UK Politics

tomorton said:
We have had sinking government since Cameron's decision to hold a Brexit referendum. Sadly we are at least 5 years away from anything better.
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I don't believe it has anything to do with time? Time is irrelevant imo.

What sinks or floats anything are the decisions that go into making that ship.

Sadly for some time now UK politics has been going due South. Culminating in Brexit.

Sadly the far freaking RIGHT still blames issues on failing services on migrants - who are the saviours of the UK and have been for the last 200 years.

The UK has a shrinking tax base with an aging population with more ailments and falling birthrates. Coupled with poor productivity.

Housing crises is not down to small Island syndrome but pure daft "over-the-top" planning regulations (more like restrictions) in maintaining the values of the housed property owning elite.

Those unique factors that made UK great are no longer with us and the decisions taken to blame the migrant hard hard-working population doing the work English peeps do not wish to do is just leading to these other daft decisions that led us to Brexit.

So why aren't we training people to do these jobs? Recently, we could not fill vacancies in getting technology based skilled staff so we are recruiting from abroad. Jumping hoops to raise visas. The foreign personnel have better skill sets at lower rates. Yes indeed. They work to make an impression. The indigenous entitled personnel work like they are doing us a favour and deserve so much more.

In the UK we are giving bonuses to ultra well paid toffs who don't really work hard at all.

Big companies listing in US not UK exchanges? Why is that? No money. Much like the insurance market underwriting sector lost market share to Asia. Failing industries. Universities starved of funds. R&D money no longer coming in from the EU. Instead the press and radio slag off foreign students who spend a fortune here doing masters for bringing their families over. Rich families who are driven to succeed.

MSM just continues to stroke the mass populace by stroking their Britishness, by claiming these are the causes for our failing services. The very success breeding foreign investment in people and money that comes into the UK. It is absolutely crazy.

If all that wasn't enough we now have the daft stupid army bods talking about preparing for war with Russia etc etc.... REALLY? Let's divert money away from dentists, schools, policing, the NHS and everything else and spend it on fighting daft wars in faraway places.

No worries, we have control. We can vote these so called best Etonites trained twits out but who will we replace them with?


If I recall Tomorton you originally didn't think Brexit was a good idea but stepped into line because it was the will of the British people. Sadly a wrong decision ultimately leads to bad outcomes on balance. This is precisely what is being played out. It will not be 5 years but decades before the UK gets to acknowledge their past mistakes and take corrective action imho.
 
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counter_violent said:
It's in the article. Covers the whole story up to date.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Labour candidate claims Israel deliberately allowed October 7 attack

Azhar Ali, who is defending a Labour majority of more than 9,000 in Rochdale on February 29, claimed Israel allowed Hamas to massacre its own citizens.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk
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Highly improbable and investigations already started on security lapse. Some articles I've read and heard suggest that Israel is shocked by how much information Hamas know about their operations and confidental info. I never know if this is a honey trap deliberate leek or a real security failure.

Netanyahu needs this war to continue in order to protect his position. Israeli politics with Nethayahu and judicial changes have been on the rocks sometime.

Netanyahu and Zelensky both in much the same position. As long as fightings continue they have jobs.

In reality, they are both undesirables and their citizens want them out. I doubt either would win elections if they were held now.
 
Atilla said:
I don't believe it has anything to do with time? Time is irrelevant imo.

What sinks or floats anything are the decisions that go into making that ship.

Sadly for some time now UK politics has been going due South. Culminating in Brexit.

Sadly the far freaking RIGHT still blames issues on failing services on migrants - who are the saviours of the UK and have been for the last 200 years.

The UK has a shrinking tax base with an aging population with more ailments and falling birthrates. Coupled with poor productivity.

Housing crises is not down to small Island syndrome but pure daft "over-the-top" planning regulations (more like restrictions) in maintaining the values of the housed property owning elite.

Those unique factors that made UK great are no longer with us and the decisions taken to blame the migrant hard hard-working population doing the work English peeps do not wish to do is just leading to these other daft decisions that led us to Brexit.

So why aren't we training people to do these jobs? Recently, we could not fill vacancies in getting technology based skilled staff so we are recruiting from abroad. Jumping hoops to raise visas. The foreign personnel have better skill sets at lower rates. Yes indeed. They work to make an impression. The indigenous entitled personnel work like they are doing us a favour and deserve so much more.

In the UK we are giving bonuses to ultra well paid toffs who don't really work hard at all.

Big companies listing in US not UK exchanges? Why is that? No money. Much like the insurance market underwriting sector lost market share to Asia. Failing industries. Universities starved of funds. R&D money no longer coming in from the EU. Instead the press and radio slag off foreign students who spend a fortune here doing masters for bringing their families over. Rich families who are driven to succeed.

