Brexit and the Consequences

[Atilla]

Britain’s excruciating embrace of Donald Trump shows how little independence it has gained from Brexit

Leaving the European Union means the country has less, not more, control over its circumstances

Trump is very much a rough diamond.

The British establisment can teach him much, educating him in the way of good diplomacy, etiquette and protocol.

Polish him a trifle to make him a well rounded close to perfect human being that he perceives himself to be.



The article is correct in its meaning however and this very argument was put forward by both Kenneth Clarke and Michael Heseltine that UK is better able to project a global role within the EU than it could outside.

With Trump coming to power the whole special relationship role was so overworked based on what Trump said before , it all looks embarrassing to me.

UK simply trying too hard.

As for trade, compared to our Exports to EU US is considerably less significant for the UK and I can't imagine what else we can buy from US that we don't already.

Mind boggles.

Transporting junk food thousands of miles to help kill off our citizens.

People may trumpet it as success but it's more like UK shooting her self in the foot if not in the head.

One hopes common sense will prevail and they'll see the error of their ways. All hype and no substance.

 

[counter_violent]

My understanding is that the Eurovision negotiations look likely to be a major sticking point of Brexit. Apparently, the UK government want full and unfettered access to the competition but Brussels are adopting punishment mode and will require a very large financial contribution (approaching billions – that's the word going round well informed political journalists at the moment) to even consider ongoing participation.

Westminster rumours say that this is causing considerable difficulty for the Labour Party who are entirely split on the issue. The shadow chancellor says that he would borrow the money if it was up to him and Diane Abbott will only support that if we have a 100% ethnic minority entry.

The Scot Nats are wanting a judicial review regarding our participation (they have serious City of London fund manager financial backing) and are insisting that this is a major factor in persuading the Supreme Court that we should remain.

The Greens say that the only way to ensure participation is to build more wind farms and the Lib Dems are saying that their support for the Eurovision contest is the key for their return to power.

Several people I spoke to in the street today basically said they couldn't give a $hit.

 

[dbphoenix]

British Alignment With Trump Threatens European Order

As American allies across Europe and Asia brace for President Trump, Britain stands out for the degree to which it is proceeding as if little has changed.

The country, consumed with managing “Brexit” and its associated domestic political dramas, appears to have taken relatively few steps to prepare for the geopolitical earthquakes that Mr. Trump could bring to the international and European orders on which Britain relies, and that his proposals would undermine.

“The people at the top of our system, whether they’re politicians or officials or journalists or think tankers like me, we’re all totally focused on Brexit,” said Charles Grant, who heads the London-based Center for European Reform. “We haven’t thought about Trump as much as we should have.”

It is possible that Prime Minister Theresa May, by throwing in her lot with Mr. Trump, could ride out any changes to the international order. But if that approach does not succeed, it could have severe consequences both for her nation and for the world that Britain plays a role in keeping together.

 

[sminicooper]

British Alignment With Trump Threatens European Order

As American allies across Europe and Asia brace for President Trump, Britain stands out for the degree to which it is proceeding as if little has changed.

The country, consumed with managing “Brexit” and its associated domestic political dramas, appears to have taken relatively few steps to prepare for the geopolitical earthquakes that Mr. Trump could bring to the international and European orders on which Britain relies, and that his proposals would undermine.

“The people at the top of our system, whether they’re politicians or officials or journalists or think tankers like me, we’re all totally focused on Brexit,” said Charles Grant, who heads the London-based Center for European Reform. “We haven’t thought about Trump as much as we should have.”

It is possible that Prime Minister Theresa May, by throwing in her lot with Mr. Trump, could ride out any changes to the international order. But if that approach does not succeed, it could have severe consequences both for her nation and for the world that Britain plays a role in keeping together.

It certainly does seem a quirk of the alignment of the planets that Brexit and Trump have now come together. Who would have thought it likely 12 months ago? Isn't it usually the Black Swan events that cause the biggest earthquakes?

 

[dbphoenix]

It certainly does seem a quirk of the alignment of the planets that Brexit and Trump have now come together. Who would have thought it likely 12 months ago? Isn't it usually the Black Swan events that cause the biggest earthquakes?

