Stuart
Yes this trade is against the trend, but nearly all of the concept trades are. This pair has been traing within this channel since April, and going up and down. It may go as low as 16050 before getting any better, but the stop loss will make sure the trade is still going. It may take a few days to get going, but lets hope it does not do the same as GBDUSD, and keep going down past its 18month support.
Good luck everyone
Yes this trade is against the trend, but nearly all of the concept trades are. This pair has been traing within this channel since April, and going up and down. It may go as low as 16050 before getting any better, but the stop loss will make sure the trade is still going. It may take a few days to get going, but lets hope it does not do the same as GBDUSD, and keep going down past its 18month support.
Good luck everyone
Point taken. I think we have all been very careful in the past not to divulge trades until they have started, but in this case, we have.
It seems that we are caught up in our own concept discussion forum and forget that the reason for this thread was to find out if it was a scam, or any good. There are still people joining who are looking to buy the system.
It seems that we are caught up in our own concept discussion forum and forget that the reason for this thread was to find out if it was a scam, or any good. There are still people joining who are looking to buy the system.
Childish as usual
stevespray
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I wouldnt worry. Anyone worth their salt knows that exit points are generally regarded as being as, if not more, important that the trigger to enter.
Steve.
Arek Okrasa
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do we have to pay tax if we use broker from Luxemburg or Switzerland?
Hi Jason
Is it possible that spread betts comapnies are spikes Concept-FX orders? I am thinking of it beacuse on my platform (I am using IGindex) when the trade hits the bottom then its goes rapidly up. It seems like some huge guys knows our orders and just spike them. If it is possible maybe it is better to go direclty to the market - plays with brokers?
Of course playing with brokers we have to pay tax but at least spread betting companies won`t play against us.
And maybe we can open an account with a broker in Luxemburg or Switzerland and forget about paying any tax.
I don`t know realy but maybe someone knows if it is possible to avoid paying tax if you play with a broker from Switzerland or Luxemburg?
In my opinion Concept works but only someone spikes their orders...
Arek
Hi Jason
Is it possible that spread betts comapnies are spikes Concept-FX orders? I am thinking of it beacuse on my platform (I am using IGindex) when the trade hits the bottom then its goes rapidly up. It seems like some huge guys knows our orders and just spike them. If it is possible maybe it is better to go direclty to the market - plays with brokers?
Of course playing with brokers we have to pay tax but at least spread betting companies won`t play against us.
And maybe we can open an account with a broker in Luxemburg or Switzerland and forget about paying any tax.
I don`t know realy but maybe someone knows if it is possible to avoid paying tax if you play with a broker from Switzerland or Luxemburg?
In my opinion Concept works but only someone spikes their orders...
Arek
I just bought concept FX and entered my trades for the next week on IG Index. I would hope that they won't have their random spikes in prices, because in the email from concept they told me that they have a "loud voice" when it comes to trading on IG.
Also if you do find that your spread betting company is spiking prices you should just change. I am opening several accounts just in case this happens.
On that note can any of you recommend spread betting comapanies other than IG? The main function I want that IG offer is the Order to Open where you can place a limit and stop before the trade is trigured.
Also if you do find that your spread betting company is spiking prices you should just change. I am opening several accounts just in case this happens.
On that note can any of you recommend spread betting comapanies other than IG? The main function I want that IG offer is the Order to Open where you can place a limit and stop before the trade is trigured.
You can trade forex in the USA without having to pay US tax, unlike stock trading. But you are still required to declare your trading profits for UK income tax in the normal way. This would also apply to trading in any other countries where trading may be tax free.
The spiking problem will always be there, whatever the reason. I cannot see a way round it. Even if you are trading independently you still get the feeling they are waiting to get you! At one time I stopped using preset stops completely, but that is even worse.
I use CMC and Finspreads. Both offer "if done" or contingent orders. Both have very good platforms.
Arek
I dont believe that there are any individuals who can influence the forex markets to cause spikes with the spread bet companies. There are so many billions of $'s traded each day, that the concept trades do not matter to anyone. Even if we group up all 400 aleged users, and assume that they have a £25k bank, and risking 5%, that would only make a trade of £500k. spread accross many companies.
If the spread bet companies did find out about the trades, I doubt they could influence the markets to that level, and that would breach any FSA regulations.
Sometimes you win with the markets and sometimes you lose. It is just getting that edge, and we are using concept for it. They are on a losing run, but we hope that reverses soon, and comes back into profit.
Jason
I dont believe that there are any individuals who can influence the forex markets to cause spikes with the spread bet companies. There are so many billions of $'s traded each day, that the concept trades do not matter to anyone. Even if we group up all 400 aleged users, and assume that they have a £25k bank, and risking 5%, that would only make a trade of £500k. spread accross many companies.
If the spread bet companies did find out about the trades, I doubt they could influence the markets to that level, and that would breach any FSA regulations.
Sometimes you win with the markets and sometimes you lose. It is just getting that edge, and we are using concept for it. They are on a losing run, but we hope that reverses soon, and comes back into profit.
Jason
Jason what you say about the huge forex market is generally true, no doubt.
