Brexit and the Consequences

[counter_violent]

Hopefully the UK will stick to the guns and tell them to f...off

The Govt position has been stated previously. We will not commit to any payments to the EU until everything is agreed.

Barnier is adopting a completely stupid position by setting any deadlines for agreed payments ahead of settling everything else in the round. So in that regard, he can indeed go swivel.

The NHS is in crisis because funding has not kept pace with numbers using the service. The NHS wastes money by offering treatment to foreigners, who are supposed to pay the bill once treatment is complete. A good number of health tourists skip out after having used the service.
The Govt cannot fund the NHS to the desired level because the contributions from unskilled workers, inc migrant labour, are negligible. In fact, there is a very large demographic who are not paying sufficient in to the system and yet they have no qualms whatsoever about using up service provision. Lets not even get started on income top up and housing benefits.

All of this spending is supposed to come from taxes collected. Not enough of it does of course, they simply print more money to balance the books. Except the books never get balanced and the debt just keeps on rising.

Remoaners have been giving it all away for donkeys years. Talk about "wasters of other people's money"! Yet they are the first to complain when services are not available to them. Well, ya can't have it both ways!

 

[dbphoenix]

Nov. 11 (UPI) -- Pacific Rim partners, meeting without the United States, reached a new trade deal Saturday in Danang, Vietnam.

The remaining 11 trade ministers of the Trans-Pacific Partnership approved a trade agreement, which each country still needs to sign and ratify. The group was renamed the Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership after U.S. President Donald Trump pulled out of the world economic order.

A word to the wise: pay attention.

 

[sminicooper]

You won't be surprised to learn dbp that I take the polar opposite view. The impossible negotiating position that the EU is in is plain for all to see and the cracks are starting to show. Look no further than Barnier's absurd and meaningless two week deadline. Big mistake. Massive. Huge. Oh, and funny too!

You would have thought that by now, the EU apparatchiks would have realised that once again they are dealing with the Brits who, if true to form will do everything in their power to stop themselves being done down unless undermined by Quisling politicians.

With UK leaving, the EU has a big (financial) problem and like all good socialists their only solution to fill the black hole (in addition to the printing press) is to extract more money from their constituency. Unfortunately there is a flaw in this cunning plan and the sooner they get to admit it the better. I have every expectation that de-radicalised ex-Remainer May is prepared to cough up a lot more of our money but even she, surely can't give in to the lackey-boy Barnier's ridiculous stance.

 

[counter_violent]

So I may judge your morals and weigh mine, what car do you drive Tomorton?

Let me guess. You don't drive a car as a rule. Perhaps you use the train or ride a bike in the vain hope that this somehow makes you morally superior

Anyone moralising from the degenerate capital of the UK, should be ignored.

 

[Atilla]

Let me guess. You don't drive a car as a rule. Perhaps you use the train or ride a bike in the vain hope that this somehow makes you morally superior

Anyone moralising from the degenerate capital of the UK, should be ignored.

I do have a car and drive about 2000m per year but that is often to help out with people in need like my dear mother or other people some with learning disabilities where I need to drive...

My bike is probably worth more than my car and I do about 5000+m pa on that for my main job.

Nuff about me. I was more wondering what car Tomorton drove and whether I might be tempted to have a joy ride in it with out his kind permission.


You Northerner referring to Brighton as the degenerate capital of the UK and in the same sentence proceed to give lectures on morals. You've certainly have got big big cheeks. :cheesy:


You really are out performing your self in all areas sparky. Scholar and a gentlemen, you are neither. From the gutter wannabee pretender who's joined the Conservative party for that superficial air of b0ll0cks you ooze so much. Disgraceful

 

[counter_violent]

I do have a car and drive about 2000m per year but that is often to help out with people in need like my dear mother or other people some with learning disabilities where I need to drive...

My bike is probably worth more than my car and I do about 5000+m pa on that for my main job.

Nuff about me. I was more wondering what car Tomorton drove and whether I might be tempted to have a joy ride in it with out his kind permission.


