FAQ How Difficult is it to Trade?

[NVP]

Very true. The game is just 10% knowledge, 10% technique but 80% psychology - your own psychology that is, because the only person who can make you lose is yourself. I have to go along with Mark Douglas's thinking when he says almost everything we have absorbed about being a good school pupil or employee or engineer or doctor or whatever, and the values we have learned about earning and using money, are the wrong preparation for being a good trader.

totally agree with TOM .........

getting a decent system in place and ensuring your execution processes are solid (MM,Exit,entries,platform, boker, IT etc etc )..is EASY !

honest it is .........even the system ........a good trader with good execution and instincts will kill a bad trader even on a simple MA crossover system

the real killer is the soft side of the process ..........where your head is and your emotions and your concentration ..............we are humans ........we are organic beings .......we are not robots .......its a great thing to possess generally as you go about everyday life .......but its a curse for traders !! ...........many things you have to do to win in trading will go against those hardwired emotions .........



that's why few make the cut .........I am told that flying a fighter plane (and also driving formula 1) also requires similar disconnections / reconnections to be made to succeed .....as again you have to remove some of the hardwiring that normal life needs .........I havnt done either but have sat in a few high speed car laps ........and yes .......my instincts were completely different to the guy driving ....hahahahahahaha

N

 

[Forextrader2361]

Chinese Yuan (Renminbi): How long will it be feasible for China

I heard China now holds $2 trillion; Rogoff asks if they really want to be holding
$4 trillion in five years?
How long will it be feasible for China to peg its currency to the dollar at a fixed exchange rate?

 

[piphoe]

Darn near impossible. The learning curve is brutal, hesitate to say even that because implies that its 'learnable' at all. Not like becoming a doctor, accountant, a plumber or electrician. Nothing like da da da da da, memorize THIS and you know your stuff. Go make $ Nope.

Biggest problem I have in a trade is not the loosers, I know those. It's the WINNERS! Where do I get out?

I know what your saying, "that's a nice problem to have"?

Well,

Stay in too long give it all back. and then some is a real issue I struggle with.

got to know when to get out your winners as well your loosers!

got to know both sides of YOUR coin, fear & greed (loosres & winners)

they both tug at you all day everyday!

i overcome the fear part, working on the greed part.

 

[dbphoenix]

Are you serious? Do you think anybody with stable consistently winning strategy will share their bread with you?

If you can draw a straight line . . .

 

[dbphoenix]

i overcome the fear part, working on the greed part.

Greed is simply another form of fear: fear of missing out, of not holding long enough, of being "shaken out" by anonymous participants.

On Fear

 

[piphoe]

i overcome the fear part, working on the greed part.[/QUOTE

Greed is simply another form of fear: fear of missing out, of not holding long enough, of being "shaken out" by anonymous participants.

On Fear

I've heard that some hate losses more and some hate leaving too much $ on the table. i'm of the latter.

do you have any insight that might help here, or any commentary about the psychology of this?

when in a winner can't get out, i'm always looking for the next leg up. or down.

they say "let your winners run", and I do to a fault

 

[dbphoenix]

I've heard that some hate losses more and some hate leaving too much $ on the table. i'm of the latter.

do you have any insight that might help here, or any commentary about the psychology of this?

when in a winner can't get out, i'm always looking for the next leg up. or down.

they say "let your winners run", and I do to a fault

The "psychology" of it has more to do with a lack of familiarity with one's instrument than with some mental deficiency. Once you've analyzed the behavior of your instrument when it's trending, psychology won't have anything to do with your choices, unless of course you fail to follow the results of your own work.

Select twenty trending days or periods within a day and note when activity slows, when the pace of movement declines, when the extent of each move begins to shorten, and what happens thereafter as a result. Know exactly what you're looking for -- the "tells", the markers -- and you'll have much less difficulty recognizing it when you see it. If and when you recognize it, you'll be more likely to know what to do with it.

 

[piphoe]

The "psychology" of it has more to do with a lack of familiarity with one's instrument than with some mental deficiency. Once you've analyzed the behavior of your instrument when it's trending, psychology won't have anything to do with your choices, unless of course you fail to follow the results of your own work.

Select twenty trending days or periods within a day and note when activity slows, when the pace of movement declines, when the extent of each move begins to shorten, and what happens thereafter as a result. Know exactly what you're looking for -- the "tells", the markers -- and you'll have much less difficulty recognizing it when you see it. If and when you recognize it, you'll be more likely to know what to do with it.

ok, that's one assignment that I can't see how it will help but i'll do this and report back in a month with what i see and learned.

no matter how this goes, thx for the input!

