Tottenham Riots

[DionysusToast]

So you know what we have all known for years. The cause. This is the effect.

The cure is fairly easy. Brute force and ignorance. Its been, and still is, done in other countries.

The cause is not the economy or politics, although that is a part. It is apathy and greed and that goes back much farther than Blair. Its going to take the stick at school, which is what I got. But more than that, its going to give teachers the authority from society that they do not have today because kids. really, are the cruellest sector of the human race. They have to be moulded into the kind of citizen that society wants them to be.
If they are not, then they will, in turn, become the parents of completely uncontrolable kids. That is what has happened now. This lot of ******s, as you describe them, will take decades to get rid of, just as our WWII nazis are dying out, now, and they still leave seeds behind.

That's as I see it, anyway.

This isn't effect - this is opportunism

I remember the riots at the Villa Cross, Handsworth. Starts off as a little scuffle, then all the wide boys come out...

... not because they know what started it
... not because they want to make a political statement
... not because they care
... it's the free telly and a bit of a fight, innit

Seriously - that's what you are seeing now. Just that in the days of Handsworth, we didn't have the mass communication means we have now.

These guys are the same type of people that fight at the football & look how long that's been going on.

Some people like a ruck. In these situations, there is a very high chance that they will get away with a lot of violence & thievery.

Opportunism.

 

[jthetrader]

Tell you what Jthetrader. You really do need to learn a couple of things:

1 - What a 'strawman' argument is and why that isn't an insult.
2 - The reason that Pablo Escobar was bombing shopping centres - which was NOT to cement his position as a cartel boss. Go figure.
3 - The fact that pimps sell protection to prostitutes and the person who they are then protected against is the pimp themself. There is no protection from the punters.
4 - Why the US govt or amyone else bombing someone does not make it right for another person. See strawman argument, point 1.
5 - Why stuff about Iraq is irrelevant. See point 1.

Tell you what.

1- I know what they are.
2- I conceded that he did some bad things. Can we agree on Escobar? And what does Escobar have to do with the average crack/heroin dealer in Britain today?
3- Yeah there is
4- You're accusing me of going off-topic when you're talking about Che Guevara and 'card carrying liberals', not to mention personal attacks. WTF does any of that have to do with this?
5- I was just assuming you agreed with the war on Iraq as you have, incorrectly, assumed I am a Che Guevara admiring liberal.

Now - you argue that a drug dealing yardie scumbag needs a gun to protect himself from other crack dealers. This is not true. The drug dealing yardie scumbag will get the same protection if he stops dealing and gets a job in McDonalds. Still, that wouldn't be 'fair' would it?

No, he's just selling a product and making more money than he could do almost anything else given his probable lack of education.

As for you preferring a drug dealer to a burglar. I sincerely doubt you've come across the types of drug dealers in question. Perhaps the guy selling you weed and LSD in University but not some gun toting, woman beating, tweaked out Yardie from Brixton.

I don't buy drugs, I don't sell drugs, I've never used drugs. Understand?

Gun-toting, woman beating, tweaked out Yardies in Brixton do not bother me in the slightest. They are getting on with their business without bothering me. Burglars, on the other hand, necessarily bother innocents.

Methinks you'd have a change of mind if you came across one.

No. I don't have any intention of hanging around with them, if I were forced into their company I'm sure I would get what I would expect; a scumbag. I am not saying they are good people, I'm saying that if you don't use drugs you don't have to worry about how good or decent they are.

 

[jthetrader]

Bring in the army. Shoot the thieving little turds.

Sun Tzu said, "Kill one, frighten ten thousand". I tend to agree.

These kids need to do a stint in Afghanistan. They'll all get community service orders though, so we can continue flogging a dead horse trying to turn a subhuman into a human. Can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

 

[counter_violent]

Sun Tzu said, "Kill one, frighten ten thousand". I tend to agree.

These kids need to do a stint in Afghanistan. They'll all get community service orders though, so we can continue flogging a dead horse trying to turn a subhuman into a human. Can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

What makes you think the armed services would want them !

If they were forced to join up £ to a penny they would be dissapeared by their own side.

 

[redart]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14458424

 

[Pazienza]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14458424

Did you see the other one looting Debenhams and saying she was getting her taxes back?

 

[counter_violent]

Just pathetic isn't it.

"Just showing the rich people we can do what we want"

 

[DionysusToast]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14458424

This totally proves my point.

A couple of dumbass girls pissed on stolen wine with absolutely no fncking clue what they are talking about.

Just a pair of opportunists.

Come on - does anyone believe these two idiots are somehow disenfranchised? Did you hear them talk about the guy that got shot at all?

Thanks you Redart. This makes my point more eloquently than I could.

Still - I am sure the liberal fringe will be along justifying their actions any time now.

 

[DionysusToast]

Just pathetic isn't it.

"Just showing the rich people we can do what we want"

Yes - those "business owners" - the *******s!

It's because of them we actually have to keep up the appearance of looking for work instead of just kicking back in our free house smoking B&H and drinking Thunderbird.

