Brexit and the Consequences

Kaeso said:
Absolutely! what a fool. I didn't need to read beyond this filth:

The Lib Dem leader went to say too many older voters were driven by "nostalgia for a world where passports were blue, faces were white and the map was coloured imperial pink. And it was their votes on one wet day in June which crushed the hopes and aspirations of young people for years to come"

:cheesy:
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If Uncle Vince had been a Conservative Euro-sceptic, the Thought Police would probably have come for him by now and had him locked up for Racism!

Meanwhile he's still free to peddle his nonsense - but thankfully, it's a free country and he's entitled to his views. John Stuart Mill would have been proud.
 
Atilla said:
Italy’s Post-Election Mess Laid Bare in Day of Chaos and Clashes

Not so good for the Italian markets. I'm sure they must all be wondering what they have done and where it'll all lead to?


Let's stop and think about this for one short minute. :whistling
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Up to a point Lord Copper:

Being foreign, the Italians not only speak funny but have strange manners and customs too. Politics there is more of a sport (or a pass-time) than the endless grim mutual recriminations of BritPol. The Italians understand their game and the fact that there probably won't be a functioning government for a while (or that the new one will push the number of governments since the war to something over 60) does not mean that the world will end for them. Quite the contrary, despite what the rest of the world might think, in Italy it's just more of the same. When the media get bored then we'll go back to fretting about the current independence movement on Anglesey and the Italians will continue making excellent coffee and doing what Italians do.
 
cantagril said:
Up to a point Lord Copper:

Being foreign, the Italians not only speak funny but have strange manners and customs too. Politics there is more of a sport (or a pass-time) than the endless grim mutual recriminations of BritPol. The Italians understand their game and the fact that there probably won't be a functioning government for a while (or that the new one will push the number of governments since the war to something over 60) does not mean that the world will end for them. Quite the contrary, despite what the rest of the world might think, in Italy it's just more of the same. When the media get bored then we'll go back to fretting about the current independence movement on Anglesey and the Italians will continue making excellent coffee and doing what Italians do.
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If South North divide n political deviations werent enough we have rise of left right ideologies.

Cooking pot full of all kinda pasta too.

Lots jubilation followed by more uncertainty and factions for business to thrive or decline in.

Let's all party.
 
Atilla said:
These kind of attacks are increasing.

Very sad story indeed.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-43413487

Consequences of Brexit post referendum.

Sad ugly face of latent evil.

:cry::cry::cry:


Passed out
Miss Moustafa's uncle told the BBC he believed a group of about 10 girls had started beating his niece before she ran to get on a bus.

He said the girls kept beating her until she passed out and a man intervened to help.

Her younger sister, Mallak Moustafa, said her sibling told her how the attack unfolded before she went into a coma.

"My sister couldn't see as she'd been hit in the head but then as soon as she saw our bus coming, she ran to it, trying to get on it," she said.

"She got on to the bus, she didn't think they'd all pay £1 to get on but they went up to her when she'd sat down and said they weren't finished with her.

"Then the girls kept saying punch her more, punch her more. Then she couldn't see what was going on."
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A very sad attack and a waste of a young life.

I'm failing to see how this is a result of the Brexit referendum though, not a mention of Brexit in the report and the Police are keeping an open mind but don't believe it is racially or hate motivated, nor do they mention who the suspected perps are other than a group of about 10 girls.

How are you making the link to Brexit and what do you mean when you state 'these kind of attacks', what kind of attack is it Att?
 
More bad news...

Aloof British government helped steer Unilever to Rotterdam


Not many jobs going with this move but still why the change?

UK policy on hostile take overs seem to be one key reason. We've had this many times before.

Instead of protecting key industries UK can't wait to sell them off because it is good for what or whom exactly?





https://www.ft.com/content/7a85ee0a-286d-11e8-b27e-cc62a39d57a0

Unilever’s road to Rotterdam — the site chosen for its new single legal base — began with a hostile takeover bid from Kraft Heinz, in the chaotic aftermath of the Brexit vote.

Paul Polman, Unilever’s Dutch chief executive, was to describe $143bn shock approach from the US company, as “a near-death experience”.*

Yet none of this seemed to matter much to the UK government.




Same bunch of clowns who trumpet free markets will tell you these kinds of buy outs are good for the country. Think chocolates, pottery and glass. World giants sold off and now doing well in other countries.