You Northerner referring to Brighton as the degenerate capital of the UK and in the same sentence proceed to give lectures on morals. You've certainly have got big big cheeks. :cheesy:


You really are out performing your self in all areas sparky. Scholar and a gentlemen, you are neither. From the gutter wannabee pretender who's joined the Conservative party for that superficial air of b0ll0cks you ooze so much. Disgraceful

I'm very even handed, I believe all politicians are a shower of sh1t, barring the odd exception.
As for joining any political party. There's more chance i'd start my own before joining one.

 

[counter_violent]

You would have thought that by now, the EU apparatchiks would have realised that once again they are dealing with the Brits who, if true to form will do everything in their power to stop themselves being done down unless undermined by Quisling politicians.

With UK leaving, the EU has a big (financial) problem and like all good socialists their only solution to fill the black hole (in addition to the printing press) is to extract more money from their constituency. Unfortunately there is a flaw in this cunning plan and the sooner they get to admit it the better. I have every expectation that de-radicalised ex-Remainer May is prepared to cough up a lot more of our money but even she, surely can't give in to the lackey-boy Barnier's ridiculous stance.

I could do with some help from like minded people who think that our govt should be held accountable. Signing the petition is one thing but to get it to a wider audience requires networking and promotion.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/200606

The EU started off negotiations in desperation mode, but is now venturing into the absurd. They just don't quite realise yet that they have been rumbled.

 

[counter_violent]

Who needs a deal !

http://yourbrexit.co.uk/news/breaki...ted-eu-bigwig-barnier-over-two-week-deadline/

 

[timsk]

. . . My bike is probably worth more than my car and I do about 5000+m pa on that for my main job . . .

Atilla - is this you?

 

[sminicooper]

10 points of view from James Dyson

James Dyson on the BBC Marr programme this morning:

1. “the time has come” for the United Kingdom to walk away from the European Union without a Brexit deal."
   
   
2. “I don’t think it is the Government’s fault, I think the problem is the people we are negotiating with. "
   
   
3. “I think they are demanding billions and billions to leave is quite outrageous. And demanding it before we have negotiated anything is outrageous. "
   
   
4. “I would walk away, I think that is the only way to deal with them. "
   
   
5. “I have been dealing with the EU and the EU countries for the last 25 years, on IEC standards and energy labels and all that kind of thing, there’s no way to deal with them, you have to walk away. "
   
   
6. “If you walk away they’ll come to us because they want to export all their products to us. They will come back to us. "
   
   
7. “We are in a very very strong position, incredibly strong position. We shouldn’t give them any money, we should just walk away and they will come to us.”
   
   
8. “We have tried very hard, we have been very reasonable. They have been incredibly unreasonable,” he said."
   
   
9. “I think it is now the time, the time has come to walk away.”
   
   
10. “There is fantastic opportunity outside Europe, there is an opportunity within in Europe, but Europe is the slowest growing area in the world, all the other areas are much fast growing.”

 

[Pat494]

The less competent EU leaders are still in the past with their ideas of political control of the members. However when it comes to a problem like Catalonian independence they are stumped. They just say it is Spain's problem.
Funny how the independence politicians flee to Brussels for sanctuary. It would suit the Federalists at the top of the EU for the individual member countries to break down to their states. These states will be much easier to control from Brussels( Berlin) being smaller and weaker than National Govts.

 

[sminicooper]

The less competent EU leaders are still in the past with their ideas of political control of the members. However when it comes to a problem like Catalonian independence they are stumped. They just say it is Spain's problem.
Funny how the independence politicians flee to Brussels for sanctuary. It would suit the Federalists at the top of the EU for the individual member countries to break down to their states. These states will be much easier to control from Brussels( Berlin) being smaller and weaker than National Govts.

Don't forget that Belgium itself is a divided nation with a long history of differences between the Flemish and French communities. Interestingly Brusssels (the city) has a joint Flemish/French community and presumably the Spanish political refugees feel safer there?