Not really. It stems from a fundamental misunderstanding of what "populism" means combined with a global inability to come to grips with "what to do" about the ME situation, which in modern times is almost entirely the responsibility of the US, shared to at least some extent by the UK, specifically its oligarchs and their greed. Combine all that and simmer and you have the basis for a widespread resurgence of right-wing radicalism. Nothing really Black Swan about it except to those who never imagined that the UK would be foolish enough -- in their estimation -- to exit the EU.

 

[sminicooper]

Not really. It stems from a fundamental misunderstanding of what "populism" means combined with a global inability to come to grips with "what to do" about the ME situation, which in modern times is almost entirely the responsibility of the US, shared to at least some extent by the UK, specifically its oligarchs and their greed. Combine all that and simmer and you have the basis for a widespread resurgence of right-wing radicalism. Nothing really Black Swan about it except to those who never imagined that the UK would be foolish enough -- in their estimation -- to exit the EU.

So if it was so obvious and could be derived from common sense observation, why didn't somebody pick it up ? Seems like a black swan to me!

 

[dbphoenix]

So if it was so obvious and could be derived from common sense observation, why didn't somebody pick it up ? Seems like a black swan to me!

We have been, ever since the invasion of Iraq. Granted the UK is/was the joker in the deck re the current situation, but the UK is not necessarily a terribly important factor in the rise of white supremacy. The immigration issue merely provided those responsible for the 2007/08 recession with a convenient scapegoat.

 

[sminicooper]

Brexit & Trump

"Brexit and the advent of Donald Trump are modern western culture’s equivalent of communism’s Berlin Wall moment"

Interesting article in the Spectator magazine http://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/01/...-correctness-just-had-its-berlin-wall-moment/

I'm very much inclined to agree

 

[counter_violent]

"Brexit and the advent of Donald Trump are modern western culture’s equivalent of communism’s Berlin Wall moment"

Interesting article in the Spectator magazine http://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/01/...-correctness-just-had-its-berlin-wall-moment/

I'm very much inclined to agree

I expect we will just have to carry on exposing nonsense and calling it for what it is.

 

[counter_violent]

When gov't and institutions get to the point where their preoccupation and concern is all directed toward minority interests, then you know for sure they have lost the plot. UK has been on this slippery slope for decades, so has the US. Events like Brexit and the election of Trump (others will follow) are a way of re-setting the game for the (usually) silent majority.

 

[dbphoenix]

When gov't and institutions get to the point where their preoccupation and concern is all directed toward minority interests, then you know for sure they have lost the plot.

Our preoccupation and concern is with protecting minority interests. That is a characteristic of our republic, one which distinguishes it from democracies which ride roughshod over minority interests. And one which we regularly forget.

 

[Atilla]

When gov't and institutions get to the point where their preoccupation and concern is all directed toward minority interests, then you know for sure they have lost the plot. UK has been on this slippery slope for decades, so has the US. Events like Brexit and the election of Trump (others will follow) are a way of re-setting the game for the (usually) silent majority.

What minority interests are you referring to.

Recent growth showed following skewed growth.

The services sector grew 0.8% between October and December, while industrial production was flat and construction edged up 0.1%. Within production, manufacturing posted a strong gain of 0.7% mainly due to pharmaceuticals exports, which tend to be erratic, but this was offset by a sharp drop in oil production caused by a change in timing of maintenance in a North Sea oil field. Agriculture returned to growth, of 0.4%, after three quarters of decline.


Just to be clear, are you referring to the City and Financials as minority interests.

Any hit on the City will really screw up HMRC tax revenues, BoP exports and aggregate UK economy in a major way.


Decline of the Northern industry and manufacturing power house is not a minority problem nor one of EU's making.

Whole country is rambling off political clap trap as if they know what they are talking about and every tom dick and harry voting for it.

Cut your nose off to spite your face comes to mind.

 

[counter_violent]

Our preoccupation and concern is with protecting minority interests. That is a characteristic of our republic, one which distinguishes it from democracies which ride roughshod over minority interests. And one which we regularly forget.

I'm not so much arguing that minority interests should not be protected, but when all the special interest groups relentlessly keep on pushing the envelope, you end up in a situation where the silent majority asks themselves the question, what the f is going on ! There is usually no dialogue between the silent majority, except when the opportunity to register their dissatisfaction presents itself. Combine this phenomena with oppressive establishment elites telling them what they cannot say and do and you create the perfect storm.