Bunch of highly rich and well educated morons imho.


Beware of fake real news and who's arguing for national interest is all I can say. Look at the facts and what's happening on the ground. :idea:
 
Signalcalc said:
Question is, what is the link between Skripal and Brexit?
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Well Sig', your question may be rhetorical and in jest but there are those who would argue (not me, needless to say) that Britain's decision to leave the EU makes it isolated and, as such, vulnerable. Theoretically, we can no longer rely upon our EU allies to support us in our dealings with Russia which gives Putin and his ilk carte blanche to do pretty much whatever they like. So yes, there will be some remainers who will make the link and, furthermore, postulate that the attack on Sergei and Yulia Skripal would not have have happened if we'd done the 'right' and 'sensible' thing and voted to stay in the EU.
Tim.
 
timsk said:
Well Sig', your question may be rhetorical and in jest but there are those who would argue (not me, needless to say) that Britain's decision to leave the EU makes it isolated and, as such, vulnerable. Theoretically, we can no longer rely upon our EU allies to support us in our dealings with Russia which gives Putin and his ilk carte blanche to do pretty much whatever they like. So yes, there will be some remainers who will make the link and, furthermore, postulate that the attack on Sergei and Yulia Skripal would not have have happened if we'd done the 'right' and 'sensible' thing and voted to stay in the EU.
Tim.
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If future "support" from the EU members turns out to be anything like that during Nato's history against the Soviet bloc then it'll probably be quite worthless - all talk , no action, no money! The European support against Comrade Vlad so far has been surprisingly strong - but talk is easy!

With Agent Cob & his mates here to make Vlad look like the nice guy anything could happen.
 
This interview gives a slightly different angle to the big bad Putin, is he being played like a puppet by the real Russian warlords ? Im in no doubt he is corrupt to the core along with the other 99% of his Kremlin buddies....Dangerous man fronting an aggressive regime.

 
Tim, I'm a Remainer but I do not believe that Putin is doing this because of any isolation caused by Brexit. He has been taking the **** out of the US, too, and they are a very formidable nation to oppose.

This is another international incident, just like many, and I am too old, myself, to be worried by it.

I am convinced that we are all going to blow ourselves to hell, sooner or later, anyway.

This could be a terrorist group out to cause trouble between the great powers. Nerve gas? Saddam Hussein killed thousands of Kurds with it, years ago. I'd say that it was, pretty much, old hat.
 
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sminicooper said:
I think most politicians start out with good intentions and in the main are decent people – and actually, despite the headlines that we all tend to take most note of, most of them remain that way. However, as they say – power corrupts ..... and you know the rest!

The problem for politicians is that if they tell the truth the electorate don't like it – we are just the same as traders aren't we? Hardest thing in the world is to accept the fact that you've made a balls-up of your trade. Nobody likes the truth – fantasyland is a much easier proposition.

So Joe Gullible Public believes what he likes the sound of best. And there you go .... :)

I've long thought that as a general electorate we get the politicians we deserve.
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This is from the Trump thread. Could not resist borrowing it as it sounds much like Eurosceptic politician promises to the British electorate.

Alternatively, it is what is often referred to as having ones cake and eating it.

We can do this if we close our eyes and wish very very hard. You know it makes sense :)
 
Splitlink said:
Tim, I'm a Remainer but I do not believe that Putin is doing this because of any isolation caused by Brexit. He has been taking the **** out of the US, too, and they are a very formidable nation to oppose.

This is another international incident, just like many, and I am too old, myself, to be worried by it.

I am convinced that we are all going to blow ourselves to hell, sooner or later, anyway.

This could be a terrorist group out to cause trouble between the great powers. Nerve gas? Saddam Hussein killed thousands of Kurds with it, years ago. I'd say that it was, pretty much, old hat.
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Hate to disagree re: Russia here with you Split, but do concur with your better remain sentiments.

Re: Russia, it is the US and the West that make Russia to be the bogey man. In fact state defence budgets need a new common threat / enemy to justify budgets. Otherwise more cuts on the way as just not many wars as there used to be. Not good for the metal business is it? Who believes Russia is the biggest threat UK faces today? A little like the 45min dossier with Iraq pointing WMD weapons at the UK. Really?

