If It's All About making Money?

[CityTrader]

I am very happy for you, for you with your experience, to have been totally immune from the politics of envy and resentment against achievement. It is a cosy wooly happy world that you inhabit, lucky you !

I'm touched. I Guess in 25 years of working for Investment banks in London, Frankfurt and New York, as a trader, I only got to see the vanilla, PG13 version of the world you guys must inhabit. Where death threats are a way of life. I mean, hey envy is everywhere, especially in a dealing room ( ever actually been in one?) but having to change your tel number, go underground,and try to avoid being photgraphed? - now that is a different world. Very, James Bond like. Must be very exciting for you.
Enjoy.

 

[SOCRATES]

I'm touched. I Guess in 25 years of working for Investment banks in London, Frankfurt and New York, as a trader, I only got to see the vanilla, PG13 version of the world you guys must inhabit. Where death threats are a way of life. I mean, hey envy is everywhere, especially in a dealing room ( ever actually been in one?) but having to change your tel number, go underground,and try to avoid being photgraphed? - now that is a different world. Very, James Bond like. Must be very exciting for you.
Enjoy.

There is nothing James Bond about it, but you hear of these things happening all the time.

The people who suffer from unwanted attention fuelled by envy are not ordinary persons like you imagine. It happens in every walk of life. Nowadays people as inoffensive as entertainers, singers, film stars, pop people, models, footballers, fell obligated to walk around protected by minders.

One has to sympathise with people whose private life is not their own as a result of having been successful in some field or another.

I am pleased you are satisfied with having worked in New York, Frankfurt, and London, and that you enjoyed your career in investment banking, and yes, I haven't just been in one, I once worked in one, but I personally never experienced any envy, as we were all too busy running around the floor of the exchange striving to get all the work done against the clock, some times 5 miles in a day but that was before BIg Bang and the bad habits it brought to what was previously a polite and courteous world in which shoes had laces and trousers had braces and ties were quiet and everyone knew his place.

So I do commiserate with you, if you had to experience any nastiness there, as for my part, I am able to look upon my apprenticeship with fond nostalgia, and still retain friends from my days in Threadneedle Street.

But always in life there are people who stand head and shoulders above everybody else for whatever reason. And the more successful they are the more antagonism and envy they attract.

This sadly is a fact of life. It shouldn't be so, but it is.

The sort of environment mega traders inhabit is also inoffensive, but I suspect not exempt from envy like the show business or sports personalities have to suffer. I am not defending anything or anyone, but I must remark you have been fortunate to be obviously a very accomplished person and to have gone through life totally unscathed.

My Compliments and Good Wishes To You.

 

[CityTrader]

There is nothing James Bond about it, but you hear of these things happening all the time.

The people who suffer from unwanted attention fuelled by envy are not ordinary persons like you imagine. It happens in every walk of life. Nowadays people as inoffensive as entertainers, singers, film stars, pop people, models, footballers, fell obligated to walk around protected by minders.

One has to sympathise with people whose private life is not their own as a result of having been successful in some field or another.

I am pleased you are satisfied with having worked in New York, Frankfurt, and London, and that you enjoyed your career in investment banking, and yes, I haven't just been in one, I once worked in one, but I personally never experienced any envy, as we were all too busy running around the floor of the exchange striving to get all the work done against the clock, some times 5 miles in a day but that was before BIg Bang and the bad habits it brought to what was previously a polite and courteous world in which shoes had laces and trousers had braces and ties were quiet and everyone knew his place.

So I do commiserate with you, if you had to experience any nastiness there, as for my part, I am able to look upon my apprenticeship with fond nostalgia, and still retain friends from my days in Threadneedle Street.

But always in life there are people who stand head and shoulders above everybody else for whatever reason. And the more successful they are the more antagonism and envy they attract.

This sadly is a fact of life. It shouldn't be so, but it is.

The sort of environment mega traders inhabit is also inoffensive, but I suspect not exempt from envy like the show business or sports personalities have to suffer. I am not defending anything or anyone, but I must remark you have been fortunate to be obviously a very accomplished person and to have gone through life totally unscathed.

My Compliments and Good Wishes To You.