MSM just continues to stroke the mass populace by stroking their Britishness, by claiming these are the causes for our failing services. The very success breeding foreign investment in people and money that comes into the UK. It is absolutely crazy.

If all that wasn't enough we now have the daft stupid army bods talking about preparing for war with Russia etc etc.... REALLY? Let's divert money away from dentists, schools, policing, the NHS and everything else and spend it on fighting daft wars in faraway places.

No worries, we have control. We can vote these so called best Etonites trained twits out but who will we replace them with?


If I recall Tomorton you originally didn't think Brexit was a good idea but stepped into line because it was the will of the British people. Sadly a wrong decision ultimately leads to bad outcomes on balance. This is precisely what is being played out. It will not be 5 years but decades before the UK gets to acknowledge their past mistakes and take corrective action imho.
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You're right, I voted Remain but that was because I thought the referendum was premature and asked the wrong question anyway, and meanwhile we were doing well economically through being in the EU.

I hope for a competent Conservative leader to be ready for the 2029 General Election. But that might be optimistic.
 
tomorton said:
You're right, I voted Remain but that was because I thought the referendum was premature and asked the wrong question anyway, and meanwhile we were doing well economically through being in the EU.

I hope for a competent Conservative leader to be ready for the 2029 General Election. But that might be optimistic.
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Tories are brainless. Party is hell bent on tax cuts. Wrong policy for a shrinking tax base with starved public services.

Local Authorities are bankrupted by the central government.

Public bodies turning into each other one party blaming the other. That's parties as being LA's and Central government.

Tories were even politicising the Civil Service for trying to police their illegal activities with conflict of interest.

You too are being political in thinking, a political party can get us out of this.

People are afraid to speak out.

I think Farage and ultra Far Right need to take control of government, so the masses can see where there policies will get us. Otherwise both Tories and Labour will pander to the crowd.
 
I suppose we could develop a range of possible explanations for what Ali did -
1. he's such an idiot that he was taken in by anti-Jewish conspiracy theories
2. he doesn't believe that stuff but he's such an idiot that he thought it would be a good idea to chase the anti-Jewish demographic for votes
3. he does believe this stuff but now realises he was an idiot to repeat it in a public meeting, or at the very least he was an idiot to be saying it in English

I might be being too kind to Ali but I try to think the best of people, even scum.
 
As a little aside, somewhat tangential to the topic of U.K. politics, but increasingly important to it - is the subject of cancel culture. Now, I know Katie Hopkins isn't everyone's cup of tea, indeed, many think she's utterly repugnant! I get that. However, as someone who's been on the inside and worked at the heart of MSM and has been 'cancelled' herself multiple times, she's very well qualified to explain how the cancelling process works - whether it's directed at an individual like herself, Lawrence Fox, Piers Morgan etc. or at an entire organisation such as GBNews. Like her or loathe her, in this YouTube vid', she does a really good job of explaining how the 'right' people who think the 'right' thoughts set about eviscerating the 'wrong' people who think 'wrong' thoughts and espouse the 'wrong' ideas. Very enlightening, IMO. Enjoy . . .

 
timsk said:
As a little aside, somewhat tangential to the topic of U.K. politics, but increasingly important to it - is the subject of cancel culture. Now, I know Katie Hopkins isn't everyone's cup of tea, indeed, many think she's utterly repugnant! I get that. However, as someone who's been on the inside and worked at the heart of MSM and has been 'cancelled' herself multiple times, she's very well qualified to explain how the cancelling process works - whether it's directed at an individual like herself, Lawrence Fox, Piers Morgan etc. or at an entire organisation such as GBNews. Like her or loathe her, in this YouTube vid', she does a really good job of explaining how the 'right' people who think the 'right' thoughts set about eviscerating the 'wrong' people who think 'wrong' thoughts and espouse the 'wrong' ideas. Very enlightening, IMO. Enjoy . . .

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Exactly the same logic can be applied to the situation in Russia. They take it a step further though don't they. Termination, no way back.

Hopefully one day you will wake up !
 
counter_violent said:
Exactly the same logic can be applied to the situation in Russia. They take it a step further though don't they. Termination, no way back.

Hopefully one day you will wake up !
Click to expand...
c_v,
I assume you're referring to Alexei Navalny? If so, it's you who needs to wake up and ask the question: 'Cui bono - who benefits the most from his death?' To make this a little easier for you - it ain't Putin!
;)
Tim.

Low and behold - guess who's published a video on this very topic! None other than our ol' friend Brian Berletic at The New Atlas. As usual with him, everything he says is fully referenced with links in the description . . .