The US created Al-Qaida and once it had served its purpose destroyed it. That was the Iraq / 9-11 inside job fiasco blamed on Osama bin ladin the Great Saudi relation.

The US & UK created ISIS to over-throw Assad, as part of neo-cons great axis of evil project to claim last known big oil reserves between Iran / Iraq and pointed out Syria as another one of those evils.

Russia has put a stop to US destabilising and raping the ME. US not happy. UK the US sidekick much the same. Iran also on the radar. Just a matter of time before attention turns to fessing up Iran as well.

US has been waging war on Russia for yonks. Whether it is concerted effort to bring about reduction in price of gold and oil or attacking Russian interest in Ukraine trying to overthrow a legitimate government with promise of EU riches and money or putting Nato tanks up in front of Russia's border it's all the same story. US defending freedoms!!! Really. Russia and China are already free and citizens travel as they like. Why is it any bother to us anyhow. Especially with all our migration problems. Before we were helping to get them out. I suggest we keep them in. What a silly topsy turvy world we live in. ;)

Difficult to judge for British people to know what really is going on. I doubt with the exception of a handful of peeps anyone really knows. What I do feel strongly about is it will not be what our leaders tell us is the case.

We are told military grade Russian nerve gas was used? Well how can they know that if they don't know where it comes from? The reality is apparently these particles are exchanged by Russia and US and could easily have been borrowed or stashed away for future use. They could ofcourse be reproduced. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-43377698

I feel US and UK has most to benefit from this kind of stuff to gain public endorsement for building a case against Russia and Syria. In fact chemical weapons have been used in Syria and on one case when Russia provided evidence whilst the West "true press" just blamed it was obviously Syria and not the blood curdling ISIS, chopping off heads and burning people in cages. Surely ISIS wouldn't gas their own kind? Would they?

Michael Portillo also made an interesting and plausible reference, suggesting it is possible US and UK intelligence services have been having a lot of success against the GRU and this could be simply a message for potential spies that selling national secrets will not be tolerated.

I find it a bit of a joke US accusing Russia of meddling in US elections as US and UK over throw elected governments under the banner of bringing liberal democracy to tyrannical governments in some B & C story about how we are the good guys and they are the bad. Even Margaret Thatcher's son was employed in the business of overthrowing governments and sadly got caught red handed doing it.

Then there is the criminal elements settling scores as if the UK MI6 or US Black Ops private army of capitalistic missionaries are not the same or just as bad.

Sad aspect of this - is probably that someone somewhere fessed up big time as a British police officer who went to help got caught up in the private settlement. Sleepy Salisbury which I too have very fond memories of is not the place to carry out such acts. However, I'm now wondering if the particles were in her daughters suitcase, whether calculations went tits up. Weren't they supposed to open the suitcase up in London or some other place. Was it not just supposed to be the daughter on her own to get him to shut up having lost his son as well. Who knows?

Really no one knows what happened but I do find UK response OT. That is of course unless you look at it from MI6 pov. If UK doesn't respond how will they ever recruit Russian's to spy for them? Make there job impossible. Peter Wright wrote one book and MoD said no no no. Anyone read it? So dull and boring - all he talks about is magnetic tape recording devices and watching people come and go from Russian Consulate. On the other we take their spies, give them lots of money, education wine and dine and make sure children go to top schools.

By the way - everyone keeps referring to that McFly series too as if it lends any credence to the story. I strongly suspect that too was calculated well ahead of the event with this act to take place just before elections.

It all smacks of some big orchestrated public manipulation setup to me. It's not private purely public. Very public indeed.

People see what they want to see. Mikhail Khodorkovsky a billionaire sees criminal elements. Well he would do as he is a business man.

Talking of criminal elements - here is just one example. Dick Cheney's Halliburton and Iraq. The guy made literally billions. His 5m company went to 500m and then to 20bn + http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/28/us/a-closer-look-at-cheney-and-halliburton.html

Guys a mafiozi of the highest order and he gets a medal of honour for serving country, killing people and sacrificing US marines for the profit of his company.

I do feel UK is over playing hand here. And where is US exactly when we need them. Or France? Or the EU?


I'm sure they are counting how much money they can attract to their countries. At least EU anyhow. We should be seeing lots of brochures telling Russian oligarchs just what a fabulous place Paris or Frankfurt can be at this time of the year with spring in the air. :whistling


Just my tuppence worth. Not really a Brexit story but it has potential. (y)
 
Atilla said:
Hate to disagree re: Russia here with you Split, but do concur with your better remain sentiments.