It is not that a spike is caused by a big individual trader, but that the forex brokers and the spreadbetting companies have it in their power to tweak the prices they themselves offer to their customers. It is a well recognised issue. They do have it in their power to just ease the price across a spot in the market where thay can see lots of stops placed. They are not obliged by the FSA to mirror the market exactly, they only stay close to the market because some customers are buying and some are selling. Same with indices. Take the CMC price for the FTSE 100 (which they expediently call the UK100 and say it is somewhere between a spot price and a future). It can be way off the FTSE 100 at the start of trading, because they anticipate the market moving in a particular direction. We are spreadbetting against the spreadbetting company price movements, not the pure market. Some spread betting companies give you a choice, to use their price or the market price, because there can be a difference especially if there is a sudden move.
When the market is moving you will often get a "requote", this is the SB company taking care of its own interests. You sometimes find a requote will be in your favour sometimes against you. But sure as anything the price quickly flips to the price you first thought of! I only take requotes which are favourable.
There is more to this than I am equipped to expound on. Anyone else know about it? Am I right or am I right?
The FSA may technically have some regulatory responsibility, but I doubt very much that they are tracking the SB price movements and tweakings, even if they should!! Spikes are a fact of life. And don't overlook the fact that they can also work in your favour, while working against someone else.
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Arek Okrasa
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Thank you SandyW!
I was on a training last Friday (with Online Academy) They use SaxoBank as a broker and they said that spread bett company will always find you if their interest is in danger. Thats way the may spike Concept orders. I was said that in City Index each trader has 4 screens to follow the main castomers move...and they wacht them carefuly...
So if you use CMC and the another...maybe they are not so quick or not many guys place Concept...but anyway - us you (we) said SB comapanies play against us but they never talk about it. What they tell you at the begining is: SB = tax free, but...
So I have to pay tax if I use a broker from another country...ach...
No good
Arek
I see - I started nice discusion about...
I was on a training last Friday (with Online Academy) They use SaxoBank as a broker and they said that spread bett company will always find you if their interest is in danger. Thats way the may spike Concept orders. I was said that in City Index each trader has 4 screens to follow the main castomers move...and they wacht them carefuly...
So if you use CMC and the another...maybe they are not so quick or not many guys place Concept...but anyway - us you (we) said SB comapanies play against us but they never talk about it. What they tell you at the begining is: SB = tax free, but...
So I have to pay tax if I use a broker from another country...ach...
No good
Arek
I see - I started nice discusion about...
Arek Okrasa
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Cmc-oco
Hello again
Sandy how do you place order with CMC. Do you use OCO and whats after - do you place your stop loss and limit) Sorry for the simple question but many guys using CMC - OCO without stop loss case they dont want to be spike by CMC.
Could you tell me about your exeprience, please...
Regards,
Arek
Hello again
Sandy how do you place order with CMC. Do you use OCO and whats after - do you place your stop loss and limit) Sorry for the simple question but many guys using CMC - OCO without stop loss case they dont want to be spike by CMC.
Could you tell me about your exeprience, please...
Regards,
Arek
Hi Arek! Good discussion.
For the Concept trades I usually use OCO to place the stop and the limit after the trade has opened and Concept have given us a limit. Concept usually give us only a stop before the trade triggers, so for a pending order I could only place an OCO order if I decided to set my own limit, which I sometimes do.
There is no safe way to avoid spikes. If you decide to place stops as market orders, you may not place them when you should. And of course you do not know a spike is a spike until it is finished. If you think the price is spiking you may be wrong, it may actually be the start of a big move against you. I, like everyone else, wish there were a solution!
Now maybe there is? At least one SB company (IG I think) offer what they call a bungee bet. But I don't know enough to advise you.
Slapshot
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Arek,
Spikes on CMC are a common occurance and usually the underlying market has no such move at all. This subject has been discussed on these boards before. It used to happen on the MSFT charts quite a lot.
Slapshot
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I know someone who trades for a firm that setup positions on news announcements, they are trading 4-5 thousand contracts at a time and hold the positions for 50-100 pips, the value of these contracts varies on the forex market but the minimum is usally $5 per contract. So with that in mind it gives you some idea of the financing involved, and they're just one firm.
Foresight and Hindsight
They are not moving the whole market! In fact the whole market is so big it simply cannot spike in the way we are talking about.
It is well recognised that forex brokers and SB cos make little spikes in their own favour and against their customers'. They don't all make the same spikes, in the same places. I think much of the problem stems from the fact that people place stop and limit orders, which give the brokers the insight they need to mess about. If the FSA (now there's a thought) required that all trading had to be done at market, or in open cry (!!!), I suspect the problem might go away. But the whole city would go out of business, wouldn't it.
Every time you place a limit or stop order, or a contingent order you are giving the SB co the one thing most traders crave. Foresight! We punters only get hindsight.
They are not moving the whole market! In fact the whole market is so big it simply cannot spike in the way we are talking about.
It is well recognised that forex brokers and SB cos make little spikes in their own favour and against their customers'. They don't all make the same spikes, in the same places. I think much of the problem stems from the fact that people place stop and limit orders, which give the brokers the insight they need to mess about. If the FSA (now there's a thought) required that all trading had to be done at market, or in open cry (!!!), I suspect the problem might go away. But the whole city would go out of business, wouldn't it.
Every time you place a limit or stop order, or a contingent order you are giving the SB co the one thing most traders crave. Foresight! We punters only get hindsight.
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