 
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timsk said:
As a little aside, somewhat tangential to the topic of U.K. politics, but increasingly important to it - is the subject of cancel culture. Now, I know Katie Hopkins isn't everyone's cup of tea, indeed, many think she's utterly repugnant! I get that. However, as someone who's been on the inside and worked at the heart of MSM and has been 'cancelled' herself multiple times, she's very well qualified to explain how the cancelling process works - whether it's directed at an individual like herself, Lawrence Fox, Piers Morgan etc. or at an entire organisation such as GBNews. Like her or loathe her, in this YouTube vid', she does a really good job of explaining how the 'right' people who think the 'right' thoughts set about eviscerating the 'wrong' people who think 'wrong' thoughts and espouse the 'wrong' ideas. Very enlightening, IMO. Enjoy . . .

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Hi Tim,

She's not saying anything new. Lobby and pressure groups along with other powerful parties with vested interests have always been working this way. It is the modus of operation. Same as the BBC. Just that the way they do it is more subtle and better crafted for numpty brains.

As for GB news when ever I watch it for all of 2 mins at a time my brain shutdown. It is full of onesided numpties who all think and act like each other.

There is no balance or challenge.

They'll pick on something one other extreme idiot has said or done (much like them selves) and talk it to death.

The recent Sunak appearance is a case in point. Isn't that effectively a party political broadcast?

Personally I think Sunak is great and doing a super job. He really understands economics. Much of the Tory party are about as low as you can get. They are self serving a-wipes. i.e. Boris and Jacob.
 
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timsk said:
c_v,
I assume you're referring to Alexei Navalny? If so, it's you who needs to wake up and ask the question: 'Cui bono - who benefits the most from his death?' To make this a little easier for you - it ain't Putin!
;)
Tim.
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The issue with democracy in other nations is that they are open to interference and manipulation by the West. There are enough people who are self serving and power hungry to take up foreign interests to pursue their own interests in gaining power.

Case in point are Sadam and Gadafi amongst many others. These are two Western puppets who turned on their masters. They didn't do as they were asked.

That is why two big countries like Russia and China see Western democracy as a threat to their nation's interests. If you don't understand this then well you are ignorant to how countries like US UK and France work. They are the three countries who have instigated the most regime changes in other nations.
 
Atilla said:
The issue with democracy in other nations is that they are open to interference and manipulation by the West. There are enough people who are self serving and power hungry to take up foreign interests to pursue their own interests in gaining power.

Case in point are Sadam and Gadafi amongst many others. These are two Western puppets who turned on their masters. They didn't do as they were asked.

That is why two big countries like Russia and China see Western democracy as a threat to their nation's interests. If you don't understand this then well you are ignorant to how countries like US UK and France work. They are the three countries who have instigated the most regime changes in other nations.
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Hi At',
Fear not, I understand this perfectly!
(y)

Atilla said:
Hi Tim,

She's not saying anything new. Lobby and pressure groups along with other powerful parties with vested interests have always been working this way. It is the modus of operation. Same as the BBC. Just that the way they do it is more subtle and better crafted for numpty brains.

As for GB news when ever I watch it for all of 2 mins at a time my brain shutdown. It is full of onesided numpties who all think and act like each other.

There is no balance or challenge.

They'll pick on something one other extreme idiot has said or done (much like them selves) and talk it to death.

The recent Sunak appearance is a case in point. Isn't that effectively a party political broadcast?

Personally I think Sunak is great and doing a super job. He really understands economics. Much of the Tory party are about as low as you can get. They are self serving a-wipes. i.e. Boris and Jacob.
Click to expand...
I don't watch GBNews per se, but I watch the occasional YouTube clip if the topic's of interest. I appreciate it's not for everyone, but Katie H's point that it's better to have a broad cross section of commentators expressing a full spectrum of views rather than shut down anyone and everyone who goes 'off-message' - is one I endorse 100%. Also, individual presenters are excellent - Mark Steyn was great before he got cancelled (exactly in the way Katie H' describes) and Neil Oliver is excellent - see the recent vid' I posted of him on the Ukraine thread. So, I suggest keeping an open mind and try not to tar all the presenters with the same brush based on your dislike of JRM. ;-)

Where I strongly disagree with you is about Sunak: a part of me thinks your comments must surely be tongue in cheek? In the words of John McEnroe: 'You can not be serious!' His understanding of economics is negligible IMO, evidenced by the fact that he failed to appreciate that shutting the country down for two years and paying people to do sweet FA would be financially ruinous. Not for him of course, or for his obscenely wealthy family and friends, all of whom have profited greatly from his time as Chancellor and PM - as Jonathan Pie explains in his inimitable way in this vid'. Enjoy . . .

