Glenn
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Paul
I understand what you are saying, and agree.
With such a short -term approach it would need to be done in a live chat room to have any chance of being worthwhile. (Another possibility perhaps ?)
It should become clear either from Naz/Mr C or their previous attendees whether what I am suggesting is feasible.
Cheers
Glenn
I understand what you are saying, and agree.
With such a short -term approach it would need to be done in a live chat room to have any chance of being worthwhile. (Another possibility perhaps ?)
It should become clear either from Naz/Mr C or their previous attendees whether what I am suggesting is feasible.
Cheers
Glenn
Alice
I think you have to look at this in context. These boards are littered with the experiences - good and bad, but mainly bad - of people who have paid large amounts of money for courses which are well marketed but, to put it mildly, low on any content which you can't find for free on the Internet if you know where to look. I freely admit that I have been taken in by one which, had threads such as the ones I refer to been available to me at the time, I would not have been. So the background to this sort of thread is both cynical, experience-based and, in many cases, driven by a genuine desire by people who have more experience in this area, to stop newcomers making expensive mistakes. I have found this useful, although I agree with you that the tone of this particular thread leaves a bit to be desired. Asking for evidence of how good these guys are in the same way that people will check out the suitability of anything they are going to spend a significant amount of money is not, to my mind, being nosy (sic) : it's just being sensible. (The fact that, as other posters have pointed out, it's unachieveable, is beside the point!). Of course (no pun intended) the decision on whether to attend is down to the individual, but I don't think you can blame people for trying to find out exactly what they are going to get for their money, and for others with more experience to want to help them : exactly the purpose of bulletin boards as you describe them. No comparison with the Tory leadership : simply a useful aid to decision making which, I repeat, had I had access to before I parted with my money a while ago, I would not have done so.
Kind regards
I think you have to look at this in context. These boards are littered with the experiences - good and bad, but mainly bad - of people who have paid large amounts of money for courses which are well marketed but, to put it mildly, low on any content which you can't find for free on the Internet if you know where to look. I freely admit that I have been taken in by one which, had threads such as the ones I refer to been available to me at the time, I would not have been. So the background to this sort of thread is both cynical, experience-based and, in many cases, driven by a genuine desire by people who have more experience in this area, to stop newcomers making expensive mistakes. I have found this useful, although I agree with you that the tone of this particular thread leaves a bit to be desired. Asking for evidence of how good these guys are in the same way that people will check out the suitability of anything they are going to spend a significant amount of money is not, to my mind, being nosy (sic) : it's just being sensible. (The fact that, as other posters have pointed out, it's unachieveable, is beside the point!). Of course (no pun intended) the decision on whether to attend is down to the individual, but I don't think you can blame people for trying to find out exactly what they are going to get for their money, and for others with more experience to want to help them : exactly the purpose of bulletin boards as you describe them. No comparison with the Tory leadership : simply a useful aid to decision making which, I repeat, had I had access to before I parted with my money a while ago, I would not have done so.
Kind regards
As the course being run by Naz/Mr C is not for beginners there is nothing wrong with asking for a P&L or a trading record. Lets assume the following:
1. I trade and have a success rate of 5/10
2. i trade and have a success rate of 7/10
Assuming Naz/Mr C have a success rate of say 8/10 then in scenario 1 it would have been worth my while attending the course. In scenario 2 i would probably have come from the course thinking that it was no good and did not learn much.
But had i seen a track record for Naz/Mr C i could have made a 'comfortable'decision to go for it in scenario one returned from the course feeling that i had 'actually learned something'....positive reviews.
Or a 'wise' decision not to in scenario 2, because i didn't think they could much improve on what i was currently doing....negative reviews.
only my opinion.
Regards.
1. I trade and have a success rate of 5/10
2. i trade and have a success rate of 7/10
Assuming Naz/Mr C have a success rate of say 8/10 then in scenario 1 it would have been worth my while attending the course. In scenario 2 i would probably have come from the course thinking that it was no good and did not learn much.
But had i seen a track record for Naz/Mr C i could have made a 'comfortable'decision to go for it in scenario one returned from the course feeling that i had 'actually learned something'....positive reviews.
Or a 'wise' decision not to in scenario 2, because i didn't think they could much improve on what i was currently doing....negative reviews.
only my opinion.
Regards.
FTSE Beater
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Alice Major said:
Hi Alice Major
Welcome to T2W
You'll have to excuse the current goings-on over here at the moment, I like you am getting very bored with it. This is an isolated thread and I will be very glad when the 17th of November comes around when all this is over.