I also worked on the Stock Exchange floor pre big bang. I'm not saying that I'm either accomplished or unscathed, but I refuse to believe that other guys comments about death threats that caused the guy to drop out of life, and become a hermit! Only 3 weeks ago i saw David Kyte. who I'm sure has made as much as the other guy ( no, it's not a pissing contest!) but I certainly didn't see him being shadowed by any minders!

 

[Salty Gibbon]

That is because they were doing their job properly.

 

[DaveJB]

EGLL 29015 280V020 8000-RA FEWBKN025 OVCO80 18/15 Q0983 TEMPO 3000 RA BKN008 OVC020.

- Sorry, very slow to get back here... oddly enough I do try to cultivate a life off T2W <g> Let's see, wind 290 15 kts to 280 variable 20kts, (isn't the first group normally a timespan?), vis 8km, Rain. Few oktas broken cloud at 2500 ft, overcast at 8000 ft, 18/15? From 1800 to 1500? I also think Q0983 is iffy - surely QNH or (more likely QFE) 983? Temporarily 3 km vis in Rain, broken cloud at 800 ft, overcast at 2000 ft.
EGLL - UK airfield , sorry, EGDL is Lyneham as I recall, can't remember EGLL but not a master diversion airfield.

I STILL don't see how this tells me which way the FTSE or DOW is planned to go, according to the Lizardmen of Icke, or whoever else is allegedly fixing the markets currently?

Dave

 

[the blades]

instead i find a school playground with the usual suspects one finds there. all arguing over things which are mostly irrelevant anyhow.

In fairness, the vast majority of your "26" posts have been spent in the playground.

Why not offer some advice, admit you're here to learn, or go off and amuse yourself with the great wealth you should have accumulated through being such a genius?

UTB

 

[SOCRATES]

no i assure you it is true.

his technique has been known as spoofing and he displays huge size in markets - only to pull it before it can be executed. the problem for the other traders is that their institutional training taught them to lean on this size - so they did, and when the size disappeared - pooof! they got hit badly as the market moved away like someone pulling a rug from under your feet - which is actually exactly what is happening. he is very prevelant in the german fixed income futures.

he is able to do this as rumour has it (i cant substantiate this bit - it is only rumour) that he also owns 25% of trading technologies - the execution platform of the professional. he has had them build functionality into the platform which allows him to do this - but is not available to others. it is a bit like iceberg order functionality on other platforms - but obviously a bit more severe!

this is one such reason why reading depth of market, level 2 and other tools isnt so useful anymore.

death threats were received, and many directors of established houses requested eurex look into the matter as they regarded it as unfair and manipulation. eurex decided his methods were fair, as infact, his orders are able to be executed - if you were quick and big enough. the real reason could be that 'the flipper' as he is known accounts for a substantial percentage of eurex daily volume. estimated at 30% in the bund alone

Yes, and there is another operator who uses the same technique on S+P Futures, big time.
That is why in part everything is not as it seems, and all of this is a lethal place for the unprepared, the indolent, the unaware and the slow to inhabit.

 

[SOCRATES]

In fairness, the vast majority of your "26" posts have been spent in the playground.

Why not offer some advice, admit you're here to learn, or go off and amuse yourself with the great wealth you should have accumulated through being such a genius?

UTB

There is no playground here. These are very high level discussions at the very perimeter of what can be exposed in a public forum, by experts. You ought to consider yourself priviledged to witness this. We remain nonplussed at your dismay. Actually any disruption is likely to cause the whole thing to grind to an abrupt halt and for the whole remainder of the discussion to submerge, out of sight, to the detriment of those members who can benefit from it.

 

[1lotwonder]

In fairness, the vast majority of your "26" posts have been spent in the playground.

Why not offer some advice, admit you're here to learn, or go off and amuse yourself with the great wealth you should have accumulated through being such a genius?

UTB

dont worry - i am off out to amuse myself no end later this evening!

( i dont actually live in grimsby - the name just amuses me)

in the mean time - you are amusing enough for me!!

 

[the blades]

There is no playground here. These are very high level discussions at the very perimeter of what can be exposed in a public forum, by experts. You ought to consider yourself priviledged to witness this. We remain nonplussed at your dismay. Actually any disruption is likely to cause the whole thing to grind to an abrupt halt and for the whole remainder of the discussion to submerge, out of sight, to the detriment of those members who can benefit from it.

