Brexit and the Consequences

[counter_violent]

I think you need to eat more walnuts.

NO I DON'T THINK THAT AT ALL.

Obviously you have trouble comprehending the written word.

LEAVING THE EU - BREXIT IN NAME, IS NOT THE SOLUTION TO ALL OUR PROBLEMS!


I've said before and SC relates to it in kind, the issue is accumulation of wealth in the hands of the few and Conservative policies to pursue that process further by increased austerity and cut on public social services.

Brexit will only compound that ISSUE! Capitalism, based on Moggies and rest of Brexiteers BS lies on reducing corporate tax and turning the country into some safe haven of an island to attract illegal gains of all sorts of Russian and African billionaires.

You Northerner's must be really thick skinned if you don't see this.


Labour would be a better outcome for UK then Brexit or the Tory party that's for sure.


SC refers to Globalisation which is capitalism at its peak. To locate and utilise any resources, anywhere to maximise profits, minimise costs and pay as little or no tax as possible. Effectively multinational companies and gun ship diplomacy with US and UK going to great lengths to interfere in other countries political processes.


NO! EU is not the solution to our all our problems but nor is Brexit. It is a scapegoat orchestrated by BIGGEST MOANERS of them all Eurosceptic since the 70s after 2 referendums.

You B****ting guys really taking the biscuit.

You have wasted 3 years rubbishing Brexit. You also know that the decision to leave will not be reversed. You also know that there will not be another referendum. You also know that Brexit in name only will not fly.

All this wasted energy and none productive bluster will get you nowhere. Far better to change mindset, swap sides and make Brexit a success.

 

[Atilla]

You have wasted 3 years rubbishing Brexit. You also know that the decision to leave will not be reversed. You also know that there will not be another referendum. You also know that Brexit in name only will not fly.

All this wasted energy and none productive bluster will get you nowhere. Far better to change mindset, swap sides and make Brexit a success.

My wasted time and effort pales into insignificance compared to amount of time Brexit have cost Parliament and the British people in lost investment, time and effort addressing Nation's needs.

It is an uncharted precipice for which there has been no white paper or preparation for.


This is all ONE BIG FECKED UP scenario by POLITICIANS.

You are amazing with your judgements and interpretation of events or history for that matter.

 

[sminicooper]

Labour would be a better outcome for UK then Brexit or the Tory party that's for sure.

Eat more walnuts ??? More like a brain transplant - Even a dedicated Vinceophile surely can't believe that?

 

[Splitlink]

It’s not really about if the result is right or wrong, it’s about people voting and one side or another winning the vote. The losing side needs to campaign on a different tack, wait 40 years and then have another referendum.

Yes, I agree with you. More so because the country is so evenly divided. That, IMO, too, is why the Norwegian method would not work in the UK. The Norwegians are more in agreement with each other.

 

[Signalcalc]

Yes, I agree with you. More so because the country is so evenly divided. That, IMO, too, is why the Norwegian method would not work in the UK. The Norwegians are more in agreement with each other.

Is that not a better model?

 

[Atilla]

Eat more walnuts ??? More like a brain transplant - Even a dedicated Vinceophile surely can't believe that?

If I had to pick between Tory or Labour I'd vote Labour.

Tories and ultra neo con capitalists are root cause of our issues.

Whether its the banking crises,
Railways or other privatised monopolies
Skewed distribution of income
Lack of social public infrastructure

All messed up by Tory policies.

 

[Splitlink]

Is that not a better model?

It probably is--for them-- but it has been tailored to their way of doing things and there is not the same level of disagreement as in the UK.

The problem is typically British. Someone else's system is better than the one they have. It would be like having a suit that does not quite fit, so out come the scissors and a bit off here, and there.... Just like what is happening to Brexit, really.

 

[NVP]

lets face it guys .....2019 is going to be an annus horriblus for the UK and its citizens

ive given up worrying about what i believed in on voting day ...thats history .....now all im worried about is the bloody great crater our politicians (all of them) are digging for us .....like Nero fiddling whilst rome burns........

it dosnt need to be all doom and gloom post Brexit...........but the current batch of politicians across all the parties are not of the caliber to ensure we do prosper post exit .....and if they were the cross party (and in-party) arguing is killing us ...........we almost needed to treat this like a world War.........stop the arguments and pull together

in the Words of Robert Kennedy - "we live in interesting times"........