Worse then the Tories, well I think that's a little harsh - no-ones as bad as that
Yes Grubs, I think that's true. Like, I'm sure, a lot of people I have learned a lot from the postings here of some well informed, helpful and constructively supportive people. That positive aspect of this site has been a bit obscured in this thread even though, despite their tone, I still think most posters are trying to be helpful.
Alice,
Sorry forgot to mention one other point, the 'show me your account' attitude also stems partly from the claims that some of the people who run courses make about likely returns, many of which are complete pie-in-the-sky. Anybody new to this business has no idea whether some of these posters are making millions or are on the breadline. One thing is clear to me, namely that the worst offenders mentioned on other threads are making considerably more money from running courses than they ever did from trading, if indeed they have ever traded at all.
Sorry forgot to mention one other point, the 'show me your account' attitude also stems partly from the claims that some of the people who run courses make about likely returns, many of which are complete pie-in-the-sky. Anybody new to this business has no idea whether some of these posters are making millions or are on the breadline. One thing is clear to me, namely that the worst offenders mentioned on other threads are making considerably more money from running courses than they ever did from trading, if indeed they have ever traded at all.
Scripophilist
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Scrappy
If % entry winners is you measurement of success then I suggest you attend a training course immediately!!!
If % entry winners is you measurement of success then I suggest you attend a training course immediately!!!
Scripophilist
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Re : Posting trading records, Will people stop debating this. It is a rhetorical question. If you post your trading records then people will start trying to qualify them, that point means that either by posting your records you nullify the need to attend a course and / or you are pretty much giving you success and / or tuition away for free.
I don't see why this topic is being so hotly debated.
If you feel this is not for you then don't go, if you could gain from it then make judgement on if you want to go, that's it really.
In the many many years I have been in the market I have paid to attend many lectures and courses. Not all of which I agreed which the subject matter. It was just part of the learning and qualification that made me into what I am now.
I've tried to stay on the fence but I will come of it, I know people who have attended Mr Charts 1-2-1 tuition and it comes highly recommended. That is not to say it is right for the person reading this post as I don't know what your background is.
That would be judgemental and foolish to assume. It's a shame that others on this thread feel it is their right to impose that judgement on others!! We are all grown people. (At least I hope so).
I don't see why this topic is being so hotly debated.
If you feel this is not for you then don't go, if you could gain from it then make judgement on if you want to go, that's it really.
In the many many years I have been in the market I have paid to attend many lectures and courses. Not all of which I agreed which the subject matter. It was just part of the learning and qualification that made me into what I am now.
I've tried to stay on the fence but I will come of it, I know people who have attended Mr Charts 1-2-1 tuition and it comes highly recommended. That is not to say it is right for the person reading this post as I don't know what your background is.
That would be judgemental and foolish to assume. It's a shame that others on this thread feel it is their right to impose that judgement on others!! We are all grown people. (At least I hope so).
Here are my thoughts on this thread.
1) No matter what appears in any of these postings there is no way either Naz or Mr Charts is going to provide proof of their trading records. This is entirely up to them, and I think its pointless for people to try and come up with any more arguments to try and persuade them to change their minds.
2) Both these guys are putting themselves on the line here, if people are not happy with what they get on the 15th of November, then it is certain that this will be made clear by the many posts that will appear on this site, straight after the event.
3) Naz and Mr Charts are well aware of 2) above and so I am sure will do their level best to make sure that all delegates who attend on the 15th leave, feeling that their trading knowledge has been significantly increased, and that they have received value for money.
1) No matter what appears in any of these postings there is no way either Naz or Mr Charts is going to provide proof of their trading records. This is entirely up to them, and I think its pointless for people to try and come up with any more arguments to try and persuade them to change their minds.
2) Both these guys are putting themselves on the line here, if people are not happy with what they get on the 15th of November, then it is certain that this will be made clear by the many posts that will appear on this site, straight after the event.
3) Naz and Mr Charts are well aware of 2) above and so I am sure will do their level best to make sure that all delegates who attend on the 15th leave, feeling that their trading knowledge has been significantly increased, and that they have received value for money.
Mr. Charts
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Well said, Carlo1.
The ironic thing is the more certain people have been having a pop at us, the more people have been emailing with questions and booking 1-2-1s.
Yes we've laid ourselves open and under our real names too, no hiding behind anonymity for us.
