Brexit and the Consequences

[tomorton]

I know as much about Spain as the average Brit knows about the UK.

Do you know of any breakaway nation that did not break the law of the central government?

After democracy was reinstated a Constitution was drawn up, of which Cataluña was a part. Referendums on independence are illegal. That's as much as I know, really.

What I would say is that Rajoy has to realise, as should have realised previous governments, that he is governing a group of nations, here. Without looking up on Google, I can think of four languages. ie Catalan, Basque, Gallego and, of course, Castellano. I'm sure that there are many more.

This is like Yugoslavia. Tito held it together. When he died it broke up. Madrid is in danger of that happening here.

He is doing very well with the economy. So did Cameron and the British Conservatives but it needs a lot more than that, to govern Spain as a single unit.

It still seems like he was using the police force to prevent an opinion poll which had no mandate on the Spanish government (nor the Catalan one for that matter). He walked right into it.

 

[timsk]

It still seems like he was using the police force to prevent an opinion poll which had no mandate on the Spanish government (nor the Catalan one for that matter). He walked right into it.

Aye Tom - agree completely.

I imagine that the images on British TV last night were broadcast around the world. Sadly, they reflect extremely badly on the Spanish government. When the police are filmed dragging women by their hair and throwing pensioners to the ground - merely for casting a vote - it's a very sorry state of affairs indeed. Moreover, it's an object lesson in exactly what not to do. The net result is that pretty well everyone now sympathizes with the Catalan people and their quest for independence - even those who think it's a bad idea and don't want it to happen.
Tim.

 

[counter_violent]

If the EU hadn't been so politically dogmatic and had just offered Dave a few tasty morsels, then he possibly wouldn't have lost the referendum.

There is no advantage to the Politburo's way of thinking in giving us any kind of reasonable deal. That is why we should walk away now and make our own arrangements. Time is running out and May and her ilk are incapable of dealing with it. That's why we need somebody else.

A strong leader would have very quickly formulated a plan, communicated it and most importantly, stuck to it. (the Thatcher way)

What we have with May is a second rate politician who has accidentally ended up in the top job!

Brexit and the UK's future is far too important and cannot be left to chance. The situation demands leadership and competency and the only candidate I can see at this time is Mogg.

A fine example of how to deal with an idiot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=23&v=D9bboue6EUg

 

[Atilla]

Hi dbp,
It's very true to say that a great many people all over the world are tired of being f*cked over. However, sometimes it is crystal clear exactly who it is that's doing the f*cking (the EU), as is the person or persons getting f*cked (the U.K.). Now, I quite see that it's irrelevant to you and your fellow countrywo/men in the U.S. as to whether or not we remain or leave the EU - but I assure you it's very relevant to those of us who live here and/or in Europe. Here's why . . .

By way of example as to just how unreasonable the EU is - look no further than Michel Barnier's insistence that EU nationals living in the U.K. post March 2019 should be governed by EU law rather than U.K. law. That's crazy. When I go to Spain and hire a car, I have to have hi-viz jackets, a warning triangle and replacement light bulbs - because Spanish law demands it. I don't moan about it because it's not the law here in the U.K. and I wouldn't use that as a defense if I was stopped by the Spanish police. It's right and proper that when in Spain that I abide by the laws of that country - even though they may differ to the laws here in the U.K. It's just simple common sense - to everyone other than Michel Barnier and the EU that is.
Tim.

Need to stop, pause and have a fink ear!

Whilst what you say may sound logical, it is also the case that EU standards are higher and there to protect people like you and others from you and you from them. That's logical do you not see? Especially, when one is driving along not well lit country roads in places like Spain and Portugal!

Then there are people like you and Nigel Lawson who'll trumpet sovereignty whilst happily living else where.

There is also the case that more elderly UK citizens retire abroad seeking medical help whilst young people come to work in the UK requiring less but you and UKIP will hold the view they are eating up resources on the NHS.

Really it beggars belief the inacccurate beliefs that are spread around the place.


Moreover, ECJ has greater protection and rights of the individual than our Parliament does and yet people want to be governed by the very people who chooses to restrict their freedoms.


Then of course we have the independence vote for the poor Catalonians who's freedoms have been severely contained and perhaps they should take it to ECJ and see what comes back if they don't have faith in the Spanish courts.


