Asian Coronavirus Outbreak

[Signalcalc]

No, I see real people whove died while trying to help the sick being insulted in pursuit of an agenda.

I don't like MSM very much either

 

[tomorton]

Ok guys, you got me beat.

The whole thing is a gigantic hoax, it’s just a fluey runny nose, no-one is dying from it ‘cos they would have died anyway (won’t we all), the figures are fiddled, hospitals are half empty, MSM is telling nothing but lies, no-one in officialdom has any integrity whatsoever, 99% of the assembled might of scientific and medical brains have been fooled, politicians around the world have joined together and nuked their economies, scared their citizens to death and joined a conspiracy to further some secret agenda. Yeah, right.

Blimey jon, you'd be paranoid too if everyone was trying to control your mind through 5G waves.

 

[David Knight]

Try not to confuse your conspiracy theories.

from wikipedia

'in 2007, Buttar was charged by the North Carolina Board of Medical Examiners with unethical treatment of four cancer patients.[6] The panel recommended that Buttar's "license be suspended indefinitely, but that the suspension be immediately stayed"

suspended and not suspended

Wiki doesn't tell us what the 'unethical treatment was'

because they know that for most people that is enough for them to conclude that

"He is a proven unethical and officially reprimanded physician" post #1872

he came to public attention in 2009 when he used chelation therapy on a woman named Desiree Jennings, who claimed to have lost her ability to walk or talk normally after receiving a flu shot.[1][4] He has been criticized for his use of chelation,[1] and for his use of intravenous hydrogen peroxide to treat cancer.[

hydrogen peroxide occurs naturally in the body according to WikI (last line first paragraph)

Chelation therapy is a medical procedure that involves the administration of chelating agents to remove heavy metals from the body.[1] Chelation therapy has a long history of use in clinical toxicology[2] and remains in use for some very specific medical treatments, although it is administered under very careful medical supervision due to various inherent risks

This flimsy rap sheet above now provides his credentials as an outside the mainstream/ medical group think, operator

He may be just expressing his opinions, or he may be controlled opposition like Icke.

 

[Signalcalc]

Ok guys, you got me beat.

The whole thing is a gigantic hoax, it’s just a fluey runny nose, no-one is dying from it ‘cos they would have died anyway (won’t we all), the figures are fiddled, hospitals are half empty, MSM is telling nothing but lies, no-one in officialdom has any integrity whatsoever, 99% of the assembled might of scientific and medical brains have been fooled, politicians around the world have joined together and nuked their economies, scared their citizens to death and joined a conspiracy to further some secret agenda. Yeah, right.

Trump agrees with you

 

[counter_violent]

No, I see real people whove died while trying to help the sick being insulted in pursuit of an agenda.

I bet none of them were administrators or managers who seem strangely absent.
Every organisation the same. Administrators in hiding telling everyone else what they should be doing and how to do it.

If ever we needed a targeted virus to sort out the talking heads, then it's now. Sneaky buggers those admins, they know where to hide whilst the cannon fodder goes into battle.

 

[Atilla]

Well, if the brain tumor had caused the seizure that struck just as you crossed the road, you would have to consider citing 'epilepsy' as the cause.

This is merely nonsensical playing with semantics.

Only a proper autopsy can determine the contributory causes to a death.

And obfuscating the cause by citing 'covid' merely because the deceased had tested positive for it's presence is at best deceitful and at worst blatantly fraudulent.

😷

Car still would be responsible for lack of due care and attention whilst driving not seeing me having a dancing fit on the middle of a road.

You are the one who is playing smart alek imo.

See if you can come up with another.

 

[tomorton]

I bet none of them were administrators or managers who seem strangely absent.
Every organisation the same. Administrators in hiding telling everyone else what they should be doing and how to do it.

If ever we needed a targeted virus to sort out the talking heads, then it's now. Sneaky buggers those admins, they know where to hide whilst the cannon fodder goes into battle.

Actually, I heard of a number of ex-nurses whom I have met in the past who are now either retired or in senior admin / teaching roles who have gone back to nursing for the duration of the pandemic.

On the other hand, the NHS is admittedly the most top-heavy inflated over-staffed state apparatus ever invented. It is over 6 times larger than British Leyland at its engorged maximum, twice as big as the current Army, and is the 5th biggest civil employer on the planet. The NHS has among the lowest numbers of doctors, nurses and hospital beds per capita in the western world. The NHS does so much less with so much more.

 

[Atilla]

Ok guys, you got me beat.