 

[NVP]

If I had to pick between Tory or Labour I'd vote Labour.

Tories and ultra neo con capitalists are root cause of our issues.

Whether its the banking crises,
Railways or other privatised monopolies
Skewed distribution of income
Lack of social public infrastructure

All messed up by Tory policies.

even i would vote Labour if i believed the party (and its leader) would get us out of the mire......but sorry - not with corbyn in charge.....

 

[counter_violent]

lets face it guys .....2019 is going to be an annus horriblus for the UK and its citizens

ive given up worrying about what i believed in on voting day ...thats history .....now all im worried about is the bloody great crater our politicians (all of them) are digging for us .....like Nero fiddling whilst rome burns........

it dosnt need to be all doom and gloom...........but the current batch of politicians across all the parties are not of the caliber to ensure we do prosper post exit .....and if they were the cross party arguing is killing us ...........we almost needed to treat this like a world War.........stop the arguments and pull together

in the Words of Robert Kennedy - "we live in interesting times"........

Yep and this has been mentioned before.

Too many MP's never previously had a proper job.
Too many MP's who are selected not for their skills and independent thought, but instead, they fit the activists agenda.
Too many MP's selected not on merit, but because they are female or of a certain ethnicity.

Finally, MP's have not needed to govern the UK because all the real decisions were taken by the EU. So it's going to take a long time to clear out all the dross and replace them with fine upstanding law makers and leaders.

 

[Atilla]

It probably is--for them-- but it has been tailored to their way of doing things and there is not the same level of disagreement as in the UK.

The problem is typically British. Someone else's system is better than the one they have. It would be like having a suit that does not quite fit, so out come the scissors and a bit off here, and there.... Just like what is happening to Brexit, really.

Yes agreed and indeed collectively we've done well from turning the country round post WWII changing the sick man of Europe into the 5th largest economy in the World.

Dissenters won't ofcourse accept that and the argument if we weren't in the EU we would be doing so much better is about farcical a lie without any substance or proof as Jiminy cricket and the flying Dumbo. Funny enough some believe Brexit will fly or that a brick can float. We all know brick's sink and planks float.

This is the whole sorry a55 with all this Brexit larky it's just so heavilly distorted by make believe hyped up promises, like children Brexiteers will believe in alternative reality.

 

[counter_violent]

Yes agreed and indeed collectively we've done well from turning the country round post WWII changing the sick man of Europe into the 5th largest economy in the World.

Dissenters won't ofcourse accept that and the argument if we weren't in the EU we would be doing so much better is about farcical a lie without any substance or proof as Jiminy cricket and the flying Dumbo. Funny enough some believe Brexit will fly or that a brick can float. We all know brick's sink and planks float.

This is the whole sorry a55 with all this Brexit larky it's just so heavilly distorted by make believe hyped up promises, like children Brexiteers will believe in alternative reality.

Thatcher changed the UK nothing to do with being members of the EU.
Trade with the EU has declined year on year. You can't argue with facts.

And i'm not going to tell you again. Any more of this nonsense and you can sit on the naughty step until you can behave.

 

[Atilla]

Thatcher changed the UK nothing to do with being members of the EU.
Trade with the EU has declined year on year. You can't argue with facts.

And i'm not going to tell you again. Any more of this nonsense and you can sit on the naughty step until you can behave.

EU is not declining just simply share of global market in % terms shifiting towards emergine economies.

EU is still our largest trading partner.

You still haven't learned anything about the numbers game but do really well with misleading statistics.


https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-britain-left-eu-european-union-referendum-uk

As emerging nations and the likes of BRIC nations grow obviously they'll eat into market share and we should expect to grow our share of trade with those countries.

However, leaving Brexit still makes no sense for those reasons. Germany does well exporting to China despite being in EU.


Brexit is not about the economics or jobs or rules and directives which we'll still need to adhere to if we want to sell into EU. It is about National Identity.

Even here, migration from EU only is 1/3 of total migration which half of is paid up foreign students studying here. Simply that some find jobs and stay working here. This is a bonus however, as we get to keep well educated and trained labour force, who are driven to succeed.


So for someone to talk about facts is really rich. Oh go on then. Take another Rich Tea Biscuit.

