Brexit and the Consequences

[dbphoenix]

EU will not breakup. Brexit bringing EU even closer together. It's surprising they've united over a common stance against the UK. Hopefully, there may be some cracks in their lines.

It may crystallize what life will be like outside the EU if UK comes out worse. Just when global trade economies reviving again. One should not lose site of Opportunities or Threats.

Nor should one ignore one's Eastern border.

 

[dbphoenix]

The USA worked because English was the main language as was the majority of the religious elements. You can't make the same work when you have over 20 languages and different cultures.

Not exactly. The US began solely because the South was terrified of slavery being made illegal, as was the sentiment in England (slavery became illegal in England soon thereafter). But the North in all fairness wasn't too keen on slavery being made illegal either, considering the profits it was making in the slave trade. And if concessions had not been made to the Southern colonies with regard to overweighting Southern votes (due to the fact that negroes were considered to be only three-fifths of a person) in the form of the Electoral College, the US would likely not have happened at all.

 

[hhiusa]

Not exactly. The US began solely because the South was terrified of slavery being made illegal, as was the sentiment in England (slavery became illegal in England soon thereafter). But the North in all fairness wasn't too keen on slavery being made illegal either, considering the profits it was making in the slave trade. And if concessions had not been made to the Southern colonies with regard to overweighting Southern votes (due to the fact that negroes were considered to be only three-fifths of a person) in the form of the Electoral College, the US would likely not have happened at all.

The slave trade ended in Britain in 1807, but slavery did not (Trafficking was illegal, but owning a slave was not). In fact, the practice did not stop throughout the British Empire even after 1834 with the British Slavery Abolition Act. The practice of any form of slavery or indentured servitude, for the most part, ended in the 1800s in British colonies, but it was not formally illegal until 2009 in the UK.

Coroners and Justice Act 2009

 

[counter_violent]

So it is true after all, they need us more than we need them.
Well whooda thunk it !

So, they can forget all about these idle threats of no compromise, otherwise all we need do is withdraw our services and they go down hard and fast.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38582690

Carney should know. After all, he is an expert and he did save us from a fate worse than Brexit...bloody dreamer !

 

[forker]

So it is true after all, they need us more than we need them.
Well whooda thunk it ! [emoji38]

So, they can forget all about these idle threats of no compromise, otherwise all we need do is withdraw our services and they go down hard and fast.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38582690

Carney should know. After all, he is an expert and he did save us from a fate worse than Brexit...bloody dreamer !

Didn't doubt it for a second. I do find it interesting how the tune of some of these experts are changing.

 

[Splitlink]

Didn't doubt it for a second. I do find it interesting how the tune of some of these experts are changing.

They are adapting. They are chameleons and are only noticed when they speak. The ones that are quiet are the ones to worry about and you have lots.

 

[forker]

"Britain's finance industry drops demands for passporting after Brexit" - http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN14W00A

 

[Atilla]

Didn't doubt it for a second. I do find it interesting how the tune of some of these experts are changing.

His tune is not changing, he is merely doing his job.

He is a professional, outlining BoE views, forecasts and expectations.


"In the run up to the referendum we felt that it was the largest risk [to the economy]. There were a series of things that could have happened that would have had financial stability consequences. Of course having got through the night the day after the scale of the immediate risks around Brexit have gone down."

Mr Carney said as he said he was “surprised” that the economic slowdown that he forecast has not materialised.


I think many people were surprised and shocked yes. Same for Trump's election win. Nobody quite forecast the rate cuts, QE and promise of tax cuts and infrastructure spending promises. Billions of pounds and Trillions of dollars promised for the pipeline. Markets on both sides of the pond on highs but they are both propped up by more promises of money.

I also wonder, how much of an input No. 10 has on the pov he puts out. Yes BoE is supposed to be independent with an inflation target but at the same time dinners and meetings always there exchanging views and requests.

imo, Global economy becoming increasingly precarious with Brexit outcomes and Trump presidency as neither have any track record but great promises of much uncertainty.

Yep some of you knew it all simply because you voted that way. Wishing and wanting is not the same as delivering and eating your cakes.


We are still waiting...



PS. All members of the EU including Portugal, Spain, Italy, Ireland, France and Germany have benefited from the union greatly so. Suggestions UK made it happen with their contributions should post in the jokes section.