The whole thing is a gigantic hoax, it’s just a fluey runny nose, no-one is dying from it ‘cos they would have died anyway (won’t we all), the figures are fiddled, hospitals are half empty, MSM is telling nothing but lies, no-one in officialdom has any integrity whatsoever, 99% of the assembled might of scientific and medical brains have been fooled, politicians around the world have joined together and nuked their economies, scared their citizens to death and joined a conspiracy to further some secret agenda. Yeah, right.

the figures are fiddled, - They lack clarity. Damn statistics and lies.

hospitals are half empty, - YES for sure. They've cancelled nuff surgeries and outpatient appointments.

MSM is telling nothing but lies, - MSM loves to exaggerate. Just look at how they treat mild weather. Beast from the East.

no-one in officialdom has any integrity whatsoever, - As someone who knows politicians such as Bliar you should know better.

99% of the assembled might of scientific and medical brains have been fooled, - well they have been asked questions and they are doing their best. The decisions around lockdown are from big G. Wouldn't blame them. If I have a cold but go into work because I have to, my dear mum would advise I rest at home and recuperate. Who do I listen to? My mum always knows best. She's no fool.


politicians around the world have joined together and nuked their economies, - Lemmings. They are worried like Trump if they don't act and get blamed for same amount of deaths. I do feel they are unintentionally nuking their economies yes. Clear enough to see. I would let everyone under 50 carry on and advise public to take their own precautions and conduct their risk assessments.

scared their citizens to death and joined a conspiracy to further some secret agenda. - Well it would have been good to have tests and protective kits ready. Testing is just coming on tap now almost after 4 months.

We definitely need an autopsy on our pandemic response and how we might better manage next time round.

Ofcourse there is also the difference in age and risk appetite between different people and given what we know about the virus. So reactions as to what is reasonable and what is excessive likely to differ wildly.

 

[timsk]

Ok guys, you got me beat.

The whole thing is a gigantic hoax, it’s just a fluey runny nose, no-one is dying from it ‘cos they would have died anyway (won’t we all), the figures are fiddled, hospitals are half empty, MSM is telling nothing but lies, no-one in officialdom has any integrity whatsoever, 99% of the assembled might of scientific and medical brains have been fooled, politicians around the world have joined together and nuked their economies, scared their citizens to death and joined a conspiracy to further some secret agenda. Yeah, right.

Getting there Jon, well done! But only David Knight believes it's a hoax, so 9/10!

 

[Signalcalc]

the figures are fiddled, - They lack clarity. Damn statistics and lies.

hospitals are half empty, - YES for sure. They've cancelled nuff surgeries and outpatient appointments.

MSM is telling nothing but lies, - MSM loves to exaggerate. Just look at how they treat mild weather. Beast from the East.

no-one in officialdom has any integrity whatsoever, - As someone who knows politicians such as Bliar you should know better.

99% of the assembled might of scientific and medical brains have been fooled, - well they have been asked questions and they are doing their best. The decisions around lockdown are from big G. Wouldn't blame them. If I have a cold but go into work because I have to, my dear mum would advise I rest at home and recuperate. Who do I listen to? My mum always knows best. She's no fool.


politicians around the world have joined together and nuked their economies, - Lemmings. They are worried like Trump if they don't act and get blamed for same amount of deaths. I do feel they are unintentionally nuking their economies yes. Clear enough to see. I would let everyone under 50 carry on and advise public to take their own precautions and conduct their risk assessments.

scared their citizens to death and joined a conspiracy to further some secret agenda. - Well it would have been good to have tests and protective kits ready. Testing is just coming on tap now almost after 4 months.

We definitely need an autopsy on our pandemic response and how we might better manage next time round.

Ofcourse there is also the difference in age and risk appetite between different people and given what we know about the virus. So reactions as to what is reasonable and what is excessive likely to differ wildly.

Ultimately, the global institutions that fail miserably to govern the planet and whom govts listen too need far more scrutiny and transparency in order to function for the good of us all.

The WHO, led by a very dodgy character, controlled by the Chinese has to be reorganised so that every decision, every funding point, every detailed process can be tracked, traced and discussed. How the WHO managed to get itself into it's current state from its early good intentions to a corrupt organisation that has the capability of causing mass death is a question to answer.

The same goes for the UN, the human rights organisations (how the hell they have representatives or are even led by the likes of the Saudis and the Chinese is beyond me) and the complex web of myriad other organisations that the global elites have determined between themselves to be capable of governing the planet.

At what point did the citizenship of the planet decide that a very few are capable of deciding the fate of humanity? I guess they didn't, it has been left to the elites to organise themselves at the expense of everyone else.

There really needs to be a mass challenge to the proposed new world order, but where is it to come from if the mass populations are not interested and are happy to accept a living death?