 

[Fugazsy]

Darn near impossible. The learning curve is brutal, hesitate to say even that because implies that its 'learnable' at all. Not like becoming a doctor, accountant, a plumber or electrician. Nothing like da da da da da, memorize THIS and you know your stuff. Go make $ Nope.

Biggest problem I have in a trade is not the loosers, I know those. It's the WINNERS! Where do I get out?

I know what your saying, "that's a nice problem to have"?

Well,

Stay in too long give it all back. and then some is a real issue I struggle with.

got to know when to get out your winners as well your loosers!

got to know both sides of YOUR coin, fear & greed (loosres & winners)

they both tug at you all day everyday!

i overcome the fear part, working on the greed part.

maybe you should use an objective way to get out, you can use an indicator, for example if you entered a short at overbought level exit when it gets to oversold and ticks up, if the reversal is strong you might take some partial profit at your time frame when it ticks up and take the rest when it ticks from O/S on a larger time frame.

 

[piphoe]

maybe you should use an objective way to get out, you can use an indicator, for example if you entered a short at overbought level exit when it gets to oversold and ticks up, if the reversal is strong you might take some partial profit at your time frame when it ticks up and take the rest when it ticks from O/S on a larger time frame.

hmmm, interesting ideas..:idea:

 

[Signalcalc]

Darn near impossible. The learning curve is brutal, hesitate to say even that because implies that its 'learnable' at all. Not like becoming a doctor, accountant, a plumber or electrician. Nothing like da da da da da, memorize THIS and you know your stuff. Go make $ Nope.

Biggest problem I have in a trade is not the loosers, I know those. It's the WINNERS! Where do I get out?

I know what your saying, "that's a nice problem to have"?

Well,

Stay in too long give it all back. and then some is a real issue I struggle with.

got to know when to get out your winners as well your loosers!

got to know both sides of YOUR coin, fear & greed (loosres & winners)

they both tug at you all day everyday!

i overcome the fear part, working on the greed part.

Do you have something that tells you when to get out of a losing trade? If so, then why not something that tells you when to take profit?

Do you have a trading plan? If not, then this would help to make those profit taking decisions for you.

 

[NVP]

Darn near impossible. The learning curve is brutal, hesitate to say even that because implies that its 'learnable' at all. Not like becoming a doctor, accountant, a plumber or electrician. Nothing like da da da da da, memorize THIS and you know your stuff. Go make $ Nope.

Biggest problem I have in a trade is not the loosers, I know those. It's the WINNERS! Where do I get out?

I know what your saying, "that's a nice problem to have"?

Well,

Stay in too long give it all back. and then some is a real issue I struggle with.

got to know when to get out your winners as well your loosers!

got to know both sides of YOUR coin, fear & greed (loosres & winners)

they both tug at you all day everyday!

i overcome the fear part, working on the greed part.

alongside the other comment in I would also look to split your contracts .................you can then peel out of a position as you make more and more profit.........50% of something is better than 100% of nothing if the trade spikes back on you

also take a look here re exits ........

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/forex/117416-best-exit-strategies-forex-market.html

N

 

[foroom lluzers]

The most important aspect of succesful trading is trading phsychology.Successful trading is 80% psychology and 20% methodology. Phsychology knowledge is a must for every beginner.If they find an edge or a method or any system , it will be totally useless , if they can not execute the edge ,without the right mindset.Human autonomic nervous system is not wired to handle stressful mental activities LIKE TRADING.When your brain does not function (phsychology) in real time , everything else is wort zero , because the brain can not give accurate commands to trade , as required by systems etc.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/psychology-risk-money-management/45686-trading-psychology.html

 

[piphoe]

The most important aspect of succesful trading is trading phsychology.Successful trading is 80% psychology and 20% methodology. Phsychology knowledge is a must for every beginner.If they find an edge or a method or any system , it will be totally useless , if they can not execute the edge ,without the right mindset.Human autonomic nervous system is not wired to handle stressful mental activities LIKE TRADING.When your brain does not function (phsychology) in real time , everything else is wort zero , because the brain can not give accurate commands to trade , as required by systems etc.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/psychology-risk-money-management/45686-trading-psychology.html

I don't know how anyone can apportion 80% of successful trading to psychology alone. Suggests that a valid edge is only one-fifth of success? The better my edge the less i need emotional fortitude. Your mind can be a steel trap but you will lose winning only 1 out of 5 trades where your (strong)mind is holding on to losing trades. Discretionary traders ie those that are not coded may need a stronger psyche to handle the drawdowns because they can't objectively define where its all going wrong.

