Brexit and the Consequences

[counter_violent]

No wonder the Aussie government is broke.

But the tax payer cashed up if you know what I mean.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-38527042

Looks like the new system will be based on the UK model

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-38592391

As part of her excuse she uttered this, in response to the apartment purchase.

Ms Ley faced pressure over separate trips to the Gold Coast, where she purchased the A$795,000 (£473,300; $585,200) investment property in 2015 and attended New Year's Eve parties in 2013 and 2014.

She described the apartment purchase as an "error of judgement" that was "neither planned nor anticipated".


What does that mean then? She woke up One day and accidentally bought an investment apartment ! The mind boggles !

 

[sminicooper]

The money is in weapons. Krupp saw that more than a century ago. Unless and until that changes, look for more of the same.

And there are voices in the UK that despite disapproving of the vast amounts of money (i.e. funds which our government receives and can be spent on things like the NHS) this country makes from arms sales, fail to say what would replace it.

 

[Splitlink]

And there are voices in the UK that despite disapproving of the vast amounts of money (i.e. funds which our government receives and can be spent on things like the NHS) this country makes from arms sales, fail to say what would replace it.

Not the 10 billion saved by leaving Europe ,that's for sure, although, as someone has suggested, every little helps.

 

[counter_violent]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38608825

An interesting test for both Labour and UKIP

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoke-on-Trent_Central_(UK_Parliament_constituency)

 

[timsk]

Not the 10 billion saved by leaving Europe ,that's for sure, although, as someone has suggested, every little helps.

That "someone" was of course - me.
The idea that by leaving the EU and saving £10 billion is chump compared to the vast amounts wasted on defence is a straw man argument. Defence is a completely different topic and has very little do with Brexit. £10 billion saved is better than £10 billion wasted - surely there's nothing contentious about that!

I'm surprised at you Split' in dismissing such a large sum of money as if it were nothing, given that you are of a generation whose mantra is 'look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves'.
Tim.

 

[sminicooper]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38608825

An interesting test for both Labour and UKIP

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoke-on-Trent_Central_(UK_Parliament_constituency)

If Labour get trashed here and in the forthcoming Copeland by-election no doubt it will be because the voters "don't understand". I get the impression now that the moderates in the Labour Party are just sitting back and waiting for Corbyn to self-destruct himself and the party.

 

[Pat494]

That "someone" was of course - me.
The idea that by leaving the EU and saving £10 billion is chump compared to the vast amounts wasted on defence is a straw man argument. Defence is a completely different topic and has very little do with Brexit. £10 billion saved is better than £10 billion wasted - surely there's nothing contentious about that!

I'm surprised at you Split' in dismissing such a large sum of money as if it were nothing, given that you are of a generation whose mantra is 'look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves'.
Tim.

Talking of wasting £12billion that's what UK overseas aid costs us. A lot of it is syphoned off by corruption. Pakistan can use UK aid to pay for their social services and then spend more on their military. It would be better spent here on the homeless , filling in potholes etc. Even The Taliban benefit apparently. I don't suppose they are grateful though. Too many comfortably off MPs living in the leafy suburbs salvaging their consciences.

 

[sminicooper]

Talking of wasting £12billion that's what UK overseas aid costs us. A lot of it is syphoned off by corruption. Pakistan can use UK aid to pay for their social services and then spend more on their military. It would be better spent here on the homeless , filling in potholes etc. Even The Taliban benefit apparently. I don't suppose they are grateful though.

I'm always a bit puzzled by this overseas aid budget. We hear lots of stories about wastage – typically Pakistan having a space programme while we subsidise their poor etc. It's difficult to know what to believe when such stories are propagated by the likes of Daily Mail. On the other hand, the government propaganda machine (with virtually unlimited budget) seems to do very little to point out and justify the good stuff. At the same time we hear of (often politically motivated) charities whose executives receive very large remuneration which makes you wonder whether their interest is in a large pay packet or the welfare of their recipients. All this does is provide fuel to UKIP etc. and the truth gets lost in all the hyperbole. I'd really like to know what the real situation is.

 

[Splitlink]

That "someone" was of course - me.
The idea that by leaving the EU and saving £10 billion is chump compared to the vast amounts wasted on defence is a straw man argument. Defence is a completely different topic and has very little do with Brexit. £10 billion saved is better than £10 billion wasted - surely there's nothing contentious about that!

I'm surprised at you Split' in dismissing such a large sum of money as if it were nothing, given that you are of a generation whose mantra is 'look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves'.
Tim.

Will it be 10b paid in euros or dollars? Don't want pounds, thanks. Not yet, anyway. I do belong to another generation, Tim. It believed in value for money..

As I said. You have a better argument (I don't say good, just better) dealing with immigration or, simply by saying, I want to be bossed by Westminster, not Brussels. They know how they are going to spend that 10 billion...why, they havent got it yet and it's spent, already! UK will, probably, have a Labour government, by then, anyway. Something else to look forward to! Shades of Atlee, Wilson, Callaghan, Foot. Those were the days!

 

[sminicooper]

Will it be 10b paid in euros or dollars? Don't want pounds, thanks. Not yet, anyway. I do belong to another generation, Tim. It believed in value for money..

