£16K Course

[scose-no-doubt]

I think its a stroke of genius by Futex, the jobs market is flooded with highly educated people looking to get on the financial gravy train. I work at a prop firm and have been around the industry for years and it amazes me the quality of candidates. There is a serious case of "educational inflation".

20 years ago having a degree was your key to career development. The trainees that come through the door now are "kids" that have masters degrees and have been turned down from all the banks so looking to the higher risk career route of prop trading.

I think Futex are exploiting a generation of young professionals desperate for a foot in the door. I say exploiting because i know as a proprietary trader that what we do has very few transferable skills to other careers, i can admit that, despite the number of people that like to claim a trader's job is highly intellectual and vitally important to the world.

An Msc from a prop shop? Do me a favour? 16 grand to learn about trendlines and scalping the bund order book combined with A-Level economics plus a bit on trading psychology. I guarantee I could work with someone for 2 months and get them up to speed with what they need to be doing to stand as much chance as any other local in the market. The rest is experience, hard work and determination. Only way to learn that is to get in front of the screens for 15 hours a day and be around supportive and successful traders.

Sorry for the rant, but i just see so many young 20 year old desperate for a chance and people out there fleecing them. By all means get an Msc i highly recommend it, but do it in a subject that will open career opportunities, not limit them.

Well considering Futex (used to?) charge 8 bags for their training course I reckon it's the same or a very similar thing with a university stamp of approval to make it look a bit more reputable with the balance of 16 less the 8 going to the uni. High fives all around.

 

[Lord Flasheart]

just out of curiosity who do you work for,must be a fun office with you there

 

[ChocolateDigestive]

where the funk do I wire the money to bhatch.

 

[scose-no-doubt]

I'm waiting for tommog to start his two month course for 16k/12*2 and get a vendor's badge.

 

[tommog]

Dont worry Scose its coming soon, just need to figure out how Microsoft Paint works first so I can make the leavers certificates look authentic. Ive been backtesting my moving average system over the past 2 weeks and the results look pretty good. Gonna write an article on money management in the "Articles" section, rate myself 5 stars then should be good to go.

 

[Gusto&Vim]

16k for a masters in sophistry and scalping? However much they may try, there is no way that course deserves to be valued at 16k - what a joke. Futex will try every trick in the book to ensure they get as much out of their Ponzi scheme of a business model as possible. It would be interesting to see what their "final dissertation" topics will be - "Why most prop traders don't make money in the long run", "Advanced theories of Bollinger Bands", "Buy cheap and sell expensive - discuss", "Fundamentals of using the correct terminology: 'pips' or 'ticks'... ", "Round-trips: you win or lose, we make money, why?"

No wonder degrees are worth much less than they used to be when universities associate themselves with such companies, fleecing people who think they are getting something for their money.

 

[scose-no-doubt]

did you leave or were you binned off?

 

[NVP]

thats £15,999.50p to much .......

Certificate is worth 50p i suppose

N

 

[NVP]

if you cant Trade - Teach

and in any line of Work......anyone who makes mega money from maximising their own limited talents deserves it .....look at Jordan or Posh Spice or Piers Morgan to name a few

N

 

[The Leopard]

if you cant Trade - Teach

and in any line of Work......anyone who makes mega money from maximising their own limited talents deserves it .....look at Jordan or Posh Spice or Piers Morgan to name a few

N

I'd rather not. Particularly Piers Morgan.

It is simply shocking that he has any kind of career in public after what he did.

As for the "good faith" bit - well, all I can say is Stevie Wonder could have taken one look at those photos and told you they were fake.

In fairness to Morgan, he is physically more attractive than the other two.

 

[the hare]

It is simply shocking that he has any kind of career in public after what he did..

Not to mention the pump and dump shenanigans, oh and the phone hacking and ....(insert list of crimes considerably longer than Tim's good guy vendor list)

He's what I used to call a ****

 

[The Leopard]

Not to mention the pump and dump shenanigans, oh and the phone hacking and ....(insert list of crimes considerably longer than Tim's good guy vendor list)

He's what I used to call a ****

Ah yes, I believe he narrowly escaped over that episode.

This is why I believe there should be a statue of Profumo in Westminster - he showed us the right way to behave when a public figure is disgraced.