 
timsk said:
Hi At',
Fear not, I understand this perfectly!
(y)


I don't watch GBNews per se, but I watch the occasional YouTube clip if the topic's of interest. I appreciate it's not for everyone, but Katie H's point that it's better to have a broad cross section of commentators expressing a full spectrum of views rather than shut down anyone and everyone who goes 'off-message' - is one I endorse 100%. Also, individual presenters are excellent - Mark Steyn was great before he got cancelled (exactly in the way Katie H' describes) and Neil Oliver is excellent - see the recent vid' I posted of him on the Ukraine thread. So, I suggest keeping an open mind and try not to tar all the presenters with the same brush based on your dislike of JRM. ;-)

Where I strongly disagree with you is about Sunak: a part of me thinks your comments must surely be tongue in cheek? In the words of John McEnroe: 'You can not be serious!' His understanding of economics is negligible IMO, evidenced by the fact that he failed to appreciate that shutting the country down for two years and paying people to do sweet FA would be financially ruinous. Not for him of course, or for his obscenely wealthy family and friends, all of whom have profited greatly from his time as Chancellor and PM - as Jonathan Pie explains in his inimitable way in this vid'. Enjoy . . .

Click to expand...

No Att is right. As an economist he is very competent. The covid fiasco took on a life of it's own, heavily influenced by so called pandemic experts. He had no choice but to tow the government line. Not sure about "eat out to help out", that sounded like pure bollox to me at the time. But furlough was excellent. They paid me a fortune to sit on my arse and contemplate the world gone mad.(y)
 
Surprisingly, CV makes my sentiment on Sunak's response to lockdown very cleary. Covid took on a whole new dimension with all the pigs frothing in the mouth on how they can surprisingly make millions, by passing procurement policies given the extra ordinary times they found them selves in. Dominic Cummings was the lead on all that fiasco.

I would have gone the Sweden route and just carried on but being a politician, if they did do that and 500,000 died (incorrectly forecasted back then), they'd be out of a job. Why take the risk.

You have to look at Sunak against Liz Trust and the rest of the knobs in the Tory party. Going for growth in an inflationary period, giving millions to existing millionaires to kick start it all with their trickle down economics to help the struggling people with crumbs... Shocking. Bypassing Office of Budget Responsibility to review their amazingly stupid cooked-up policy of aiming for 2% growth. 1% due to import of 300 migrants contrary to what the foolers were touting.

I've always said to fight inflation we need two side; demand and supply policies. Fiscal policies to control demand and monetary policy to control supply. This would help with funding services and ease off on excess demand for goods and sservices, whilst interest rate rises ease off on borrowing.

Sunak is simply the fall guy for all of tory excesses in the past. He will be down as losing the election, whilst the tories will go around back stabbing and slapping each other for the next term. I'm sure he knows that.
 
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tomorton said:
This is more than a surprise. I'm about 50-50 between Reform, staying at home or spoiling my ballot paper.
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Hi Tom,
I'm with you on this, except that I will spoil my ballot paper rather staying at home, as spoiled papers are counted and the more people that do that - the more likely the message will get through that politicians of all hues must start to listen to the electorate.

Richard Tice's Reform party have one major obstacle which puts a finite ceiling on their success, and that is they are born out of the Brexit Party. This means that (almost) no one who voted remain in the referendum will ever vote Reform - even though lots of them will agree with - and support - many of Reform's other views and policies. That's a crying shame. If only there wasn't any tie between Reform and the leave vote - then I think the sky's the limit for them and they really could challenge the status quo. As it is, all I suspect will happen is that they'll give the Tories an almighty kicking at the forthcoming general election, who will then get their act together in order to be a credible challenge to Labour in five years time. Then we'll be back to the usual two cheeks of the same ar$e with the Lib Dems forming the crack in the middle and Reform will just be another footnote in political history. Just my £0.02p worth!
Tim.
 
What you say is true Tim.

How is Reform different from UKIP or Brexit fiasco? Bunch of numpties who haven't a clue other than bang drums and wave flags. All that Make Great Again tosh. Take back control. Motor mouth Farage is pulling the strings in the background.

I mean Lee Anderson saying I want my country back??? FGS :eek:. Which country does this numpty think his living in?

Same old small island mentality by a bunch of peanut size brains.

Full of soundbites and low aspiration hopers.

The Nike flag biz on England shirts - I'm thinking is a deliberate ploy to get the public fired up and part of the political RW agenda. People will bite into it however.

Now there is news in CityAM suggesting London's Finance market is on the rise, when all freaking news of substance about companies leaving for foreign exchanges is on the rise. So much BS but people will believe what they want to without cross checking the facts.
 
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