Brexit and the Consequences

The City slickers selling off the UK's best companies and pocketing the proceeds are welcome to live abroad.
That goes for foreign rich buying up the best British assets like properties too.
 
counter_violent said:
They didn't believe all our predictions made years in advance, yet here we are and zero signs of a return to political mainstream.

EU is as dead as the Brexit withdrawal deal(y)
Click to expand...

I think around a year ago, I said I'd give it 10-20 years, but judging the performance of the last couple of years, whatever change is going to happen could happen in half that time, so many structural and political problems for the EU to deal with to stay true to it's core ideology. Going to be an interesting ride with many twists and turns and powerplays along the way.
 
counter_violent said:
They didn't believe all our predictions made years in advance, yet here we are and zero signs of a return to political mainstream.

EU is as dead as the Brexit withdrawal deal(y)
Click to expand...

The Establishment Remainers, the EU and Theresa May have all overplayed their hands. Their deceit, obfuscation and baked-in dislike of democracy is now obvious to one and all. The so-called "best deal" will never be ratified, the electorate will never accept a "losers" vote and the unnelected EU Politburo think they are being very clever by putting their political principles before the best interests of their people. Looking back at history you would have thought the Europeans would have learnt by now?

Unless Sinn Fein take their seats at Westminster (highly unlikely but the Remain camp will resort to that if they thought they could get away with it) there isn't going to be a general election unless the Conservatives take complete leave of their senses (and I'm not sure if they haven't done that already) and anyway Corbyn looks a very dodgy prospect to very many people. So we are left with the law that says we have to leave on 29th March (thanks Gina Miller – I don't like your politics but you sure achieved something very good) and not enough time or voting power to pass something different. And thanks also to Theresa for holding that election that destroyed her majority and has now stopped her from steamrollering a bad deal through Parliament.

So we leave on WTO. The sky will not fall in – there will be a few showers – but we will be able to do what we want and British resourcefulness and inventiveness will carry the day. The EU will carry on in its downward spiral of protectionism and political cul-de-sacs.

Roll on 29th March !
 
Atilla said:
Why do you think he resigned?

He bigged him self up and lied to the British people.

Not much different from the Brexiteers who've promised shed loads and now expose the UK to decades of uncertainty and strife.
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I guessing he resigned through shame, the shame of having lost the vote, a failed Prime Minister, failed at his job, just as every Prime Minister that has failed at their job should resign, or anyone that fails at their job should resign.
 
He told lies that's why!

Osborne advised him he could lose.

That's the problem with these types. Blair included. It's impossible for them to be ever WRONG! Or the people's vote come to that matter. Or for Blair to go to war despite majority opposition and big demonstrations.

They are all perfect GODS who can walk on water.

I thought Labour guy on Andrew Marr prog explained really well along with Chuka.

1. Parliament should vote on the deal to get due process.

2. Labour to call vote of confidence
3. We have new elections which will effectively be the 2nd informed debate on Brexit. MPs get elected on their views. People decide who they want to vote for to represent them
4. Parliament carries out it's role delivering Brexit in timely fashion

5. If 2-4 does not happen, then peoples vote takes place with only two choices, assuming 1 is voted out by a majority of 60-40.

Question 1 - Maintain current status quo of UK in EU
Question 2 - Leave the EU on WTO based rules and work towards what ever deals Brexiteers feel good for UK.

MAYBE Question 3 - fwiw if vote in Parliament on Withdrawal Agreement (1 above) is anything marginal in the 50s, have it as a third Question.

Perhaps similare to the French system, have two options primary and secondary. If no clear winner, in the first round, then in teh second round allocate the the 3rd lowest votes to the secondary preferences on the ballot sheet.


Job done!


(y)
 
Atilla said:
Question 1 - Maintain current status quo of UK in EU
Question 2 - Leave the EU on WTO based rules and work towards what ever deals Brexiteers feel good for UK.

MAYBE Question 3 - fwiw if vote in Parliament on Withdrawal Agreement (1 above) is anything marginal in the 50s, have it as a third Question.

Perhaps similare to the French system, have two options primary and secondary. If no clear winner, in the first round, then in teh second round allocate the the 3rd lowest votes to the secondary preferences on the ballot sheet.


Job done!


(y)
Click to expand...

There are a couple of dangerous assumptions that remainers are making with this 2nd referendum idea, dangerous for themselves that is!