 

[MasterOfCoin]

On the other hand, the NHS is admittedly the most top-heavy inflated over-staffed state apparatus ever invented. It is over 6 times larger than British Leyland at its engorged maximum, twice as big as the current Army, and is the 5th biggest civil employer on the planet. The NHS has among the lowest numbers of doctors, nurses and hospital beds per capita in the western world. The NHS does so much less with so much more.

No, no, don't hold back there, let it rip.

👍

 

[darktone]

Ok guys, you got me beat.

The whole thing is a gigantic hoax, it’s just a fluey runny nose, no-one is dying from it ‘cos they would have died anyway (won’t we all), the figures are fiddled, hospitals are half empty, MSM is telling nothing but lies, no-one in officialdom has any integrity whatsoever, 99% of the assembled might of scientific and medical brains have been fooled, politicians around the world have joined together and nuked their economies, scared their citizens to death and joined a conspiracy to further some secret agenda. Yeah, right.

Well if we take your position as 10 and david as a 1, there are folks out there that come in at 3 or a 6 etc etc.

 

[darktone]

 

[cantagril]

Well if we take your position as 10 and david as a 1, there are folks out there that come in at 3 or a 6 etc etc.
View attachment 279047

As far as I can see, Barjon's position has now shifted into minimum position on the Hoaxometer whilst David has turned out to be slightly less sceptical having admitted that are, after all, one or two people who are telling at least some version of some truth.

By my reckoning, the scale is now Barjon at 0 with David nudging 1. I think I disappoint them both as, being a 5, I accept that there probably as many liars as truth-tellers and that my neighbour who supposedly died is actually living it up in the Caribbean under an assumed name, that Bill Gates isn't the anti-christ* and that aliens don't walk among us - well, maybe a few... but we did elect them after all.

* I worked out that it was Trump all along - fooled again eh?

 

[Signalcalc]

But only David Knight believes it's a hoax, so 9/10!

Which part of it isn't a hoax? That's what I would like to know.

1. A natural virus or man made?
2. Deliberate release or accidental?
3. Plandemic? Possibly, but WHO's planned it?
4. *Nefarious actors taking advantage of a 'war-time situation'? Without doubt, we can see it happening through legislation, lockdown, economic means, MSM propaganda, removal of citizen rights that will never be put back. To be fair to the nefarious actors they've been doing this since the invention of radio communications, but the emphasis has shifted from protection of citizens from other nefarious actors from outside of national borders to using citizens information against the citizenship or to help make corporate profits beyond anyone's wildest dreams, this last sentence results in a self perpetuating pursuit of mass surveillance for the nefarious actors.

It's only since the 90's that mass surveillance of ordinary citizens has been implemented as the technology and the dreams of man to utilise that data has progressed.

Quite simply, items 1-3 can now be left to a post-mortem, there is alot of work to do to sort it out and it may lead to friction, hopefully not war.

Item 4 is the most concerning aspect for us all and has been for 15 years at least, I can only see the problems presented by item 4 accelerating as a result of this pandemic, therefore the struggle to avoid mass surveillance needs to find new ways to combat it, which will in turn generate even more new technologies to avoid it.

*There are two sides to the coin of my definition of nefarious actors, my definition here refers to sovereign govts. The other side of the coin is where sovereign govts classify nefarious actors as other sovereign govts, terrorists, organised criminals, or anyone/organisations.

So in my assessment there are 3 main players, sovereign govts, criminal elements and the citizenship. The citizenship needs to protect itself against the other two, a big ask for individuals to do, although the technology, techniques and methodology has advanced far enough for the moment to at least provide some personal privacy and is in fact the same/similar technology, techniques and methodologies that is used by the other two actors in the pursuit of their aims, citizens just use it on a vastly smaller scale with little or no budget.

One such nefarious activity has been a bill (the Earn IT bill) passing through the US system that will allow sovereign govts the means of accessing encrypted communications. They clearly have a problem with people using encryption as a means for the citizenship to remain private.

 

[timsk]

The link that follows is to the Office for National Statistics (ONS) which provides data up to the week ending 17th April - their most recent update: Deaths registered weekly in England and Wales, provisional: week ending 17 April 2020
Scroll down to: Figure 5: The number of deaths involving COVID-19 was lower in females than males in all age groups, except those aged 1 to 14 years

To date, a mere 2,422 of people (male and female) under the age of 65 have died. If we include the next age group, the total deaths of everyone under the age of 75 is still quite low: 5,716 people. Unfortunately, there's no breakdown of those suffering from comorbidity issues, but it's reasonable to assume that many of them will have been. So, if we say that 50% of the under 65's were otherwise healthy, then that's little over 1,200 that have died of the virus as opposed to those that died with the virus. To put this figure into perspective, under normal circumstances, approximately 560 people would have died over the same period in road traffic accidents alone. Is it really worth nuking the entire economy for such a small number of people, knowing that the ensuing death toll - let alone untold misery for many thousands of people - will be much, much higher? Surely, the answer must be an emphatic and resounding NO!
Tim.