The whole debacle is a stupid farce. Gotta laf.

 

[counter_violent]

Need to stop, pause and have a fink ear!

Whilst what you say may sound logical, it is also the case that EU standards are higher and there to protect people like you and others from you and you from them. That's logical do you not see? Especially, when one is driving along not well lit country roads in places like Spain and Portugal!

Then there are people like you and Nigel Lawson who'll trumpet sovereignty whilst happily living else where.

There is also the case that more elderly UK citizens retire abroad seeking medical help whilst young people come to work in the UK requiring less but you and UKIP will hold the view they are eating up resources on the NHS.

Really it beggars belief the inacccurate beliefs that are spread around the place.


Moreover, ECJ has greater protection and rights of the individual than our Parliament does and yet people want to be governed by the very people who chooses to restrict their freedoms.


Then of course we have the independence vote for the poor Catalonians who's freedoms have been severely contained and perhaps they should take it to ECJ and see what comes back if they don't have faith in the Spanish courts.


The whole debacle is a stupid farce. Gotta laf.

Well, you keep laughing while everything is collapsing around you. The EU is falling apart and you are laughing. It's all very strange.

 

[Stormy42]

Truth is that no one knows what will happen. The worst case is that economy holds stable and does not move. Very bad for trading! Best case is that economy totally craps down, we can make allot of money then.

 

[Stormy42]

Hopefully economy will collapse in massive way. Traders then make plenty of money.

 

[timsk]

Hi Atilla,

Need to stop, pause and have a fink ear!

Yes, you do!

Whilst what you say may sound logical, it is also the case that EU standards are higher and there to protect people like you and others from you and you from them. That's logical do you not see? Especially, when one is driving along not well lit country roads in places like Spain and Portugal!

To borrow dbp's favourite word - whether EU standards are higher or lower than those in the U.K. - is totally irrelevant.

Then there are people like you and Nigel Lawson who'll trumpet sovereignty whilst happily living else where.

No idea where Nigel Lawson lives but, as you know, I live in south Devon.

There is also the case that more elderly UK citizens retire abroad seeking medical help whilst young people come to work in the UK requiring less but you and UKIP will hold the view they are eating up resources on the NHS.

Putting words into other people's mouths is rarely ever wise. If you'd care to check through the thread you'll see that I've made a point of welcoming imigrants into the U.K. As for UKIP - I have no affiliation to them - never voted for them and never will.

Really it beggars belief the inacccurate beliefs that are spread around the place.

Sorry Atilla, I'm afraid you've lost me (again), what's this got to do with my post?

Moreover, ECJ has greater protection and rights of the individual than our Parliament does and yet people want to be governed by the very people who chooses to restrict their freedoms.

Again, this is irrelavant. Look at it this way: would you go anywhere in the world and demand to be judged not by the laws of the host country but by the ECJ? Good luck with that! That won't work anywhere else in the world - why on earth should the U.K. be any different?

Then of course we have the independence vote for the poor Catalonians who's freedoms have been severely contained and perhaps they should take it to ECJ and see what comes back if they don't have faith in the Spanish courts.

Well, the ECJ is stuck between a rock and a hard place: they'll be trying to appeal to both sides without pi$$ing either of them off.

The whole debacle is a stupid farce. Gotta laf.

If you're referring to the Catalan referendum - there's not much to laugh about that I can see.
Tim.

 

[Stormy42]

I am waiting for this every day, Truth is not nice. Its just how things are.

Just face it. Traders want to make money. Period. Collapse of economy assures this. Just get ready

I made allot of profit in 2007/8

Not proud of it, but it has got me where I am today. Down markets are much better than Bull.

 

[Atilla]

Hi Atilla,
Yes, you do!


To borrow dbp's favourite word - whether EU standards are higher or lower than those in the U.K. - is totally irrelevant. Of course it isn't. Everyone aspires for higher standards. Whether it's food, air and water hygiene or pollution. You saying so doesn't make it irrelevant either.

No idea where Nigel Lawson lives but, as you know, I live in south Devon. He lives in France, similar to you who enjoys Spain and Portugal no big deal. Those safety requirements you know make sense.