"priveleged".....

Actually, I'm ashamed to say it's taken me nearly 800 of your posts to realise that if you strip away the etheral nonsense, there is nothing in the way of advice, direction or encouragement.

You claim to have so much to offer. Sadly, for me, I have to look elsewhere.

UTB

PS 1Lot.....please correct me - tell me that if I am ever to rise to your greatness and accumulate the wealth that surely comes with it, I will not need amuse myself by claiming to live if Grimsby and poking fun at such small fry? On a Saturday evening, at that

 

[SOCRATES]

You see, you were warned, let this be a lesson to you, I'm off as well, Ta Ta.

 

[roguetrader]

"spoofing" as you call it, is not an uncommon practice in the markets, or so I'm told. a tactic alledgedly employed by MM's quite frequently, and why one has to be careful how much one relies on L2

 

[axthree]

I knew you would spot it Dave.
I think that at least one other will.
It was just plucked out of the air so there will be some anomalies.
Yes, there should have been a time validity period.
EGLL = Heathrow in case it causes you to use time checking.
I also found that when I traded it the market went against me

 

[wisestguy]

Originally Posted by SOCRATES
There is no playground here. These are very high level discussions at the very perimeter of what can be exposed in a public forum, by experts. You ought to consider yourself priviledged to witness this. We remain nonplussed at your dismay. Actually any disruption is likely to cause the whole thing to grind to an abrupt halt and for the whole remainder of the discussion to submerge, out of sight, to the detriment of those members who can benefit from it.

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I came across this thread by chance when this strange and amusing post caught my eye .

my God , what a joke . who does this guy think he is ? high level discussions ?
HAHAHAHA.

he makes out like it's tudor jones talking trade secrets with randy mackay .

 

[wisestguy]

oh yes to answer the original question :

it's not just about maning money . you have to consider the risk you put up for the money you make . think about it , it makes perfect sense . if you don't understand this , then the casino is a better bet for you.

pun fully intended.


and you know, about the 3 categories of posters , as for group (a) , well what do you expect , if someone really has a consistently winning system , do you think they would tell you all for free on a public forum ?

no such thing as a free lunch.

 

[Salty Gibbon]

I came across this thread by chance when this strange and amusing post caught my eye .

my God , what a joke . who does this guy think he is ? high level discussions ?
HAHAHAHA.

he makes out like it's tudor jones talking trade secrets with randy mackay

Ever heard of sarcasm, tongue in cheek or plain taking the pi*ss ?

Choose one or all of these 3 and you may get some idea as to Socrates' drift.

I am now at the perimeter of what I want to discuss so I think I'll go and grab some breakfast.

 

[Trader333]

I dont see what the issue is with spoofing as it happens all the time when using Level II for US stock trading. The key is to spot when it is happening and there are some very obvious clues when it is.

Naz is particularly good at spotting this and has previously published ways in which this can be done.


Paul

 

[ravenglass]

there is currently a large trader on eurex called paul rotter. some may have heard his name before.
he is a very secretive individual who rarely gives interviews, and never allows his photo to be published. he never accepts telephone calls. it is rumoured that he is based in ireland, but this has not been firmly established.


His company is registered in Zug, I came across it on Swiss equivalent of companies house.

What is the advantage of being based in Ireland, why is he based there?

 

[wisestguy]

spoofing ain't nothing special , all you need the access to market and anyone can do it .

retailers have been in doing it in trading - crazy malaysia for what ? ..... decades I would say .

I don't why it somehow " immoral " what this rotter guy does . market's a dangerous place , lotta sharks , just be conservative and don't eaten.

that's why all the wannabe city suavee' fantasie' types come a cropper.

 

[jimmy1jag]

His company is registered in Zug, I came across it on Swiss equivalent of companies house.

What is the advantage of being based in Ireland, why is he based there?

Ireland can be used as a tax haven if I remember rightly. I'm sure if you wanted to find out more a simple google search on offshore companies would provide you with loads more info.

Methods of LEGAL tax avoidance are always worthwhile investigating and implementing.