 

[Signalcalc]

SJW central

https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2018...derships-dismayed-reaction-to-trump-election/

 

[NVP]

Thatcher changed the UK nothing to do with being members of the EU.
Trade with the EU has declined year on year. You can't argue with facts.

And i'm not going to tell you again. Any more of this nonsense and you can sit on the naughty step until you can behave.

i am not a fan of what the european union costs or actually does..... believe me....

BUT - the main reason i also voted for remain was the anticipated train wreck that our government and bureaucrats would make of the exit and divorce process

project after project our public sector has proved what a f*ck up they make of even the simplest of things ..... i have worked and consulted inside some public sector organisations and witnessed the staggering ineptitude, commercial naivety and arrogance of senior management in their decisions and actions

the destruction of economic value and GDP to the uk economy since the decision is already at staggering levels and will continue to bleed until hopefully we get the chance to vote on staying......

what a waste of 2 years....jesus........

N

 

[Signalcalc]

i am not a fan of what the european union costs or actually does..... believe me....

BUT - the main reason i also voted for remain was the anticipated train wreck that our government and bureaucrats would make of the exit and divorce process

project after project our public sector has proved what a f*ck up they make of even the simplest of things ..... i have worked and consulted inside some public sector organisations and witnessed the staggering ineptitude, commercial naivety and arrogance of senior management in their decisions and actions

the destruction of economic value and GDP to the uk economy since the decision is already at staggering levels and will continue to bleed until hopefully we get the chance to vote on staying......

what a waste of 2 years....jesus........

N

To vote remain based on the belief that your government is incompetent and will make a hash of things if the decision went otherwise (which it has anyweay), seems to be an incompetent reason itself to base a vote on!

That's a blackmail vote, where the government has made you believe that they are so incompetent that if you vote them to do the thing that you know they are crap at doing (and they would admit to themselves also) it will be worse than voting for them not to change, that was called Project Fear.

"Vote for us and we'll continue to feed you the same crap, vote against us and we'll make it worse for you" ???

Beggars belief if lots of other remainers voted for that reason, maybe it explains why they are so angry, ultimately voting this way ensures that you end up with continued crap government and no change for the better.

Voting is the only opportunity you have to change things for the better, if you are not happy with the status quo, why would you vote to remain with the status quo, when ultimately, no-one know what the end result might be and there is a probability of it being better (if the present government wasn't so incompetent at enacting a better future for us)?

 

[tomorton]

To vote remain based on the belief that your government is incompetent and will make a hash of things if the decision went otherwise (which it has anyweay), seems to be an incompetent reason itself to base a vote on!

That's a blackmail vote, where the government has made you believe that they are so incompetent that if you vote them to do the thing that you know they are crap at doing (and they would admit to themselves also) it will be worse than voting for them not to change, that was called Project Fear.

"Vote for us snd we'll continue to feed you the same crap, vote against us and we'll make it worse for you" ???

Beggars belief if lots of other remainers voted for that reason, maybe it explains why they are so angry, ultimately voting this way ensures that you end up with continued crap government and no change for the better.

You're over-simplifying I think.

I personally voted Remain because our economy was doing well with EU membership and if Remaining turned out to be economically wrong, we could still withdraw later.

Although I opposed the political union that the EU is working towards, the likelihood of the UK ever agreeing to political union with Europe was unlikely anyway, so even a Remain majority vote would be unlikely to make this happen. However, I thought there was a possibility that political union might be economically very advantageous to the UK so voting Remain was again a lower-risk option.

 

[Signalcalc]

Although I opposed the political union that the EU is working towards, the likelihood of the UK ever agreeing to political union with Europe was unlikely anyway, so even a Remain majority vote would be unlikely to make this happen. However, I thought there was a possibility that political union might be economically very advantageous to the UK so voting Remain was again a lower-risk option.

So you voted remain on economic grounds, not because of incompetent government (incompetent before the vote and even more incompetent now)?

You voted remain because you think that remaining is better economically for us, despite the fact that you don't like the political integration, wether that happens or not, you're not fussed to much either way, as long as the economy is doing well all is rosy.

What if we remained and the economy collapsed or took a downturn, would you be kicking yourself that you had voted remain then or would you look for some other reason to blame, Trump?