Are we worried about that? No way, we know what we will give and how beneficial it's going to be to the folk attending, so we're happy and comfortable and can't wait for the day to arrive ;-)
The ironic thing is the more certain people have been having a pop at us, the more people have been emailing with questions and booking 1-2-1s.
Yes we've laid ourselves open and under our real names too, no hiding behind anonymity for us.
Are we worried about that? No way, we know what we will give and how beneficial it's going to be to the folk attending, so we're happy and comfortable and can't wait for the day to arrive ;-)
neil
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Iron Maidens
I have been following these debates about the witch hunt (Grail Hunt) with an equal measure of amusement and bemusement:
Thank goodness the Spanish Inquisition is history; Imagine some seekers of the "holy grail" here, pushing Naz and the protesting Mr. Charts into an iron maiden's sharp embrace, stretching them on the rack, or trying to drown them on the witch's ducking stool.
Next, whilst still clinging to life, the grail seekers drag our intrepid heroes back to a table, thrust a quill into their feeble hands and shout, " scribe for us your magic spells and list the ingredients of your potion for success."
Followed by a short, but excrutiating, spell on the rack, with more calls to recant their claim to be successful traders, and demands to embrace the forgiveness of the shared mediocrity of their accusers.
Participants, and therefore potential witnesses, of our intrepid victims coaching sessions are barred from giving evidence because their view of reality may clash with our hero's tormentors.
But our two hero's stand firm and their tormentors are forced to free them.
So, somewhere in a lonely place, the intrepid dou's tormentors are trying to eat trading statements, frequently calling for more, and drinking from an almost empty barrel which is being repeatedly drummed upon by a tormentor with a wooden spoon.
Then, from their small window in that lonely place, they scowl at the masses heading for the home of our intrepid dou.
"Pah." Said the chief Tormentor and Master holy grail seeker.
" Fools - I bet they didn't see any trading statements."
I have been following these debates about the witch hunt (Grail Hunt) with an equal measure of amusement and bemusement:
Thank goodness the Spanish Inquisition is history; Imagine some seekers of the "holy grail" here, pushing Naz and the protesting Mr. Charts into an iron maiden's sharp embrace, stretching them on the rack, or trying to drown them on the witch's ducking stool.
Next, whilst still clinging to life, the grail seekers drag our intrepid heroes back to a table, thrust a quill into their feeble hands and shout, " scribe for us your magic spells and list the ingredients of your potion for success."
Followed by a short, but excrutiating, spell on the rack, with more calls to recant their claim to be successful traders, and demands to embrace the forgiveness of the shared mediocrity of their accusers.
Participants, and therefore potential witnesses, of our intrepid victims coaching sessions are barred from giving evidence because their view of reality may clash with our hero's tormentors.
But our two hero's stand firm and their tormentors are forced to free them.
So, somewhere in a lonely place, the intrepid dou's tormentors are trying to eat trading statements, frequently calling for more, and drinking from an almost empty barrel which is being repeatedly drummed upon by a tormentor with a wooden spoon.
Then, from their small window in that lonely place, they scowl at the masses heading for the home of our intrepid dou.
"Pah." Said the chief Tormentor and Master holy grail seeker.
" Fools - I bet they didn't see any trading statements."
Newtron Bomb
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LOL BRILLIANT....I had a vision of Rick Mayall reading Jackanory
BRILLIANT....I had a vision of Rick Mayall reading JackanoryScripophilist
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scrappy
Hi % return, yep, Hi % entry nope.
Hi % return, yep, Hi % entry nope.
<i>I found this article you might find it useful</i>
I agree on the point over discipline. It does also highlight the big negative though (whilst suggesting it is a positive). In one of the paragraphs it talks of high % methods being better for troubleshooting as you know it has gone wrong once you get a few bad trades. Following that kind of mentality though is just going to lead you to producing curve fitted systems where you are constantly trading the perfect system for last month whilst making losses this month.
If you can find a genuinely high % system it should have huge psychological benefits (the benefits to drawdown mentioned are a bit misconceived) but the danger lies in trying to find one without curve fitting/dta mining your results.
wysi
I agree on the point over discipline. It does also highlight the big negative though (whilst suggesting it is a positive). In one of the paragraphs it talks of high % methods being better for troubleshooting as you know it has gone wrong once you get a few bad trades. Following that kind of mentality though is just going to lead you to producing curve fitted systems where you are constantly trading the perfect system for last month whilst making losses this month.
If you can find a genuinely high % system it should have huge psychological benefits (the benefits to drawdown mentioned are a bit misconceived) but the danger lies in trying to find one without curve fitting/dta mining your results.
wysi