 

[Atilla]

Atilla - is this you?

View attachment 248082

Yes it is and I'm not surprised you found me. I'm always been chased by the paparazzi you know as well as news crews for my expert opinion on Brexit.

I've had the pleasure of delivering catch of the day fish to Robert Preston recently along with my opinions for him to read out and here is a pic from one of my early morning deliveries just for you squire

 

[sminicooper]

Yes it is and I'm not surprised you found me. I'm always been chased by the paparazzi you know as well as news crews for my expert opinion on Brexit.

I've had the pleasure of delivering catch of the day fish to Robert Preston recently along with my opinions for him to read out and here is a pic from one of my early morning deliveries just for you squire

........ So, you're secretly employed by the media then? Now THAT could explain a lot about why so many of them are Remainers.

 

[Atilla]

James Dyson on the BBC Marr programme this morning:

1. “the time has come” for the United Kingdom to walk away from the European Union without a Brexit deal."
   
   
2. “I don’t think it is the Government’s fault, I think the problem is the people we are negotiating with. "
   
   
3. “I think they are demanding billions and billions to leave is quite outrageous. And demanding it before we have negotiated anything is outrageous. "
   
   
4. “I would walk away, I think that is the only way to deal with them. "
   
   
5. “I have been dealing with the EU and the EU countries for the last 25 years, on IEC standards and energy labels and all that kind of thing, there’s no way to deal with them, you have to walk away. "
   
   
6. “If you walk away they’ll come to us because they want to export all their products to us. They will come back to us. "
   
   
7. “We are in a very very strong position, incredibly strong position. We shouldn’t give them any money, we should just walk away and they will come to us.”
   
   
8. “We have tried very hard, we have been very reasonable. They have been incredibly unreasonable,” he said."
   
   
9. “I think it is now the time, the time has come to walk away.”
   
   
10. “There is fantastic opportunity outside Europe, there is an opportunity within in Europe, but Europe is the slowest growing area in the world, all the other areas are much fast growing.”

Ok for all you smarty pants out there dissing cussing and rubbishing self serving vested interests here are few facts re: Mr Dyson (and Lord Bamford re:JCB) for your eyes.

In 2000 he said it would be "suicidal" for Britian not to join the euro. By all means google and verify to all those in shock. FXX please do the honours.

Why the change? Well he lost a legal challenge with the EU on labelling rules. He changed his mind in 2014 about the Euro.


Same goes for JCB and Lord Bamford who was fined £39.6m for price discrimination and breaking anti-competition rules selling machinery at different prices between different countries but furthermore preventing customers buying from cheaper suppliers. Lord Bamford became very frustrated and anti-EU after 6 year legal battle which he lost. Who can blame him for turning against the EU?


Both these are no brainers to me. Anti-competitive and anti-consumer practices with companies not wishing to adhere to higher standards. What ever you think of labelling one would think it's just academic but as with most people a bit of money and power gives them Trump like Godliness.

One other point, collapse of the pound whilst raising prices and destroying jobs for most of us, will help Mr Dyson's sales with the rest of the World. No self interest but just national interest and Sovereignty drives Mr Dyson. OR so he claims.


Perhaps someone should ask what changed Mr Dyson's view about wanting UK to adopt the Euro and whether his just a sore loser with a boil under his skin that needs a blue flame torch to extinguish. :idea:

 

[sminicooper]

Ok for all you smarty pants out there dissing cussing and rubbishing self serving vested interests here are few facts re: Mr Dyson (and Lord Bamford re:JCB) for your eyes.

In 2000 he said it would be "suicidal" for Britian not to join the euro. By all means google and verify to all those in shock. FXX please do the honours.

Why the change? Well he lost a legal challenge with the EU on labelling rules. He changed his mind in 2014 about the Euro.


