Terrorism

[Atilla]

I haven't read the news but the Turks did warn them some time ago and the Russians said that it would not happen again.

So, Hollande is going to Moscow and, now, this happens! Whose side is anyone on?

All this, is what Isis wants, of course.

ISIS does as they are told. They are nothing but a mosquito on a camels ar5e imo.

Turks wouldn't be able to move without US support. Interesting to note Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov has canceled his visit to Istanbul tomorrow.

Back in October Iranian commander was also killed in Syria.

This is basically, pressure mounting on Assad. Remove Iranian troops from Syria and now to get Russian air support out. Build a case for war by outraging Western public against ISIS to go in in the name of stopping civilian war, restoring peace and democracy whilst ousting Assad.

Once a democratic Western government is established, build couple of pipelines out to the Aegon sea.


Also, makes sense why a deal was reached with Iran as a sweetener for further isolating Russia. Made no sense bringing in more oil supplies for sale when oil prices dropped so much. However, falling oil prices further hurts and isolates Russia as Iranian support for Russia and Syria will mean loss of oil markets.


I can't see this escalating as logistically, Russia will be entering another Afghanistan type scenario imo. Gold and Oil have hardly budged since the incident so risk is still off imo.

 

[Splitlink]

Russia is doing what it always does. Pushing for weak spots and retreating in the face of resistance.

Isis is doing what it can do best. Terrorism and trying to get the major powers to fall out with each other.

It goes to show how a major incident can happen. This time, it seems to be manageable, but Russia makes a habbit of flying into airspasce. The British and Portuguese know about that.

 

[Pat494]

How far would the terrorists have got if the US gun lobby had their way over here ? Maybe 20 dead instead of 170+. Should anyone be allowed to carry weapons on the street or just those that have undergone psychological and weapons training i.e. licenced ?

Wasn't it some do-gooding Govt. that disarmed the nation a few years ago. Now only criminals, police and terrorists have guns. The rest of us are gunned down like sheep.

Just heard on the radio it took armed police a whole hour to storm the Paris theatre where so many were murdered. If some suitable people had been carrying concealed handguns a lot of lives could have been saved. The politicians don't trust people enough to legalise them I suppose.

 

[Mr. Charts]

Jeremy Corbyn thinks he is the original JC and wants to turn the other cheek with terrorist attacks.
He would have appeased Hitler so as not to hurt any Germans.....and would have ended up as the puppet leader of Little Britain on the fringes of the Germanic 1000 year Reich.
Now he would, for a short time, be the public face of the Islamic State of Britain, a far flung outpost of the caliphate.......until they put his head on a lamp post in Westminster.

 

[Pat494]

Jeremy Corbyn thinks he is the original JC and wants to turn the other cheek with terrorist attacks.
He would have appeased Hitler so as not to hurt any Germans.....and would have ended up as the puppet leader of Little Britain on the fringes of the Germanic 1000 year Reich.
Now he would, for a short time, be the public face of the Islamic State of Britain, a far flung outpost of the caliphate.......until they put his head on a lamp post in Westminster.

They give us no choice but to try and defend ourselves.
Corbyn waving the white flag is a disgrace.

 

[Pat494]

Officials in Iraq's north say they've found a mass grave containing the remains of over 100 people killed by "Islamic State." It's said to be the sixth such find near Sinjar since the town was retaken from the group.

At least 113 members of the Yazidi minority were found in the bomb-rigged grave about 10 kilometers (6 miles) from Sinjar, district chief Mahma Khalil said Saturday. He said the victims appeared to have been shot dead in mass executions.


"Islamic State" (IS) overran Sinjar in August 2014, sending thousands of Yazidis fleeing into the mountains. Many also stayed behind, where the militants subjected them to enslavement, rape and execution. IS considers Yazidis, who follow a religion that predates Islam, as apostates deserving of death. The United Nations has described the attack on the Yazidis as a possible genocide.

Khalil said the grave site was booby-trapped with a number of bombs, which had to be defused by experts. It is yet to be properly excavated.

A local woman who escaped from the militants two months ago told German news agency DPA that she expected her male relatives' bodies to be found there.

"The day that they occupied our village...they took all the men, young and old alike, to the valleys nearby and we heard heavy gunfire for several minutes," she said. "They came back with bloodstains on their clothes and they took us women and children to Tel Afar and then to Raqqa in Syria."

Sixth mass grave

The US launched airstrikes in Iraq on August 8, partly in response to the IS assault on the Yazidis in Sinjar. Since then, a US-led coalition of countries has conducted airstrikes across Iraq and in Syria in an effort to destroy the terror group.

On November 13, Kurdish forces and Yazidi units backed by coalition strikes drove IS out of Sinjar. Mahma Khalil told AFP the latest mass grave is the sixth to be discovered near Sinjar since the town was recaptured.

The bodies of up to 80 Yazidi women, aged between 40 and 80, were unearthed in another grave discovered in the area earlier this month. One official said the victims may have been executed because they were deemed too old to enslave.
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Sickening or what ? Do they deserve any mercy ? I think not.