You may wonder why so many (over 2m) British have migrated to Spain buying up property, investing in business and there are even English builders out there serving the expat community. Just as migrant contribute to UK economy, these wealthy individuals contribute to the Spanish economy. Quite a few are retirees with Net Wealth to spend.


Think good and hard how Brexiters will choose to spend their 9bn? I'd hazard a guess and say they'll stick in what's called defense which means weapons to kill. They already spend much more than their European counterparts but you guys keep blaming others factors for our demise and sooner or later the light may dawn on you experts

 

[forker]

Sorry I almost forgot he is an expert.

 

[Atilla]

Sorry I forgot, UK benefited from the EU too. :cheesy:

Some people however, proclaim, it was the unions who brought down UK manufacturing and Maggie showed them their place and made us stronger since the 80s.

Rise of the UK had nothing to do with the EU which in fact held us back.

In fact the same people are now proclaim to support the working man by proposing to raise their wages. This is why the disenfranchised have kicked back here and across the pond!

Anybody would think Trade Unions were in Government.
Same goes for Trump.


Are you sure some of you chaps have a handle on the UK economy in developments since post WWII?

 

[timsk]

. . .However, if you think that Spain is getting all, or most of that, for all the services to run efficiently it makes me feel indignant, to say the least.

Fear not Split', I never said or even implied that Spain gets the lion's share of our EU contribution - so there's no need for you to feel in the least bit indignant.

We are not happy with European affairs, either. EU is nowhere near perfect. Maybe, you are right. It may break up, but it will not be without us having tried. I am very proud to be living with these people.

Just to emphasise a point I made earlier: I am not having a go at Spain. I love the place and I'd more than likely be living in Andalucía right now if only I could get my head around the lingo. As you will know, the Andalucian dialect is to Castilian Spanish what a drunk Glaswegian is to the Queen's English!
Tim.

 

[sminicooper]

So it is true after all, they need us more than we need them.
Well whooda thunk it !

So, they can forget all about these idle threats of no compromise, otherwise all we need do is withdraw our services and they go down hard and fast.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38582690

Carney should know. After all, he is an expert and he did save us from a fate worse than Brexit...bloody dreamer !

Yup! – I've had enough of the experts also. Plain old common sense seems to be serving us much better. But haven't we all learned (at our own expense of course) to ignore "experts" in trading and do our own thing? But at least Carney admits he was wrong – shame that the progenitors of Project Fear can't do the same.

 

[sminicooper]

The economic advantages for Germany of operating with an artificially low exchange rate (wonder what the Deutschmark/Drachma rate would be today - not parity I'd bet) are such that they'll probably be willing to spend a lot more before calling quits.

You're right. Excluding Germany, Britain’s contribution was more than the total net contribution of the 26 other EU states combined in 2015.




If we Brexit properly and don't fudge it, the Germans are going to have to dig very deep into their pockets.

 

[Pat494]

Yup! – I've had enough of the experts also. Plain old common sense seems to be serving us much better. But haven't we all learned (at our own expense of course) to ignore "experts" in trading and do our own thing? But at least Carney admits he was wrong – shame that the progenitors of Project Fear can't do the same.

With the current culture of flogging off our best companies I think we have a lot to worry about either in or out. The Green Investment Bank is currently on the asset stripping block of The City hyenas.-Why Mrs. May won't act I can't make out. Is she beholden to the brutes ? Or scared ?

 

[Splitlink]

Fear not Split', I never said or even implied that Spain gets the lion's share of our EU contribution - so there's no need for you to feel in the least bit indignant.


Just to emphasise a point I made earlier: I am not having a go at Spain. I love the place and I'd more than likely be living in Andalucía right now if only I could get my head around the lingo. As you will know, the Andalucian dialect is to Castilian Spanish what a drunk Glaswegian is to the Queen's English!
Tim.

I know you didn't, Tim. I was having a rant to the thread, in general, about the UK argument for leaving EU.

10 billion is chump change for a nation as wealthy as the UK, Tim. Every government project undertaken, these days, runs into the billions. I've mentioned a few, previously. One today. An experimental lagoon for wild life is to be developed in Wales. Just a little one. 1.3 billion., but if it works, another dozen will follow.

If Germany and UK are the main contributors to Europe, as a recent post points out, you can imagine how 10 billion is distributed to the other 26 countries.