Same goes for JCB and Lord Bamford who was fined £39.6m for price discrimination and breaking anti-competition rules selling machinery at different prices between different countries but furthermore preventing customers buying from cheaper suppliers. Lord Bamford became very frustrated and anti-EU after 6 year legal battle which he lost. Who can blame him for turning against the EU?


Both these are no brainers to me. Anti-competitive and anti-consumer practices with companies not wishing to adhere to higher standards. What ever you think of labelling one would think it's just academic but as with most people a bit of money and power gives them Trump like Godliness.

One other point, collapse of the pound whilst raising prices and destroying jobs for most of us, will help Mr Dyson's sales with the rest of the World. No self interest but just national interest and Sovereignty drives Mr Dyson. OR so he claims.


Perhaps someone should ask what changed Mr Dyson's view about wanting UK to adopt the Euro and whether his just a sore loser with a boil under his skin that needs a blue flame torch to extinguish. :idea:

Interesting ......... And of course, Dyson did shift all of his manufacturing jobs out of the UK. I wouldn't be at all surprised that many entrepreneurs like him have an "interesting" past. Despite all that, I think he's right about our negotiating stance with the EU.

 

[Atilla]

Interesting ......... And of course, Dyson did shift all of his manufacturing jobs out of the UK. I wouldn't be at all surprised that many entrepreneurs like him have an "interesting" past. Despite all that, I think he's right about our negotiating stance with the EU.

The point remains why some of you would disregard Mark Carney's words and yet hold these other souls in so much higher regard?

If you ask the man on the street how this effects his day to day living he'd be wondering about which end to scratch before he opens his gob. Much like others here he'll say some rubbish about the NHS.

Cost of NHS tourism - non-payed services on non-domiciled bodies is approx £500m p/a. There is a quick fix of course, ID cards or NI number request. Cost of administering probably eat into that 500m too.

If the Government wanted to they can easily stop this but the gains are so negligible, it's debatable if it'll cost more to implement and incur additional costs in service delivery. Then there is all the money these NHS tourists bring into UK as well as shopping they take back when they leave on top of expenses incurred.

The same body who blames NHS tourists for bringing down service quality conveniently ignores 1m more pensioners over the age of 75 with an aging population and falling social service budgets which cost billions. As people live longer age related debilitating illnesses like dementia and alzheimer's are on a rapid rise, consuming more resources.

On the other hand, the number of applicants for nursing positions from EU has fallen by 18%. Hiring costs to fill vacancies are rising.

People who distort costs and benefits at best are foolish, mindless numpties... At worst people will die on trollies and perhaps so they should die for their country, now that they have become a burden that can not be maintained with current tax revenues.

Get your calculators out and do the maths. Where have I heard that before?

 

[dbphoenix]

At worst people will die on trollies and perhaps so they should die for their country, now that they have become a burden that can not be maintained with current tax revenues.

And so Soylent Green . . .

 

[barjon]

James Dyson on the BBC Marr programme this morning:




..........[*]“We have tried very hard, we have been very reasonable. They have been incredibly unreasonable,” he said.........

Funny how these things are always seen from the particular chair you happen to sit in. The negotiations are deadlocked, their intransigence is described as “incredibly unreasonable”, our intransigence is described as “very reasonable”.

Accordingly to the Sunday Times we’re about to offer £60 billion - round 1 to the EU if that’s true.

 

[Splitlink]

Funny how these things are always seen from the particular chair you happen to sit in. The negotiations are deadlocked, their intransigence is described as “incredibly unreasonable”, our intransigence is described as “very reasonable”.

Accordingly to the Sunday Times we’re about to offer £60 billion - round 1 to the EU if that’s true.

Jon, I'm a Remainer but have a deep suspicion of anything that the media offers us.

£60 billion is, certainly, more than Timsk and his Band of Merry Men were thinking of offering. They, probably, think that there is a zero too many in that assessment.

It is similar to the story we were told about paying 360 million per week to the EU. It appears that that was gross. The net amount, after deducting what the EU returned in subsidies, is around half that sum.

Who's right? As you say..it depends on the armchair in which one is sitting .