Because they couldn't believe that their own hype about remaining hadn't been believed and they lost the vote, they then assumed that people that voted to leave had got it wrong, 1st wrong assumption, but blinded by their own righteousness, they embarked on a losers crusade to reverse the result, even Gina Miller's attempt has backfired on her (so far), although this is debatable given that the Tories are trying to remain.

The 2nd wrong assumption is that the people will vote remain a second time around, following the example of other countries when people have been forced to vote in a 2nd referendum. I wouldn't be so sure, I think they will stab themselves in the back and the vote will be in even more favour to leave.

The Tory leadership, I suspect, know this, otherwise being the remainers that they are, they would have called a 2nd referendum with no hesitation if there was a chance to remain. They have deliberately bungled Brexit so that it is likely it will be delayed at the very least, if not cancelled. Calling a referendum risks their remain plans as it could go all the leave way, why would they need that when things are actually going well for them?

If a second referendum is called, then loading the questions in favour of remain is only asking for trouble, even if it got to that stage, where a vote to remain resulted, the issue of leaving the EU is not going to go away anytime soon, a majority want out, that's what needs to be delivered.

Rest assured, if we remain it will be because of parliament, not because of a second referendum, there is too much at stake now that the UK is intertwined with the EU in the areas of defence, intelligence and security, it's just a geo-political powerplay.

Any time Blair get's involved, then you know it's all about the elite, bankers, power and money and nothing to do with citizens.
 
Last edited:
Signalcalc said:
There are a couple of dangerous assumptions that remainers are making with this 2nd referendum idea, dangerous for themselves that is!

Because they couldn't believe that their own hype about remaining hadn't been believed and they lost the vote, they then assumed that people that voted to leave had got it wrong, 1st wrong assumption, but blinded by their own righteousness, they embarked on a losers crusade to reverse the result, even Gina Miller's attempt has backfired on her (so far), although this is debatable given that the Tories are trying to remain.

The 2nd wrong assumption is that the people will vote remain a second time around, following the example of other countries when people have been forced to vote in a 2nd referendum. I wouldn't be so sure, I think they will stab themselves in the back and the vote will be in even more favour to leave.

The Tory leadership, I suspect, know this, otherwise being the remainers that they are, they would have called a 2nd referendum with no hesitation if there was a chance to remain. They have deliberately bungled Brexit so that it is likely it will be delayed at the very least, if not cancelled. Calling a referendum risks their remain plans as it could go all the leave way, why would they need that when things are actually going well for them?

If a second referendum is called, then loading the questions in favour of remain is only asking for trouble, even if it got to that stage, where a vote to remain resulted, the issue of leaving the EU is not going to go away anytime soon, a majority want out, that's what needs to be delivered.

Rest assured, if we remain it will be because of parliament, not because of a second referendum, there is too much at stake now that the UK is intertwined with the EU in the areas of defence, intelligence and security, it's just a geo-political powerplay.

Any time Blair get's involved, then you know it's all about the elite, bankers, power and money and nothing to do with citizens.
Click to expand...


Not making any assumptions matey.

Seeking clarification to make sure we really get what people have voted for and not led by politicians chasing power.

If we follow a process which is clearly now outlined then let it be. I would like to think the mass public are well saturated with what Brexit will mean to them.
 
Signalcalc said:
There are a couple of dangerous assumptions that remainers are making with this 2nd referendum idea, dangerous for themselves that is! . . .
Click to expand...
Good post Sig',
I think there's another consequence of their assumptions that (so far) remainers calling for a 2nd referendum are overlooking. Although the prospect of it is clearly gaining traction, I just can't see it taking place with just two remain options on the ballot paper - as Vince Cable, Caroline Lucas and others want. (I.e. Remain and Mrs. May's lousy deal.) For the sake of argument, let's suppose that a 2nd referendum is called and it's a straight re-run of the first one in 2016. Remainers are buoyed by a shift in their favour in the polls and believe they'll win it. Whilst this may be true, what they're not taking into account are the majority of 'soft' remainers (as opposed to the minority of remoaners) who accept that leave won first time around and feel that having another referendum is undemocratic. This group could be quite large and significant numbers of them might be persuaded to put their democratic principles above their political beliefs and to vote leave second time around. If that were to happen and leave won with an increased majority - the whole Brexit debate would be put to bed for good and everyone could then move on. IMO, that's a strong sales pitch for Brexiteers that the remain campaign will struggle to address.
Tim.
 
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