The end of the EU

[Atilla]

I believe that Greece is now yesterday's news. I have come to believe that they will, in the end, default. The next problem, before that of the other rocky economies, will be which banks own the most Greek bonds.

Yes but after Greece - heads and eyes will turn too look at the other PIIS in the system :cheesy:

 

[squall321]

Lets hope it's NOT as brutal and savage as the 3rd Reich

I think ( and hope ) the Germans have come a long way from Naziism to being good neighbours.

Britain is falling apart at the seams, breaking up as 1 unit and now internal riots. She is almost an irrelevence - thanks to 2nd rate politicians.

I hope Greece, Portugal etc find their "balls" and leave the EU before they get absorbed into a greater " BORG " Empire.

They were perfectly alright before Trichet and co. brainwashed them into joining a Eurozone. Went at their own pace.

if you think the eu should break up, what's wrong with britain breaking up? does mervyn king care about what's happening in the economies of cornwall or wales before making a decision? no, he only cares about london and probably only about the finance industry that's IN london and not much else.

 

[squall321]

Germans are calling for Governments and tax payers not to bail out risk takers. (I agree by the way).

What would happen to the Euro if the PIGS were released to market forces???

germans should keep quiet, the risk takers are dragging down the euro which means germany can export more and they have more jobs. that's why they are bailing them out to keep them in the euro. as long as the cost of bailout is still < the gains they get from more exporting then it's a good deal.

 

[enragedcow]

Sad as it is I doubt the Euro will last in its present incarnation because each member country requires different monetary policy control.

EG.
DA FED "ahmgadz! lyk we haz to grow our econmoo!!"
DA OTHER FED "orly? i juz decrease interest rate kthx..."
DA FED "lyk joo cn't do dat cuz lyk we lost control of our currency or something (derp) ... u mad bro?"
DA OTHER FED "4 srsly? k I spend teh govt moneyz ... all gone .. i aks otha contry dey giv moneyz"

and so on ... until we reach what we have now

Didn't the leaders see this coming? the Eurozone fails both of Mundell's conditions for a currency union namely:

- experience similar shocks
- if not, you need high factor mobility

Contrast to the 51 (50? 57? >9000?) states of America which obviously pass these tests hence are perfect for a common currency, the American Dollar.

 

[forker]

The cost of breaking up the euro would be calamitous and an unlikely event. People think a weaker currency and escape from european governance will provide a competitive edge. The reality couldn't be further from the hypothesis. Aside from the restructural costs and immediate fallout effects, any competitive edge would be offset by fuel and import costs including equipment, parts, raw materials etc. The outcome would be disastrous for any economy that exits the union. The only way forward is to stick together and aid these rotten economies. The EU need to restructure because the basis of this chaos is a result of failed leadership and flawed policies. One thing is certain in my opinion, the euro is overvalued. A devaluation of the currency is needed. The question is where does the UK reside in the future of the EU.

 

[the_coumiester]

The cost of breaking up the euro would be calamitous and an unlikely event. People think a weaker currency and escape from european governance will provide a competitive edge. The reality couldn't be further from the hypothesis. Aside from the restructural costs and immediate fallout effects, any competitive edge would be offset by fuel and import costs including equipment, parts, raw materials etc. The outcome would be disastrous for any economy that exits the union. The only way forward is to stick together and aid these rotten economies. The EU need to restructure because the basis of this chaos is a result of failed leadership and flawed policies. One thing is certain in my opinion, the euro is overvalued. A devaluation of the currency is needed. The question is where does the UK reside in the future of the EU.

Spoken like a true Internationalist (Communist). This mindset is what has Europe in shambles to begin with. The EU has done nothing but destroy Europe - and now you want to devalue the currency of Europe even more, and make it even more dependent on cheap/outside labor and BANKS - the same banks that have already crippled Europe with their fraudulent systems! Hilarious!

By the way, anybody who needs to throw around the "Third Reich" crap needs to get a grip. That was almost 70 years ago - and it's statistically and self-evidently true that Communism was dividends WORSE than anything the Germans are supposedly accused of doing. (The worse crime being they separated themselves from the monetary system that was crippling them, and Europe - the very same one that this individual is saying we need more of.)

 

[Pat494]

It strikes me as very strange how it came true that :-

1. Hitlers view of an united Europe under German dominance

2. Stalin's view of smashing capitalism, particularly the banks

Their foul legacies still ride us

May they Rot in hell

 

[Atilla]

It strikes me as very strange how it came true that :-

1. Hitlers view of an united Europe under German dominance

2. Stalin's view of smashing capitalism, particularly the banks

Their foul legacies still ride us

May they Rot in hell

Hmmm - if you are judging them on those two points - I would beg to differ...

 

[Pat494]

Hmmm - if you are judging them on those two points - I would beg to differ...

I think you will find their good points were few and far between imho

 

[Atilla]

I think you will find their good points were few and far between imho

Well did qualify on those two points.

I reckon German efficiency and attention to detail as well as the work hard effort is outstanding.

Their banks also work hand in glove with industry rather than short term profit making stealing perspective of our banks.

Capitalism needs a good dressing down. Greed is good and profit maximising paradigm well and trully beaten to the ground. New world order rests on bonus theft by the elected few. Be interesting to see how far this runs.