It seems that now you have a few months off and then forget the past and move on to ever more lucrative things.

 

[DionysusToast]

Has Joe got any statements from them yet?

 

[Gusto&Vim]

Anyway, back to the topic... If one wanted a worthwhile masters to do, for about half the price, you could do one at any of the prestigious redbrick universities in a proper topic like financial mathematics, econometrics, heck, even an MBA. The skills that a prop trader uses cannot be taught on a course, and an MSc is certainly overkill - it's like having an MSc in "Car Driving" - way too much.

Even a course like the Wilmott CQF which costs 12k - although steep - at least provides you with a firm backing in quant trading, maths and programming primers, and it's something that is rigorous and recognised by the financial services employers out there.

An MSc in Prop Trading is instantly on par with these "media degrees" and "film studies" degrees that have become so prevalent these days - a niche waste of time. An MSc has usually always been a step towards an even higher postgraduate qualification, and I don't think many MPhils and PhDs can be had from the "theories of scalping" and "reading the ladders."

I would unquestionably recommend against it but I fear enough people will be conned into dishing out for this course before the Ponzi scheme collapses.

 

[scose-no-doubt]

Ponzi scheme? This sounds like lulzy inside information which should be disclosed in the public interest. Please continue Gusto mon ami.

 

[Gusto&Vim]

The way a big proportion of the prop trading world works, as we should all know by now - being wise and experienced members of the T2W community - is that it relies on a constant intake of sacrificial trainees based on their ignorance and lack of knowledge of how this industry operates.

Once you get "in", then the truth is slowly revealed to you - a bit like when you get into a cult, then layer by layer the "knowledge" is exposed - only to discover too late that it's all bull. Sure, there's that 5-10% of traders who clean up but 90% will waste their time and money (and no, I am not one of them).

So, my point is that all you need is for an average of 10 people a year for a couple of years to do this course, where all the expenses are covered by Futex and the Uni until the majority realise that there is no point in doing a masters in a subject that does not need one. It is trying to add another fake veneer to the "mystique" of prop trading when there is none.

 

[rsh01]

Gusto&Vim - your point cld be argued for about 50% of the degrees et al which exist. Most ppl wld be much more accomplished in that field if they either went straight into a business (or whatever), or did the quals in conjunction with a work placement.

Further education is well overrated imo esp in the uk.

 

[Gusto&Vim]

I fully agree - but at least some degrees can theoretically stand you in good stead for other professions. For example, doing a maths masters can get you jobs at a bank, at universities, it can lead to proper higher degrees, you learn a skill that has many cross-overs into other fields.

A "prop trading" degree is utterly useless outside of the world of prop trading and arcades (and within) - the banks will laugh at it as in their frame of reference, knowing about how to scalp during non-farms or talking about Japanese candles, and every other primitive approach is like talking to someone from the 15th Century about concepts relating to the Higgs boson.

It is truly a waste of time, especially at the price of 16k.

 

[neil]

The way a big proportion of the prop trading world works, as we should all know by now - being wise and experienced members of the T2W community - is that it relies on a constant intake of sacrificial trainees based on their ignorance and lack of knowledge of how this industry operates.

Once you get "in", then the truth is slowly revealed to you - a bit like when you get into a cult, then layer by layer the "knowledge" is exposed - only to discover too late that it's all bull. Sure, there's that 5-10% of traders who clean up but 90% will waste their time and money (and no, I am not one of them).

So, my point is that all you need is for an average of 10 people a year for a couple of years to do this course, where all the expenses are covered by Futex and the Uni until the majority realise that there is no point in doing a masters in a subject that does not need one. It is trying to add another fake veneer to the "mystique" of prop trading when there is none.

In addition to the above I bet you have to roll up your left trouser leg and hold a dagger to your chest

 

[FUTEX]

Its a Masters Degree. Its an internationally recognised high level qualification. There are Masters Degrees in many areas. This is unique because it is the first in Proprietary Trading that we know of. But , it still enables the succesful candidate to have the letters MSc after their name.
Its official as it comes from the University of Hertfordshire and took two years to build to an internationally recognised level, and has been signed off by profesionals and academia.