 

[MasterOfCoin]

Car still would be responsible for lack of due care and attention whilst driving not seeing me having a dancing fit on the middle of a road.

You are the one who is playing smart alek imo.

See if you can come up with another.

That's exactly the point. It's just fakery.

Framing a biased scenario in this way serves no real purpose beyond mildly amusing cleverness.

You could play around with fake scenarios like this one until the cows come home and it achieves nothing.

Cause of death is ultimately established by perfor6ming an autopsy.

To know the cause of death, one then reads the coroner's report.


It may well be that the deceased was a lifelong smoker, had been involved in a road traffic accident, tested positive for covid and suffered seizures from a brain tumor.

Whether it was any of these that resulted in death, or the trauma from three bullet wounds noted at autopsy, is a matter for the coroner to establish.


Some people will have died as a result of contracting a Covid19 infection.

But to assume deaths from all the other usual causes simply stopped happening to anyone who merely tested positive for covid infection is as absurdly ridiculous as it is disingenuous and deceitful.

Framing all those deaths as 'died with covid19' by implying that they all died of covid19 is fake.

What we all want to eventually know, preferably as soon as possible, is how many people actually died due to covid19 as aside from other causes, so that we can then begin to make a realistic assessment of the level of threat it poses to mortality rates and balance our response to it appropriately.

A proper analysis of the full statistics, as begun in the post above this one, is required for this.

Right now, you'd be forgiven for believing that nobody died of flu this year, because all those deaths have been attributed to covid. Somehow, I seriously doubt that that has been the case.

Meanwhile the death toll from unintended consequences and collateral damage of the present policy no doubt continues to mount.

😷

 

[barjon]

That's exactly the point. It's just fakery.

Framing a biased scenario in this way serves no real purpose beyond mildly amusing cleverness.

You could play around with fake scenarios like this one until the cows come home and it achieves nothing.

Cause of death is ultimately established by perfor6ming an autopsy.

To know the cause of death, one then reads the coroner's report.


It may well be that the deceased was a lifelong smoker, had been involved in a road traffic accident, tested positive for covid and suffered seizures from a brain tumor.

Whether it was any of these that resulted in death, or the trauma from three bullet wounds noted at autopsy, is a matter for the coroner to establish.


Some people will have died as a result of contracting a Covid19 infection.

But to assume deaths from all the other usual causes simply stopped happening to anyone who merely tested positive for covid infection is as absurdly ridiculous as it is disingenuous and deceitful.

Framing all those deaths as 'died with covid19' by implying that they all died of covid19 is fake.

What we all want to eventually know, preferably as soon as possible, is how many people actually died due to covid19 as aside from other causes, so that we can then begin to make a realistic assessment of the level of threat it poses to mortality rates and balance our response to it appropriately.

A proper analysis of the full statistics, as begun in the post above this one, is required for this.

Right now, you'd be forgiven for believing that nobody died of flu this year, because all those deaths have been attributed to covid. Somehow, I seriously doubt that that has been the case.

Meanwhile the death toll from unintended consequences and collateral damage of the present policy no doubt continues to mount.

😷

You can never get an answer. Some people have succumbed directly from the virus. Others have succumbed indirectly as the immune system has gone into “global storm” overdrive in its attempts to combat the virus, this has then had a fatal effect on existing conditions. Others with the virus have died, but where the virus has had no influence.

I doubt that it can ever be established to what extent those with the virus died as an indirect result of the virus or not.

Isn’t it enough that they are dead?

 

[counter_violent]

You can never get an answer. Some people have succumbed directly from the virus. Others have succumbed indirectly as the immune system has gone into “global storm” overdrive in its attempts to combat the virus, this has then had a fatal effect on existing conditions. Others with the virus have died, but where the virus has had no influence.

I doubt that it can ever be established to what extent those with the virus died as an indirect result of the virus or not.

Isn’t it enough that they are dead?

So policy is determined by quack experts and quack science based on misleading information where Govt is supposed to determine what is best for everybody and in the national interest.

Doesn't sound like the "social contract" that I grew up with!

 

[darktone]

You can never get an answer. Some people have succumbed directly from the virus. Others have succumbed indirectly as the immune system has gone into “global storm” overdrive in its attempts to combat the virus, this has then had a fatal effect on existing conditions. Others with the virus have died, but where the virus has had no influence.

I doubt that it can ever be established to what extent those with the virus died as an indirect result of the virus or not.

Isn’t it enough that they are dead?

I agree with that.
Also, rip the other 19,188,116 folks whove so far passed this year without CV-19.