I bet Stalin wouldn't put up with the fat cats like we do...

 

[Pat494]

Well did qualify on those two points.

I reckon German efficiency and attention to detail as well as the work hard effort is outstanding.

Their banks also work hand in glove with industry rather than short term profit making stealing perspective of our banks.

Capitalism needs a good dressing down. Greed is good and profit maximising paradigm well and trully beaten to the ground. New world order rests on bonus theft by the elected few. Be interesting to see how far this runs.

I bet Stalin wouldn't put up with the fat cats like we do...

I didn't mention the Germans.
Hitler was Austrian, not German
Stalin was Georgian, not Russian
Napoleon was Corsican, not French

The lesson from history seems to be- don't be fooled by politicians , especially aggressive foreigners posing as Nationalists ,and behave like a lot of robots.

:smart:

 

[Atilla]

I didn't mention the Germans.
Hitler was Austrian, not German
Stalin was Georgian, not Russian
Napoleon was Corsican, not French

The lesson from history seems to be- don't be fooled by politicians , especially aggressive foreigners posing as Nationalists ,and behave like a lot of robots.

:smart:

That is shocking... :-0

I always wondered who Rasputin was... He wasn't a French plant was he?

 

[Pat494]

That is shocking... :-0

I always wondered who Rasputin was... He wasn't a French plant was he?

He meddled 'till the last aristocrat

The others fought on to the last German, Russian, Frenchman - what did they care if millions died ?

The next one, who will launch WW3, is probably lurking somewhere in the woodpile !

 

[forker]

Spoken like a true Internationalist (Communist). This mindset is what has Europe in shambles to begin with. The EU has done nothing but destroy Europe - and now you want to devalue the currency of Europe even more, and make it even more dependent on cheap/outside labor and BANKS - the same banks that have already crippled Europe with their fraudulent systems! Hilarious!

Keep your panties on... The euro is over valued with all this BS going on period. They can't even come up with a bailout fat enough to fill the hole if it were fully exposed. How it got here is very poor entry criteria into the union in the first place. The banks didn't cripple Greece, their moronic government is the fault. Maybe you should read more facts before you flap those lips of yours around like a half cooked hooker.

 

[Pat494]

Hell is Where:
The Police are German,
The Chefs are British,
The Mechanics are French,
The Lovers are Swiss
And
It's all organized by the Italians.

An Italian called Prodi largely designed the mess they call the EU
The politicians and a Frenchie called Trichet have mismanaged it for the last 8 years
And the rest of us are paying for it

RE-designing it, is long time overdue - but who will step up to do it ?

 

[Atilla]

Hell is Where:
The Police are German,
The Chefs are British,
The Mechanics are French,
The Lovers are Swiss
And
It's all organized by the Italians.

An Italian called Prodi largely designed the mess they call the EU
The politicians and a Frenchie called Trichet have mismanaged it for the last 8 years
And the rest of us are paying for it

RE-designing it, is long time overdue - but who will step up to do it ?

Need to "harmonise" fiscal policies coupled with a central bank setting single exchange rate for monetary policy.

prevent and where caught prosecute againts falsifying of accounts.

 

[pboyles]

I didn't mention the Germans.
Hitler was Austrian, not German
Stalin was Georgian, not Russian
Napoleon was Corsican, not French

The lesson from history seems to be- don't be fooled by politicians , especially aggressive foreigners posing as Nationalists ,and behave like a lot of robots.

:smart:

You forgot about Obama being Kenyan.

 

[Pat494]

According to the analysts the Eurozone agreement on finance is the usual mess served up by incompetent committees

It would be much better if Prodi and the original founders of the EU 'fessed up to having made a mighty great balls-up and start again. But no, Merkel/Sarkozy are acting like Punch and Judy are still digging and making the financial black hole bigger !

Trichet is disappearing into the sunset clasping a huge pay-off pension for a lousy job just like Brown, Blair etc. did.

It's strange how Socialism rewards the useless

The whole concept is flawed, corrupt and sadly be the end of Europe when there was much worth preserving.

I am totally opposed to revolution, which may well be a consequence, on the grounds of needless suffering and being of benefit usually to the scumbags of history.

 

[Atilla]

According to the analysts the Eurozone agreement on finance is the usual mess served up by incompetent committees

It would be much better if Prodi and the original founders of the EU 'fessed up to having made a mighty great balls-up and start again. But no, Merkel/Sarkozy are acting like Punch and Judy are still digging and making the financial black hole bigger !

Trichet is disappearing into the sunset clasping a huge pay-off pension for a lousy job just like Brown, Blair etc. did.

It's strange how Socialism rewards the useless

The whole concept is flawed, corrupt and sadly be the end of Europe

Socialism ?

Commmooonnnn Pat, be fair ref :-0

 

[Pat494]

Socialism ?

Commmooonnnn Pat, be fair ref :-0

Yes Socialism - fine words that are worthless lies because of dashed hopes and flawed concepts. Most of the struggling PIIGS countries have had or have socialism Govts. They waste money and invest in the useless for political support.

Lies lies and more lies !!!!!!!!!!