It sends a clear signal to all those in power, that they need to wake up and get a grip of themselves. Helps them to focus their minds on the issues that are important for the majority. May understands perfectly what the silent majority want and so far her message is very much in tune.

 

[dbphoenix]

I'm not so much arguing that minority interests should not be protected, but when all the special interest groups relentlessly keep on pushing the envelope, you end up in a situation where the silent majority asks themselves the question, what the f is going on ! There is usually no dialogue between the silent majority, except when the opportunity to register their dissatisfaction presents itself. Combine this phenomena with oppressive establishment elites telling them what they cannot say and do and you create the perfect storm.

It sends a clear signal to all those in power, that they need to wake up and get a grip of themselves. Helps them to focus their minds on the issues that are important for the majority. May understands perfectly what the silent majority want and so far her message is very much in tune.

You're recycling Nixon/Agnew with the "silent majority" stuff. The mythical silent majority is nothing more than a mechanism for advancing the right-wing agenda. Effective, but mythical.

 

[counter_violent]

You're recycling Nixon/Agnew with the "silent majority" stuff. The mythical silent majority is nothing more than a mechanism for advancing the right-wing agenda. Effective, but mythical.

I hardly think the Brexit voters could be described as "right wing" or in support of a right wing agenda.

Neither do I think that Trump supporters are right wing. They are just ordinary folks who want their leaders to govern their country properly.

Both May and Trump have iterated that the power goes back to the people.

The people will ensure this happens....they are watching developments very closely.

 

[dbphoenix]

I hardly think the Brexit voters could be described as "right wing" or in support of a right wing agenda.

Neither do I think that Trump supporters are right wing. They are just ordinary folks who want their leaders to govern their country properly.

Both May and Trump have iterated that the power goes back to the people.

The people will ensure this happens....they are watching developments very closely.

Brexit voters may be everything you say they are, though from what I've read, they aren't. Nonetheless, Trump voters are very much right wing. As to where the power is going, it's going to the oligarchs and plutocrats on an almost daily basis.

 

[Atilla]

Tim Farron just pointed out TMs quick visit to tickle Trumps tummy smacks of desparation. Not far from the truth.

That hand holding stuff hasn't gone down too well either. Reminds me of Ragan's staged hand behind Gorbachov back to help support him up the White House steps.
When in fact it was Ragan old and frail.


My personal view is that Trump has benefited more from the British gilded touch of Theresa May. Especially, even more so in light of recent US developments.

Analysts looking at trade deals do not see much increase or gains for either side at the moment.


Southern EU Leaders Seek Stronger Ties as Trump Stokes Tension

Leaders of the European Union’s southern nations called for stronger bonds in the bloc after U.S. President Donald Trump stoked trade tensions with Mexico.

“If there’s something that’s clearer today than it was before the U.S. elections, it’s that more than ever the world needs a strong and united Europe,” Portuguese Prime Minister Antonio Costa told reporters Saturday after a meeting of seven national leaders in Lisbon.

I agree with this pov made by the Portuguese PM.


What is the UK doing right now? Where is she headed?

 

[counter_violent]

Instead of governing in the country's best interests, they waste time governing in their own interest. Parasites the lot of them.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38816692

 

[counter_violent]

Things are hotting up nicely over in France.

Dirty tricks departments have gone into overdrive.

On One side we have the EU machine trying to reclaim money paid out for an aide to Le Pen.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-38821074

On the other side we have anti corruption police looking into payments made to Fillon's personal aids (his wife and Two kids) I'm sure they were the best qualified for the roles and did an outstanding job.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-38813936

 

[Atilla]

Instead of governing in the country's best interests, they waste time governing in their own interest. Parasites the lot of them.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38816692

Let me guess, you thought our presses were unbaised and independent.

Tories have been very much in bed with Rupert Murdoch and his crews for yonks. Wake up. So Cameron calls in a favour and now he is a nobody this is released to make out the Daily Trash to be independent and working mans paper. You aving a laff. Right you are!

Carry on as you were after TM and the Daily Trash got slapped by the highest court in the land.