at a price well below the previous Close, and leading to a potential 90+pts next day alone. Got more points fom this one move than several previous week's scalping attempts.

I don't know a name for this trans-Atlantic ready, steady, go view (can't call it a strategy yet) using twin pre-cursors but I am looking out for it occurring again, as long as it follows the underlying trend.
 
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Morning all.

I think there is real value in pursuing ways of drawing FTSE action 'tomorrow morning' from FTSE and US action 'today'.

Jon - I recognise what you say about the futures market as an 'intra-night' factor driving the SB quotes when NY has closed. I have totally banned myself from setting SB stops or orders when London is closed as the SB quotes are so unpredictable when compared only with the underlying indices. I cancel stops overnight (heresy I know) or set them many hundreds of points out so they cannot possibly be hit - if not I will be taken out every night. I restore sensible stops or orders when London re-opens.

Geo - Looks like a nice programme (I had registered but never got to grips). I am always in doubt as to whether its Dow or S&P that drives. Possibly its a joint effort, but I am hoping that the FTSE is the back seat passenger who occasionally points out the window and says 'we should be going that way'.

There is an issue with SB FTSE quotes tracking the Dow after the FTSE closes. That was an early lesson for all of us I am sure in how to set a sensible stop only to find next day it was hit before bed-time. So, if Dow goes up 100pts after 1630, we should see the FTSE rise 50pts next morning, but the SB quote is probably already there - marginal profit only on the over-shoot. I bet we have all seen the FTSE open high after a strong NY evening session, over-shoot and bring a modest profit, then fall back by late morning and hit all sell stops, only to rocket as the Dow opened and built up on its strong previous close in the pm/evening. Frustration all round.

What might be a worthwhile target would be when the FTSE closes showing potential trend changel, the Dow does likewise or shows neutral but does not actually start its move. Look at the FTSE 28/04 - a weak day in an uptrend with an unusally narrow range but a relatively strong Close compared with intra-day range, suggesting bear power weakening. This pre-cursor pattern was not negated by the NY Close, where the day resembled a doji in a downleg in an uptrend, and the US indices showed no major upward move that evening. So it would have been easy to take a long position on the FTSE at a price well below the previous Close, and leading to a potential 90+pts next day alone. Got more points fom this one move than several previous week's scalping attempts.

I don't know a name for this trans-Atlantic ready, steady, go view (can't call it a strategy yet) using twin pre-cursors but I am looking out for it occurring again, as long as it follows the underlying trend.



Heres something that might interest you

I lost 290 FTSE points trading spreadbets on the FTSE after 5pm this week.

I will not be doing that again.
 
...........Jon - I recognise what you say about the futures market as an 'intra-night' factor driving the SB quotes when NY has closed. I have totally banned myself from setting SB stops or orders when London is closed as the SB quotes are so unpredictable when compared only with the underlying indices. I cancel stops overnight (heresy I know) or set them many hundreds of points out so they cannot possibly be hit - if not I will be taken out every night. I restore sensible stops or orders when London re-opens..........

.


tom

yeah, I do the same if holding overnight.

I've been playing the ftse/dow for almost a year now. Basically, I log the relative prices each 15mins to see if ftse is trading strong (better than 1 pt for 2) or weak (worse than 1 pt for 2) against the dow. If ftse is trading strong I look for longs and vice versa if weak.

No point, of course, looking for longs if everything is dropping like a stone even if ftse is showing strong reluctance to follow dow down but, if ftse has been so reluctant, it will likely outstrip any dow bounce. I suppose you could say I do my TA on the dow but trade it on the ftse (if you see what I mean :confused:)

good trading

jon
 
Jon, TA on the Dow, trade on the FTSE is right: after midday, the FTSE is a derivative (of the Dow).

Bad luck Mr Finley - especially when the FTSE only moved 218 from Friday Close to Friday Close. I see on your blog you were very bearish at the start of the week, is loss down to trading belief rather than TA, or something less obvious?
 
Jon, TA on the Dow, trade on the FTSE is right: after midday, the FTSE is a derivative (of the Dow).

Bad luck Mr Finley - especially when the FTSE only moved 218 from Friday Close to Friday Close. I see on your blog you were very bearish at the start of the week, is loss down to trading belief rather than TA, or something less obvious?

well im in the wrong thread for starters as i put through a lot of trades a day.

I thought this week have a go at the aftermarket... wrong.

basically in the day i made profit not a problem. (going long and short)

come 5pm and i found my system (scalping according to my indicators) didnt work at all.

so lesson learned. i will only trade in market hours.
 
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