You voted remain on the grounds that if it didn't work out, then we could vote to leave at a later date? I'm afraid that 'later date' is upon us already.

Just for the record, UKGov agreed to political union in 1993, that's what Brexit is opposed to and it's why UKGov has been trying to negotiate a trade deal ever since the refrendum.

We never had any referendum on the EEC as it was, nor the Maastricht treaty of 1992 for a political union, both of which are central to the EU.

It is the EU that will not allow economic integration without political integration and it is the reason why they won't negotiate, not us.

 

[tomorton]

So you voted remain on economic grounds, not because of incompetent government (incompetent before the vote and even more incompetent now)?

You voted remain because you think that remaining is better economically for us, despite the fact that you don't like the political integration, wether that happens or not, you're not fussed to much either way, as long as the economy is doing well all is rosy.

What if we remained and the economy collapsed or took a downturn, would you be kicking yourself that you had voted remain then or would you look for some other reason to blame, Trump?

You voted remain on the grounds that if it didn't work out, then we could vote to leave at a later date? I'm afraid that 'later date' is upon us already.

Just for the record, UKGov agreed to political union in 1993, that's what Brexit is opposed to and it's why UKGov has been trying to negotiate a trade deal ever since the refrendum.

We never had any referendum on the EEC as it was, nor the Maastricht treaty of 1992 for a political union, both of which are central to the EU.

It is the EU that will not allow economic integration without political integration and it is the reason why they won't negotiate, not us.

Yes, I decided to vote Remain on economic grounds, but with the assumptions I've stated as fall-back positions. Firstly that if Remaining was wrong economically we could leave the EU (or the EU would collapse anyway) later. We won't ever know the answer to whether it would have been economic suicide to remain in the EU, but the healthy state of our economy while having been members for so long suggests its would have been unlikely.

Secondly I might be wrong to oppose political union. Political union could possibly have been the only thing that would have kept us economically healthy at some point 50 years down the line: I would rather be in a prosperous province than an impoverished independent nation. But again, we'll never know the answer to this either.

I don't believe the UK government ever believed political union would be accepted by the UK population so they could sign whatever they liked, knowing it would never come to it.

 

[Signalcalc]

Yes, I decided to vote Remain on economic grounds, but with the assumptions I've stated as fall-back positions. Firstly that if Remaining was wrong economically we could leave the EU (or the EU would collapse anyway) later. We won't ever know the answer to whether it would have been economic suicide to remain in the EU, but the healthy state of our economy while having been members for so long suggests its would have been unlikely.

Secondly I might be wrong to oppose political union. Political union could possibly have been the only thing that would have kept us economically healthy at some point 50 years down the line: I would rather be in a prosperous province than an impoverished independent nation. But again, we'll never know the answer to this either.

I don't believe the UK government ever believed political union would be accepted by the UK population so they could sign whatever they liked, knowing it would never come to it.

And they say that assumption is the mother of all f@@ck-ups! To assume that lying politicians would extricate us from an economically failing union, when they have lied and deceived us on just about every point of foreign policy over the years is naive. And the Brexit process proves the point, UKGov and the EU have tried to play us with their faux negotiations, thinking that the British public believe the charade.

We would become debt slaves to the EU, just as Greece and Italy have become and soon-to-be Spain will.

Well they might be 48% correct I'd hazard a guess that it's less than 48% now.

How can we believe our government to be acting in our best interests, when they are withholding information from parliament regarding all sorts of issues, including foreign wars, EU military integration, immigration and foreign aid to name but a few. How can we believe our government when they buy and sell our personal data, to use in influencing our own, as well as foreign elections.

Look at what is happening to the EU across Europe, sovereign governments in disarray, pro-EU governments being voted out of office, why? Because they have been lying to their citizens for a long time, just as in the UK.

People are not happy with the Status Quo, the UK is either slow to wake-up, full of disbelief, or UKGov has done a really good job at maintaining the deception, I think it is a combination of all 3. On the other hand 52% have woken up and voted accordingly, voting in record numbers, it really matters to people that we leave the EU !

Why we are slower to wake up than our UK cousins is probably down to the conditioning we've had from birth that the UK are the most upstanding bastion of democracy and free speech in the world, unfortunately that has all been turned on its head and we are now the leader in anti-democracy, setting a bad example for the rest of the world.