As I said. You have a better argument (I don't say good, just better) dealing with immigration or, simply by saying, I want to be bossed by Westminster, not Brussels. They know how they are going to spend that 10 billion...why, they havent got it yet and it's spent, already! UK will, probably, have a Labour government, by then, anyway. Something else to look forward to! Shades of Atlee, Wilson, Callaghan, Foot. Those were the days!

Split! Don't say things like that – if it gets that bad I'm coming over there to join you or else relocate to Trumpington.

 

[counter_violent]

Will it be 10b paid in euros or dollars? Don't want pounds, thanks. Not yet, anyway. I do belong to another generation, Tim. It believed in value for money..

As I said. You have a better argument (I don't say good, just better) dealing with immigration or, simply by saying, I want to be bossed by Westminster, not Brussels. They know how they are going to spend that 10 billion...why, they havent got it yet and it's spent, already! UK will, probably, have a Labour government, by then, anyway. Something else to look forward to! Shades of Atlee, Wilson, Callaghan, Foot. Those were the days!

Labour, the wilderness yrs, completely unelectable under comrade Corbyn, so we don't need to worry about that !

 

[counter_violent]

If Labour get trashed here and in the forthcoming Copeland by-election no doubt it will be because the voters "don't understand". I get the impression now that the moderates in the Labour Party are just sitting back and waiting for Corbyn to self-destruct himself and the party.

So if the Tories win in Copeland and UKIP win in Stoke, do you think Atilla will finally concede that Brexit means Brexit ?

 

[Splitlink]

Labour, the wilderness yrs, completely unelectable under comrade Corbyn, so we don't need to worry about that !

I won't be worrying about it!

 

[Atilla]

That "someone" was of course - me.
The idea that by leaving the EU and saving £10 billion is chump compared to the vast amounts wasted on defence is a straw man argument. Defence is a completely different topic and has very little do with Brexit. £10 billion saved is better than £10 billion wasted - surely there's nothing contentious about that!

I'm surprised at you Split' in dismissing such a large sum of money as if it were nothing, given that you are of a generation whose mantra is 'look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves'.
Tim.

You missing the point. Clearly.

If one country over a 70 year period spends 2.5 - 5% of GDP on weapons and another only 1% or less, which country do you think will have better infrastructure, service and provision for supporting its population?

 

[forker]

You missing the point. Clearly.

If one country over a 70 year period spends 2.5 - 5% of GDP on weapons and another only 1% or less, which country do you think will have better infrastructure, service and provision for supporting its population?

Unknown. Without showing how much is spent on that you can't assume based on spending elsewhere

 

[dbphoenix]

And there are voices in the UK that despite disapproving of the vast amounts of money (i.e. funds which our government receives and can be spent on things like the NHS) this country makes from arms sales, fail to say what would replace it.

Depends on the voices one listens to. Unless and until the oligarchs and plutocrats pay their fair share, the debt will continue to increase and the money will continue to be wasted, even under neofeudalism.

 

[timsk]

You missing the point. Clearly.

If one country over a 70 year period spends 2.5 - 5% of GDP on weapons and another only 1% or less, which country do you think will have better infrastructure, service and provision for supporting its population?

Hi Atilla,
On the contrary, I'm not missing the point at all. Unlike you, I'm sticking to it! What you are doing is attacking a straw man.

My simple, logical and uncontentious proposition is that it is better to save £10 billion year on year - rather than it is to waste it. I've never advanced an argument based on defence expenditure as that is not relevant to this discussion. So, for you to refute what I say based on weapons expenditure is fallacious. I'm not disputing the amounts spent on arms or the impact that that cost has on the economy - but that's got bu88er all to do with Brexit in general and our financial contribution to the EU in particular.
Tim.

 

[Atilla]

Unknown. Without showing how much is spent on that you can't assume based on spending elsewhere

Assume you have pot of money to be allocated to various departments.

NHS,
Education
Defense
Road
Council (Police, Fire, Roads)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_spending_in_the_United_Kingdom

Just imagine if instead of let's say 6%, UK spent 3%.

That'll mean 19bn could be spent on other areas.

Now multiply that by 70. :whistling


I would have thought this was a no brainer but obviously not.

With respect weapons industry and sale of weapons, this is a closed book but you can be sure most of the money goes to very skilled high tech industries.

Not what one would call consumer items or consumables. So we may be able to build a nuclear bomb, fired from under water, nuclear submarine, powered by a nuclear core, but when it comes to building cars and washing machines and even bicycles one gets not much.


What area would you like to compete and lead the world in?

 

[Atilla]

Hi Atilla,
On the contrary, I'm not missing the point at all. Unlike you, I'm sticking to it! What you are doing is attacking a straw man.

My simple, logical and uncontentious proposition is that it is better to save £10 billion year on year - rather than it is to waste it. I've never advanced an argument based on defence expenditure as that is not relevant to this discussion. So, for you to refute what I say based on weapons expenditure is fallacious. I'm not disputing the amounts spent on arms or the impact that that cost has on the economy - but that's got bu88er all to do with Brexit in general and our financial contribution to the EU in particular.
Tim.

Tim matey,

My repsonse was in return for you stating UK is financing Spanish road, infrastructure and other EU states with the 9bn p/a contribution.

What should be highlighted is, what's spent where, how and when, as Forker prescribes, otherwise you've just had a wet finger in the air moment and splurted out what went through your mind.

 

[forker]

What area would you like to compete and lead the world in?

Exporting experts