Pairs Trading

MR CHART

I am not into personal attacks and have no time for petty issues .. If I see an irrelevant post I will point it out to my best of knowledge.. If you can defend your post the way a COACH should do , then there wont be any problem but you can not and I know that .. So I would advise not to mention strategies or techniques that you are not familiar with ,,, Pair trading needs great amount of skill specially intra-day trading and it does not come overnight.. This BB is source of huge amount information and will remain to be so as long as contributor post and defend their methodologies..

PS:- hope this time it works
 

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guys lemme find the site that I downloaded the file from and you can down load it yourself .. please give me few minutes .. I just come back from a beer night lol
 
If you do a google search under advanced investments pair and down load the file under pairtrading relative value arbitrage then you should get it.. Alternativley PM me your email and I will forward it to you ..

The file is in Power point format ..
 
No Sweat :cheesy: :cheesy:
 

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Hi,

This looks like quite a promising source of material:

http://www.insightful.com/industry/finance/trading.asp

There's a downloadable Pairs Trading Worksheet and Data Set there, but you'll have to register with the site to get them. There are further references and links at the end of the worksheet.

Some of you might find it interesting, although a bit too academic for me though! :cry:

HTH

Cheers

Mayfly
 
may fly,

Thanks for the link.. It is a great read for those interested in turning the guessing game of market direction into some thing more objective.

Regards
 
Following on from my description y'day of the simple sort of pair trades that I do, some might find today's pair trade interesting.

3.19
long SINA 34.58
short ERTS 47.79

4.16
sold SINA 35.72 for +114c per share
covered ERTS 47.54 for +25c per share

Many people will recognise these shares as being two of my core trading stocks.

The principles used to enter these trades were the ones I mentioned yesterday.

The market overall seemed lacking in direction at the time I entered the trades.
However, SINA was showing relative strength and ERTS relative weakness.
I exited when SINA pulled back after spiking and ERTS appeared stable.
On average I do around three such trades per week at times when overall market direction is unclear and when I can find suitable pairs candidates. Today was easy as those two stocks are on my core trading list so I didn't even have to look for them.
This straightforward methodology works for me, I'm sure other approaches work well for other market players.

I will continue to contribute when I think some people might find my posts useful or interesting.
 
Charts of the above for the graphically curious.
 

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I will continue to contribute when I think some people might find my posts useful or interesting.

All the time Richard - great stuff - keep it up...! :cheesy:

Regards
 
Grey1. I'd be interested to know if Mr. Charts' pair trade would have fitted in with your own style of pair trading. Particularly your VWAP method. Were both stocks on the 'correct sides of their respective VWAP's at the time of the pair trade? i.e, was ERTS above its VWAP when the short was taken and visa versa? I don't personally have access to that type of information. Thanks

Keano
 
keano,

I can tell you that both trades taken by Mr Charts do not fit into
the model used by Grey1. Mr Charts is using an entirely different
method for selecting and trading his pairs and is more similar to
a method I have seen discussed by Naz.

One method is based on value and the other more on momentum
so the 2 are almost mutually incompatible in my view.


Paul
 
KEANO

Any body can pick two stocks after event. Easy peasy . it is called HIND SIGHT STRATEGY and not a PAIR TRADE STRATEGY .. TO pick pair trade stocks one needs to have some kind of a Model for picking the relevant stocks , as well as technical or statistical criteria’s for a safe entry and exit…( I am talking about the Traditional pair trading methodologies which you would find all over the internet and not the VWAP analysis which I have outlined.. )


SINA closed UP 4 Dollars yesterday where ERTS only closed 5Cents .. This must be the worse pair trade any body could pick.. Could you imagine SINA moving $2 in no time while ERTS moving 3C at the same time.. What kind of market neutral strategy is this ? The first criteria in Pair trading is volatility ratio filter which in the above case has been totally ignored… Of course if you 100% knew SINA would go UP what would be point of shorting ERTS .. JUST DOUBLE YOUR POSITION ON SINA and WALLA double profit all the time..

Am I talking none sence here ? Am I being un fair ?


Also:--

I enclose two charts .. one intra day yesterday and the other daily chart .. I don’t really have to say much .. Charts speak for it self..

Chart 1 is yesterday’s SINA against ERTS .. Do these two stock look diverging to you .. they only diverged when MR CHART TRADED THEM ..

Chart 2 is the daily chart. Does these stocks Historically ever diverged ? Does these two stocks have been having a LOW RS against any bench mark last past few month ? OF COURSE NOT ..


Again my interest are technical issues and personalities does not come to it .. I am not a politician ..

If I did have the hind sight strategy , I would not be a trader .. I would be doing the national lottery and won every week.
 

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Remember guys.. volatility is the root of all evils and ofcourse all profits too .. Why do you all stop trading before a major announcement ? Coz you donot want to get cought ..

When you pair trade you are looking into reducing the volatility due to market mis behaving.. by reducing the volality in an objective manner , one could reduce risk ..
There is no point to hedge on stock with huge volatility such as SINA which could move 15 % gainst a stock which historicaly could only move 1%...


regards
 
Thanks tradesmart and all the others - I'll reply to everyone asap.

Frugi - thank you for taking the time and trouble to post those charts. The easiest way for anyone interested to see what ERTS and SINA looked like at the point of entry and later the point of exit, is simply to cover frugi's charts so only the charts up to the time of entry is visible. Then do the same at the time of exit.
The entries are then visually obvious; the exit on ERTS is also clear as it was based on the SINA exit. The exit on SINA was because it had approached the whole number, been rejected after a quick run and started to fall with level 2 support falling away. Knowing how volatile SINA is, I decided to close the trade and take a substantial profit - the essence of intraday trading.


Of course, had I known what was going to happen to those stocks later in the day, (hindsight!!??)I would have waited till 8.55 before closing the trades and made a lot more money, wouldn't I !!! ;-)


Indeed, as indicated, I do require momentum in the direction of almost all my trades before entering them. This is quite different to any value based technical or mathematical method of trading.
The latter methods are, of course, valid and I appreciate the way Grey1 has posted extensively about them.

The behaviour of the stocks in the previous weeks is not relevant to my own style of trading - other than significant s/r levels etc.

I am in no way denigrating anyone else's methods or calling them irrelevant or disrespecting them. As can be seen, when I ask a question, I do so politely. If that person declines to answer, fine - no problem. If possible I try to answer a question as best I can and that I did. The response is there for all to read. I showed an example the next time I did a pairs trade. The response is there for all to read.
Please note that imo, these boards are for informed debate to everyone's benefit. I do not even expect courtesy from anyone, even after I have extended courtesy to them.
However NO-ONE is going to tell me not to post on a thread, unless it's the moderators.
I WILL make the judgement as to whether I can contribute something constructive and post accordingly. That, after all, is what everyone does.
We learn from one another and that's the way it should be.
These boards are big enough for informed debate and constructive ideas and an UNLIMITED number of contributors. There are very many ways to make money from the markets and that's what we are here for - plus all the very pleasant people who post ;-)
As far as I am concerned can we please get back to positive, constructive postings?
And a bit of tolerance.
 
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