 

[mike.]

Just to keeping everyone up to speed as regards the conflict in syria...

"In case you don't know what's happening in the middle east.

President Assad ( who is bad ) is a nasty guy who got so nasty his people rebelled and the Rebels ( who are good ) started winning ( Hurrah!).
But then some of the rebels turned a bit nasty and are now called Islamic State ( who are definitely bad!) and some continued to support democracy ( who are still good.)

So the Americans ( who are questionably good ) started bombing Islamic State ( who are bad ) and giving arms to the Syrian Rebels ( who are good ) so they could fight Assad ( who is still bad ) which was good.
By the way, there is a breakaway state in the north run by the Kurds who want to fight IS ( which is a good thing ) but the Turkish authorities think they are bad, so we have to say they are bad whilst secretly thinking they're good and giving them guns to fight IS (which is good) but that is another matter.

Getting back to Syria.
So President Putin ( who is bad, cos he invaded Crimea and the Ukraine and killed lots of folks including that nice Russian man in London with polonium poisoned sushi ) has decided to back Assad ( who is still bad ) by attacking IS ( who are also bad ) which is sort of a good thing?

But Putin ( still bad ) thinks the Syrian Rebels ( who are good ) are also bad, and so he bombs them too, much to the annoyance of the Americans ( who are good ) who are busy backing and arming the rebels ( who are also good).

Now Iran ( who used to be bad, but now they have agreed not to build any nuclear weapons and bomb Israel are now good ) are going to provide ground troops to support Assad ( still bad ) as are the Russians ( bad ) who now have ground troops and aircraft in Syria.

So a Coalition of Assad ( still bad ) Putin ( extra bad ) and the Iranians ( good, but in a bad sort of way ) are going to attack IS ( who are bad ) which is a good thing, but also the Syrian Rebels ( who are good ) which is bad.

Now the British ( obviously good, except that nice Mr Corbyn in the corduroy jacket, who is probably bad ) and the Americans ( also good ) cannot attack Assad ( still bad ) for fear of upsetting Putin ( bad ) and Iran ( good / bad) and now they have to accept that Assad might not be that bad after all compared to IS ( who are super bad).

So Assad ( bad ) is now probably good, being better than IS ( but let’s face it, drinking your own wee is better than IS so no real choice there ) and since Putin and Iran are also fighting IS that may now make them Good. America ( still Good ) will find it hard to arm a group of rebels being attacked by the Russians for fear of upsetting Mr Putin ( now good ) and that nice mad Ayatollah in Iran ( also Good ) and so they may be forced to say that the Rebels are now Bad, or at the very least abandon them to their fate. This will lead most of them to flee to Turkey and on to Europe or join IS ( still the only constantly bad group).

To Sunni Muslims, an attack by Shia Muslims ( Assad and Iran ) backed by Russians will be seen as something of a Holy War, and the ranks of IS will now be seen by the Sunnis as the only Jihadis fighting in the Holy War and hence many Muslims will now see IS as Good ( Doh!.)

Sunni Muslims will also see the lack of action by Britain and America in support of their Sunni rebel brothers as something of a betrayal ( mmm.might have a point.) and hence we will be seen as Bad.

So now we have America ( now bad ) and Britain ( also bad ) providing limited support to Sunni Rebels ( bad ) many of whom are looking to IS ( Good / bad ) for support against Assad ( now good ) who, along with Iran ( also Good) and Putin ( also, now, unbelievably, Good ) are attempting to retake the country Assad used to run before all this started?

So, now that you fully understand everything, all your questions are answered."

 

[tomorton]

Its good we keep a sardonic view of terrorism. Its tragic for the individuals and communities afflicted but it just isn't the global threat that the media likes to portray it as.

 

[Atilla]

Intensified coalition campaign in Syria improves jihadists' reconciliation prospects

 

[Splitlink]

Its good we keep a sardonic view of terrorism. Its tragic for the individuals and communities afflicted but it just isn't the global threat that the media likes to portray it as.

Unless it is checked, it will be,

Remember, they said the same about global warming. Now that it is too late all the UN can do is compromise.

I'm afraid that the US is right about this. The UN can't get its act together. Like the EU, there are too many menbers.

If Isis gets the bomb, it will use it, because it is suicidal. I'm thinking that, one day, a possible provider could be N.Korea but Russia has a lot of black market weaponry from Communist days and they were a nuclear power, then.

 

[Pat494]

Much more urgent than climate change I would suggest is getting rid of nuclear weapons before they get let loose by ISL, N.Korea, Pakistan , Iran etc.
It only takes one irresponsible power to sell them or the rogue scientists to make them, Just a matter of time. Apparently there is a Dr. Khan who has obliged so far.

 

[tomorton]

Agree with that Split, terrorist organisations can't be ignored and must be checked. I do support a hard line - so once a political organisation, which is what IS is, has adopted terrorism, they have signalled an end to talking: also it never makes sense that we should fight an enemy on one side of an invisible line but leave them alone on the other.