I apportion discretionary successful trading at worst 70% edge/30% psyche.

 

[foroom lluzers]

I don't know how anyone can apportion 80% of successful trading to psychology alone. Suggests that a valid edge is only one-fifth of success? The better my edge the less i need emotional fortitude. Your mind can be a steel trap but you will lose winning only 1 out of 5 trades where your (strong)mind is holding on to losing trades. Discretionary traders ie those that are not coded may need a stronger psyche to handle the drawdowns because they can't objectively define where its all going wrong.

I apportion discretionary successful trading at worst 70% edge/30% psyche.

Technical trading is a very simple process .The hard part is the phsychology

Most people are not successful when it comes to trading. Why?

Van Tharp Phsychologist " At the most basic level, people must trade by processing information. Unfortunately, we're not very efficient information processors , realizing that trading/investing are very simple processes and we human beings try to make it into something much more complex. Those biases are all about adding complexity to the world.

Is it really that simple?

Consider the trading rules that work: 1) follow the trend; 2) let your profits run; 3) cut your losses short; and 4) manage your money (i.e. risk) so you can stay in the game. If you design something around following those rules, you'll make a lot of money. But when a great trader says, "That's what I do," the average person responds, "Yes, but tell me what your real secret is." This all about Trading Psychology , the hard part .

 

[piphoe]

Technical trading is a very simple process .The hard part is the phsychology

Most people are not successful when it comes to trading. Why?

Van Tharp Phsychologist " At the most basic level, people must trade by processing information. Unfortunately, we're not very efficient information processors , realizing that trading/investing are very simple processes and we human beings try to make it into something much more complex. Those biases are all about adding complexity to the world.

Is it really that simple?

Consider the trading rules that work: 1) follow the trend; 2) let your profits run; 3) cut your losses short; and 4) manage your money (i.e. risk) so you can stay in the game. If you design something around following those rules, you'll make a lot of money. But when a great trader says, "That's what I do," the average person responds, "Yes, but tell me what your real secret is." This all about Trading Psychology , the hard part .

sounds great.

a couple a Q's pls:

Define a trend.

'Define a good stop.

the rubber is where it's meets the road.

 

[foroom lluzers]

sounds great.

a couple a Q's pls:

Define a trend.

'Define a good stop.

the rubber is where it's meets the road.

This is a homage to those days of 'spank the bucket shop' which I enjoyed but did not participate. The idea was to put £100 into an account get the bucket shop to match it and tard it up to the max. Well they don't do that any more so its all my own money, all £300 (inflation you know).

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/trading-journals/222904-how-tard-can.html

This is like trading demo accounts

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/edu...ccounts-versus-real-accounts.html#post2890818

 

[postman]

This is a homage to those days of 'spank the bucket shop' which I enjoyed but did not participate. The idea was to put £100 into an account get the bucket shop to match it and tard it up to the max. Well they don't do that any more so its all my own money, all £300 (inflation you know).

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/trading-journals/222904-how-tard-can.html

This is like trading demo accounts

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/edu...ccounts-versus-real-accounts.html#post2890818

Its like trading demo accounts?

Apart from the fact
It IS real money and real profits.
It is real fills and not demo fills.

Apart from that its just like trading a demo account

Check out all the people who tried and failed to make it work in the links below. Have YOU tried it? If not you don't really know what your talking about!

Demo trading is easy according to you, and if it is just like demo trading, show us how easy it is and post your efforts.

 

[foroom lluzers]

Its like trading demo accounts?

Apart from the fact
It IS real money and real profits.
It is real fills and not demo fills.

Apart from that its just like trading a demo account

Check out all the people who tried and failed to make it work in the links below. Have YOU tried it? If not you don't really know what your talking about!

Demo trading is easy according to you, and if it is just like demo trading, show us how easy it is and post your efforts.

A small capital is like demo trading , like going to a casino without the emotions and phsychology , you won't experience real phsychology until you trade large accounts.The £300 loss means nothing , compared to net worth.


Trading is hard and a competitive mental sport , that is why they failed.

 

[foroom lluzers]

sounds great.

a couple a Q's pls:

Define a trend.A trend istwo sets of peaks and troughs , using 3 times higher time frame (than current time frame ) candles

'Define a good stop.below last 30 min bar low

the rubber is where it's meets the road.

That is only 20 % of trading success , anyone can give it to you for free in this high probability system word document

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/edu...y-trading-system-75-hit-rate.html#post2891164


There are 80 % more phsychological flaws which hit traders and one of them is here

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/psy.../45686-trading-psychology-13.html#post2892306