Re: Russia, it is the US and the West that make Russia to be the bogey man. In fact state defence budgets need a new common threat / enemy to justify budgets. Otherwise more cuts on the way as just not many wars as there used to be. Not good for the metal business is it? Who believes Russia is the biggest threat UK faces today? A little like the 45min dossier with Iraq pointing WMD weapons at the UK. Really?

:
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I think that this six to one and half-a-dozen to the other.

What does Russia make for world wide consumers? Fridges, washers, cars, cornflakes? The answer is nothing. The Russians are the same as the North Koreans.

The only thing that keeps Putin and the oligarchs in power is Russian patriotism.
TM expelling 23 diplomats makes Putin an extremely happy man. He says to the masses, "You see? The Western block are all against Mother Russia. As usual! If it's not Trump and the CIA, its Syria or gassing restaurants in Salisbury."

He's coming up for re-election, shortly. The Russians love him, even though their standard of living is among the world's lowest.

So, sanctions and banning world football-----bring it on! The more, the better Putin likes it!

At the same time, TM is, probably banking on the fact that some eastern members, ie. Poland, are a bit nervous of having Russia so close. EU needs everybody in on Brexit. TM, probably, needs a few vetos, here and there, so stirring up a little fear and uncertainty will help.

All good, political, stuff. :D
 
Splitlink said:
I think that this six to one and half-a-dozen to the other.

What does Russia make for world wide consumers? Fridges, washers, cars, cornflakes? The answer is nothing. The Russians are the same as the North Koreans.

The only thing that keeps Putin and the oligarchs in power is Russian patriotism.
TM expelling 23 diplomats makes Putin an extremely happy man. He says to the masses, "You see? The Western block are all against Mother Russia. As usual! If it's not Trump and the CIA, its Syria or gassing restaurants in Salisbury."

He's coming up for re-election, shortly. The Russians love him, even though their standard of living is among the world's lowest.

So, sanctions and banning world football-----bring it on! The more, the better Putin likes it!

At the same time, TM is, probably banking on the fact that some eastern members, ie. Poland, are a bit nervous of having Russia so close. EU needs everybody in on Brexit. TM, probably, needs a few vetos, here and there, so stirring up a little fear and uncertainty will help.

All good, political, stuff. :D
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Gold, oil and gas and let's not forget military might and hardened people to adversity. Oh and they happen to be in Asia where all the growth is taking place in alliance with China. Soft power is working very well for Russia and China. I hardly think Russia is like N.Korea. You've been reading too many fiction books. ;)

The culprit are the West here not Russia. Russia stopped ISIS and is restoring order to Syria. Why should West decide if Assad should go or stay? Why don't they tell Saudi King to go and do this or that. Being allies one would imagine they have more sway.

I've lost count how many Iranian nuclear physicists have been assassinated or just lifted off the streets. Or even German citizens killed by Mossad agents for helping Iraq build long guns.

How would you feel if Iran or Russia were to start knocking off some Western scientists.

One rule for one and another rule for the rest. Do you not see all these duplicity and hypocrisy that is played out day after day?

All good political stuff yes maybe but no backbone or competition in the West crying foul when they don't like their own tactics.
 
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Brexit Truce didn't last long in cabinet then did it.

Johnson Contradicts May Over Court's Role in U.K. After Brexit

I don't think Johnson Blabber Mouth Boris understand how the EU or ECJ or Treaty of Rome works for that matter. What is this guy on?


“We’re not going to have the influence of the European Court of Justice, that’s just BBC claptrap, we’re not going to be paying in after we come out,” Johnson said on the BBC’s “Andrew Marr Show” on Sunday. “Yes there will be an implementation period, but after we come out we’ll have what is effectively a gigantic free trade deal with all sorts of bolt-ons, and the advantage of the new arrangements is that it will be possible for either side to do things differently, to do things in their own way.”



:LOL::LOL::LOL::LOL:

Gigantic Trade Deal. Much like H U G E financial hole that'll be left in EU budgets after UK leaves and stops paying..

Gigantic and HUGE mega promises full of BS with no meaning facts or numbers other than... well... wet wishful dreams.



Exactly the kind of words SuperMC likes the sound of. :cheesy:
 
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