Putting words into other people's mouths is rarely ever wise. If you'd care to check through the thread you'll see that I've made a point of welcoming imigrants into the U.K. As for UKIP - I have no affiliation to them - never voted for them and never will.No but if I recall other than fishery policy, you did state migrants using NHS resources was one of the main reasons for voting brexit.

Sorry Atilla, I'm afraid you've lost me (again), what's this got to do with my post?

Again, this is irrelavant. Look at it this way: would you go anywhere in the world and demand to be judged not by the laws of the host country but by the ECJ? Good luck with that! That won't work anywhere else in the world - why on earth should the U.K. be any different? It's simply a security policy by the EU. Why not? Just arbitrary agreement. By the same token UK citizen will be liable to UK law when in Rome. No big deal.

Well, the ECJ is stuck between a rock and a hard place: they'll be trying to appeal to both sides without pi$$ing either of them off. I think you'll find UK law will be under direction of ECJ law what ever the politicians tell you to fudge the issue. Wakey wakey.

If you're referring to the Catalan referendum - there's not much to laugh about that I can see.
Tim.

Consider the Catalan's referendum re:Independence from Spain but choose to be full member of EU with all the single currency, political union and ECJ apparatus etc. You don't think that's funny in any way?

You've got to ask do they know what they are doing?

Do you not see any contradictions in their vote for independence whilst desiring full membership of EU?


http://www.express.co.uk/news/world...dependence-spain-brussels-rajoy-juncker-piris

 

[timsk]

. . . Do you not see any contradictions in their vote for independence whilst desiring full membership of EU? . . .

Yeah, absolutely. But, as I've already said, I don't support their bid for independence: it makes no sense to me at all.
Tim.

 

[counter_violent]

Listen to some real experts. Not pretend Ones like Atilla.


https://www.facebook.com/Westmonste...NiTLYUFH1_lV7eBBjA8&fref=gs&hc_location=group

 

[counter_violent]

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/4408319/theresa-may-brexit-uk-eu-divorce-bill/

Sorry to mention the petition again Tim , but looks as though the EU owes us money to leave

 

[Atilla]

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/4408319/theresa-may-brexit-uk-eu-divorce-bill/

Sorry to mention the petition again Tim , but looks as though the EU owes us money to leave

Here is a bit of made up news from the Sun. Absolutely fecking unbelievable piece of reporting.


‘YOU’RE ALL GOING TO DIE’Cops nab gran after woman screamed warning at Las Vegas crowd before deadly shooting

She is believed to have travelled to Las Vegas with the shooter


I guess it matches your level of attention and appetite to feed your perverse beliefs :whistling


The BBC reports the following.

Paddock lived in Mesquite with Marilou Danley. Police have interviewed her but say she does not appear to have been involved as she was out of the country. They are hoping to speak to her again.


You probably find the Sun good source of information I'm sure. Daily diet of BS for those with brains in vegetative state. Keep taking your vitamins.

 

[counter_violent]

Better quality vids from the bruges group meeting today in Manchester.

So, listen up Atilla. This is proper economics from people who know their stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Uofq5coWfo&t=69s

 

[counter_violent]

More trouble for the EU.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world...ej-Babis-ANO-party-latest-Czech-republic-poll

 

[Splitlink]

Yeah, absolutely. But, as I've already said, I don't support their bid for independence: it makes no sense to me at all.
Tim.

A lot of people feel the same about Brexit, Tim. It is what causes splits in society, even in families.

 

[Pat494]

Not many extol the obvious virtues of harmony. So it is not too surprising that there is so much strife.

 

[timsk]

A lot of people feel the same about Brexit, Tim. It is what causes splits in society, even in families.

Hi Split',
Yes indeed. However, the splits (there's some sort of pun to be worked here - if only I could think how!) are a consequence of some elements on each side of the debate not accepting the rights of others to hold views that differ to their own. That's where the real problem lies, IMO.

In my family, the division of votes was roughly 50/50 - but none of us have a problem as we all respect one another and accept that we don't always see eye to eye on everything. I don't think any the less of my sister and niece just because they voted to remain - and vice versa.
Tim.

 

[counter_violent]

This is a bit naughty. French establishment fiddling the election much!

http://yournewswire.com/marine-le-pen-election-rigged/