 

[Atilla]

Just pathetic isn't it.

"Just showing the rich people we can do what we want"

Isn't this the same mentality as the rich person thinking they can do what ever they want?

Remember Jeffrey Archer - the great Lord in contempt of court. Poor hooker who suffered in his hands had all sorts of abuse hailed against her. I believe she also got cancer too.

Just the other side of the coin.

Is it possible that one of the causes of these incidents lie in the inequitable distribution of income, alienation and participation in society. Exclusion versus inclusion.

Social deviant rejects...

 

[Hotch]

Did you see the other one looting Debenhams and saying she was getting her taxes back?

As if she paid any taxes to start with.

 

[Hotch]

Isn't this the same mentality as the rich person thinking they can do what ever they want?

Remember Jeffrey Archer - the great Lord in contempt of court. Poor hooker who suffered in his hands had all sorts of abuse hailed against her. I believe she also got cancer too.

Just the other side of the coin.

Is it possible that one of the causes of these incidents lie in the inequitable distribution of income, alienation and participation in society. Exclusion versus inclusion.

Social deviant rejects...

Exactly, the poor might go around burning the city to the ground, but the rich give people cancer...

 

[DionysusToast]

Isn't this the same mentality as the rich person thinking they can do what ever they want?
.

Yup.

People whose morality is based entirely what they think they can get away with.

Morally bankrupt opportunists.

As opposed to the majority who contribute to society and do what's right & wrong because of what is right & wrong.

These people are not victims any more that Archer was.

Is it possible that one of the causes of these incidents lie in the inequitable distribution of income, alienation and participation in society. Exclusion versus inclusion.

Nope - you went off track there.

This is not societies fault. It is no-one's fault. It's just faulty, selfish people with low IQs.

 

[Atilla]

Exactly, the poor might go around burning the city to the ground, but the rich give people cancer...

Rich take what they can just like the poor - what ever they can get away with.

Think Politicians and amount of expenses they can claim.

In fact think every other fat cat, their expenses bonuses and salaries and pensions. Even when they should be fired.


People see what they want to...

 

[Pazienza]

People see what they want to...

You certainly do...

 

[Atilla]

In fact of all those politicians who claimed for **** they shouldn't have how many have been locked up?

How about that guy who made up his own rules about building an island paradise for ducks in his rear estate with tax payers money?


Don't see you DT making so much noise about opportunism for these rich gits who don't even need to steal.

Own up - you guys not being fair? Should I be using the word equitable???

 

[bbmac]

The 'rich' trashed our society metaphorically speaking and now the poor and disenfranchised resort to violence too. This underclass has been growing for years and precious little attention has been paid to it by the political classes. They have generally had poor parenting, poor education, poor housing, poor or no jobs, and poor prospects and so have little to lose by being caught up in the events we have witnessed.

Real incomes even for the middle classes haven't moved much in real terms over the last 30years whilst the rich and super rich have powered ahead. What stops the squeezed middle classes from such behaviour is a better education, that they aspire to be be the rich/super rich, and probably more importantly that have more/something to lose.

Cameron talked of the full force of the law being applied - yeh right that'll scare them - the law has no force, and they know it...like all the other instruments of state it has lost it's potency. Neccessarilly the stick should be waived hard to restore order. But where is the carrot ?

 

[DionysusToast]

Rich take what they can just like the poor - what ever they can get away with.

Think Politicians and amount of expenses they can claim.

In fact think every other fat cat, their expenses bonuses and salaries and pensions. Even when they should be fired.


People see what they want to...

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooo no no no no no....

See what you are doing? Being a lefty. You have just made a huge, wide sweeping statement about wealthy people without any basis other than what you read in the Daily Mail.

You have done this because the wealthy must be to blame and the poor 'had it ever so bad'. Please see the comments on Che Guevara and the reason people like you admire him, despite knowing nothing about him. There is a glamorous elevator pitch for Che - "ooh all the poor Cubans were being exploited by US coporations and he kicked them out". Given a choice, it would be interesting to see what all the Cubans would have preferred going back in time (especially the ones Che killed/had killed).

There are plenty of rich people that are productive members of society that are not sociopaths. The thing is the sociopaths make the headlines.

Both rich people and poor people can be sociopaths. The people in the streets right now are not necessarily poor sociopaths.

 

[Pazienza]

In fact of all those politicians who claimed for **** they shouldn't have how many have been locked up?

How about that guy who made up his own rules about building an island paradise for ducks in his rear estate with tax payers money?


Don't see you DT making so much noise about opportunism for these rich gits who don't even need to steal.

Own up - you guys not being fair? Should I be using the word equitable???

I think this thread is about the riots. What have MPs' expenses got to do with it? Or do two wrongs make a right now?

 

[DionysusToast]

Don't see you DT making so much noise about opportunism for these rich gits who don't even need to steal.

You suppose that might be because they aren't currently burning down half of the UK? :whistling