A better argument is immigration, but I believe that that will be dealt with fairly soon.

Anyway, on to Glaswegians! I joined a ship in Glasgow, as a last year apprentice, to find that I was the only Englishman on board. A Londoner at that! I got used to the dialect and had a great time with them.

When I got home for my leave I heard my mum saying to dad, "Stop calling him, Jock."
and when I was on the tube, talking to a friend, a little girl said, in a loud whisper " 'E don't 'alf talk funny, don't 'e, mum?".

 

[hhiusa]

You're right. Excluding Germany, Britain’s contribution was more than the total net contribution of the 26 other EU states combined in 2015.

View attachment 233232


If we Brexit properly and don't fudge it, the Germans are going to have to dig very deep into their pockets.

That graph is very informative. Even Sweden with a population representing 1.3% of the EU population is the fifth largest contributor.

Teeny tiny little Malta is even carrying its own weight.

They say Ireland is no longer bankrupt, but it does not appear able to support itself. The EU is one giant hard-core socialist black hole.

 

[timsk]

. . .10 billion is chump change for a nation as wealthy as the UK, Tim. Every government project undertaken, these days, runs into the billions. I've mentioned a few, previously. One today. An experimental lagoon for wild life is to be developed in Wales. Just a little one. 1.3 billion., but if it works, another dozen will follow. . .

Hi Split',
£10 billion per annum year on year might be 'chump change' to you, but I'm sure our infrastructure, schools and NHS will be better off with it - rather than without it.

As for the project you mention, it's not a wildlife project, rather a prototype green energy project designed to generate 350 megawatts of power – enough to supply 150,000 homes with electricity which could be in operation by 2019. As you rightly say, if successful, then another dozen will follow costing around £15 billion. Or, to put it another way, around two years worth of payments to the EU. Given a choice between the two, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind as to which is the best use of the money!
Tim.

 

[hhiusa]

£55 million / day is not chump change just to be apart of system to support 26 other nations with huge corruption problems and human rights problems. Italy is considered the most corrupt country in western Europe.

That is a sufficient chunk of the NHS budget of £120 billion. That money should go toward the people of Britain.

 

[Atilla]

I know you didn't, Tim. I was having a rant to the thread, in general, about the UK argument for leaving EU.

10 billion is chump change for a nation as wealthy as the UK, Tim. Every government project undertaken, these days, runs into the billions. I've mentioned a few, previously. One today. An experimental lagoon for wild life is to be developed in Wales. Just a little one. 1.3 billion., but if it works, another dozen will follow.

If Germany and UK are the main contributors to Europe, as a recent post points out, you can imagine how 10 billion is distributed to the other 26 countries.

A better argument is immigration, but I believe that that will be dealt with fairly soon.

Anyway, on to Glaswegians! I joined a ship in Glasgow, as a last year apprentice, to find that I was the only Englishman on board. A Londoner at that! I got used to the dialect and had a great time with them.

When I got home for my leave I heard my mum saying to dad, "Stop calling him, Jock."
and when I was on the tube, talking to a friend, a little girl said, in a loud whisper " 'E don't 'alf talk funny, don't 'e, mum?".

You are 100% right Split.

9bn will not get them far at all. They also fail to appreciate just how much research funding UK gets and universities along iwth R&D is going to take a hit that's for sure.

Just wanted to add if anyone checks military spending, the UK has always spent considerably more than her European counterparts.

All military weapons have a certain shelf life and if not used they'll sooner or later expire. Moreover, rapid development of technology can render them useless/outdated not fit for purpose.

There is an absolute positive argument for a unified European army and one which will develop along with harmonized fiscal integration sooner or later.

http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy....-defense-spending-despite-economic-austerity/

This makes perfect sense and it will not be long when the funding and resources available to EU will outweigh anything UK can do on her own. Some people can't see this but it is only a matter of time.

This has also been the case since WWII. So if one calculates just how many billions have been wasted on death and destruction and metal instead of consumer health and well being and consumer products, the difference is indeed eye watering.

Outside of the Falklands war it's been a colossal waste of money. UK seems to continue with the same mentality along with the yanks but times are changing along with the threats and the challenges.

Some people yet to wake up and smell the coffee

 

[dbphoenix]

The money is in weapons. Krupp saw that more than a century ago. Unless and until that changes, look for more of the same.