But even if IS did procure a nuclear bomb, and used it, or perhaps two, or even three, is that an end to free civilisation and human life on the planet? - no, of course not. We shouldn't fall into the thinking that use of one or two or three nuclear weapons would trigger a chain reaction that would end life on the planet.

But it would prompt not only the strongest united action against the terrorist organisation, but also its sponsor state - somebody has to build the bomb and provide the fuel. Terrorism is a self-defeating mechanism, the more "successful" it is, the more it is opposed.

 

[Splitlink]

All this is interlocking. Global warming, terrorism and the biggest problem of all-and probable cause of it all, IMO- too many people on the planet.

The world population was set to double by 2050. I think that that estimate, in 2000, is well over target today, in 2015. My question is, "What about the 50 years after that?" It does not bear thinking about and it is just around the corner.

 

[mike.]

If human beings had the sense 2-300 years ago to ban all religion what would the world be like today ? The odd conflict over land ownership ? some scuffles outside football matches ? there would be little else to go to war over.

 

[Pat494]

If human beings had the sense 2-300 years ago to ban all religion what would the world be like today ? The odd conflict over land ownership ? some scuffles outside football matches ? there would be little else to go to war over.

Nothing wrong with peaceful religion. In fact an inspiration to many. It is the extremists who need brain washing.
I see Star Wars has spawned a Jedi religion almost. The present stuff is unbelievable.

 

[Pat494]

All this is interlocking. Global warming, terrorism and the biggest problem of all-and probable cause of it all, IMO- too many people on the planet.

The world population was set to double by 2050. I think that that estimate, in 2000, is well over target today, in 2015. My question is, "What about the 50 years after that?" It does not bear thinking about and it is just around the corner.

Don't worry, when anti biotics cease to work in about 5 - 10 years, the death rate will increase dramatically.

 

[mike.]

Nothing wrong with peaceful religion. In fact an inspiration to many. It is the extremists who need brain washing.

Take northern ireland for example, two so called peaceful religions, Even though the troubles/killings have stopped ( or, not reported as much ) They will never be at peace or get on together, They pick it up at a early age and so the cycle continues...

 

[tomorton]

IS is a political movement. This is about power and money. So few "religious" conflicts have been about theological differences but a religious brand to a cause is a great way to bind your supporters to it.

 

[Atilla]

Religion is tribalism at it's base level.

Human's are territorial and something needs to bind them.

That binding process can be anything; skin colour, location, religion, thought process; those who lots versus those who have not much, language and even something as basic as the colour of a football shirt in a friendly competition. Anything goes. That's how survival is coded in to our DNA. Beat anything that is different to a pulp if survival is endangered. Pure physical mechanics. Flags to human beings are what red rags are to bulls.

People want to believe their religion is the peaceful one when all it is, is just another instrument for differentiating humans. Kill all pagans, blasphemers and burn witches.

And so the wheel of life turns.

As for terrorists, they are sponsored by us all in kind.


Our officials and diplomats are terrorists but they aren't perceived that way. It's called the business of intelligence. Manipulate governments to our national interest. They say "look here, if we didn't do this sort of thing someone else surely will".

Margaret Thatcher's son was a confirmed terrorist but who would stand up to say so? BBC coins a different phrase. It was a coup d'état attempt.

Goes into another country Equatorial Guinea to replace one President with another to gain preferential rights to vast oil and gas reserves. He was using mercenaries to over throw an elected government. Does he have to blow up and kill people to be considered a terrorist? Why does anyone need armed mercenaries to execute a business deal. Nicely glossed over.

Anyhow, problem here was he got too close and caught in the chain. Way to approach this sort of thing is to have many people in the middle who control and handle unpalatable aspects of conducting this sort business for you. So people at the top are squeaky clean but even more so like Bliar who is named as the "uniter of the faiths"... What a freaking joke is that?

I doubt there is anything in the World that can not be resolved by the free market pricing mechanism but tilting the tables to ones unfair advantage will always take place.

Calling it terrorism suits the agenda of those people who stand to gain. Right now that is all of us in terms of cheaper oil and gas.

Defence and intelligence industries need money and a common enemy. That used to be communism and guerrillas and now it's terrorists.

More innocent people have been killed in the US by slack gun control and even the police than by terrorists and if one looks at money spent per life it speaks volumes.

One wouldn't spend billions on a production line where the marginal return on investment was $0.0000000000001 would they?


:whistling


In summary, remember ISIS was forged by the West to destabilize Syria. They are working for Western & sunni interests. I do not believe the disinformation and deception that is spread as if we are the good guys.

It's just business but not in a free perfectly competitive and democratic world as we know it or like to declare so. More of a world we choose to create because it suits our nature and how we conduct business.

 

[tomorton]

I think we disagree on what's a terrorist.

....ISIS was forged by the West to destabilize Syria....
Where did you get this please?