You are the bugs, feasting on peoples fears, and there is not one single truth hear. Merely conjecture and wild accusations by a bunch a small minded haters. hey, lets post some random article that says something not related to Mike or Senen but lets say its just like them and make idiots believe that they have been scammed. Or you could tell the truth sometimes investments shrink, yes I know, smart people like you could have told me that. But you smart people don't know that they also go up sometimes too. You are taking one trading day out of the first six weeks and acting like it is the end of the world. Shut up, with all the lies and half truths and the character assasinations. and talk about the actual facts the actual events and the actual ways to overcome our losses.
You are the bugs, feasting on peoples fears, and there is not one single truth hear. Merely conjecture and wild accusations by a bunch a small minded haters. hey, lets post some random article that says something not related to Mike or Senen but lets say its just like them and make idiots believe that they have been scammed. Or you could tell the truth sometimes investments shrink, yes I know, smart people like you could have told me that. But you smart people don't know that they also go up sometimes too. You are taking one trading day out of the first six weeks and acting like it is the end of the world. Shut up, with all the lies and half truths and the character assasinations. and talk about the actual facts the actual events and the actual ways to overcome our losses.
Now this one is one I can agree with, stick to the facts. If you believe people shouldn't invest and you want to stop them then tell your side of the story and stick to facts. That is the first good post I have read by a hater in 117 pages.
chestnut13
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The fact is that you were conned into putting money into a scheme. The fact is you lost 65% in one day when there was supposed to be a 2% stop loss. The fact is that you are too foolish to realize this ... take whatever money you have left and get the hell out. Your money is gone. You can't overcome your loss. You can only run away from someone who will take the rest of your money. The fact is you are either a shill or, I am sorry to be harsh if you have indeed lost money ... an idiot.
Lightning McQueen
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i'd take no notice of the latest way they are trying to pile the blame on to you punters. the current propaganda from them here, and at the evg facebook page, seems to be attempting to move the goalposts and are now back peddling with its a risky long term investment, and its your fault. even though it was peddled out in the 1st instance as a passive income easy money vehicle.
Oh yeah you're right...everyone should go invest with ProphetMax! You know why? Remember that trader that F'ed up MASSIVELY and lost millions of dollars? That wasn't just any trader...that was their best trader
Be serious man. Even if this whole thing wasn't a massive scam and it was a legitimate operation, do you really want to give your money to an operation whose HEAD TRADER could let that happen?
Kiss your money good bye BigOlBoy, err Senen, or whoever you are.
whether I kiss my money good bye for **** your mother, that doesn't concern you. I love how you change your facts so easily. in one post they're scam artists, now they are just imcompetent. Sounds like you are full of ****e and just want to run you mouth to fit it with a bunch if small minded pissants
No matter how you spin this it is unjustifiable. The people that invested their money did so under the guidelines of a 2% risk per trade. Senen fed them a bunch of BS about how it would take hundreds of consecutive missed trades to entirely liquidate a $10k account. If he expects his clients to adhere to all of these bogus agreements he makes them sign why can he not adhere to his own guidelines?
Regardless of whether this is fraud, negligence, or a computer glitch, it makes no difference. These people were told there would be only a few trades a month, with a maximum risk of 2%. That means the overall growth or decline of an account should be gradual and clients would be given the opportunity to determine on THEIR OWN how much THEY are willing to lose and pull the plug as necessary. It does not mean they go to bed one night with $30,000 and wake up with $10,000.
For god sakes, did you see the surveys posted earlier in this thread? Some of these people lost down payments on homes and college educations for thier kids. Have some ****ing compassion.
Lightning McQueen
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the elephant in the room is the fx broker.
did anyones statement change from fxcm to IB Capital LP and what date was that? or if not fxcm, what was the broker?
also can we know what date dillards ad hit the scene
did anyones statement change from fxcm to IB Capital LP and what date was that? or if not fxcm, what was the broker?
also can we know what date dillards ad hit the scene
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I'm not changing facts. I said "even IF". It's a conditional statement meaning even IF you were to give them the benefit of the doubt and say that it was only incompetence that caused these losses, why would that make giving them your money any better?
AngrySucker
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Here is Mike Dillard and Robert Hirsch's post in full. No talk of the kickback he received from Senen, just lot's of, "blame the dumb ****s who took his advice and are now screwed". Truly disgusting.
[Updated Friday, May 25, 2012]
From the very beginning, The Elevation Group has been a diary based on my own personal adventures into the world of finance and investing.
And one of the unique traits of a diary is that it’s only relevant if you include the positive moments along with the bad… The thrill of victory, and the agony of defeat.
Since this project launched in December of 2010, I’ve had nothing but victories to share with you, but I knew when I started EVG, that a flawless streak of wins was an impossibility, and that at some point, a loss would occur.
Well I regret to say, that day has finally arrived.
While it would be much easier to sweep this loss under the rug and try to save face, it would be a lie, and it would go against the spirit of this entire project.
The lessons learned from a defeat are infinitely more valuable than those learned from a victory, so in reality, this post may be the most valuable (yet painful) I’ve ever had to write.
This past January, Robert and I flew down to Brisbane, Australia to interview Senen Pousa about his product ProphetMax, which I’d casually kept an eye on for several years.
In 2011, I finally purchased a PM Membership and was extremely impressed by the content I found, and the potential returns that were possible through their recommended trading resources.
I sat and watched for another six months, until Robert and I finally decided to personally invest in their Managed FX program, and share this resource with EVG Members.
Now I’m a bit old-fashioned and idealistic when it comes to business relationships, as a handshake and a man’s word means infinitely more to me than a contract.
So Robert and I decided to fly to Brisbane to spend three days with Senen in person, in order to frankly, judge him as a person (I’m sure he was doing the same with us).
The bottom line is that we all came away from that meeting as kindred spirits with the same mission to revolutionize the financial industry, and empower the middle class.
We felt great about ProphetMax… We loved the content, and the fact that you were required to go through a fairly extensive education process before you were even given access to their trading partners. Requiring education before investment demonstrated to us that we were aligned from a priority standpoint.
In February, we introduced Senen to EVG, and it was the single most popular post we’ve ever made.
People truly resonated with him as a person, his message, and the potential opportunity to make 100%+ returns per year, based on their previous 48 month track record.
And it was during this time that I learned Lesson #1…
“Prudent words of caution fall on deaf ears when people see Dollar signs.”
Whenever I release a new lesson or discuss an investment opportunity inside EVG, I always make sure that it’s put into context of my overall strategy.
In this case, I shared quite a few words of wisdom that where seemingly unheeded by many…
First, I made it clear that the only reason I’m even considering forex trading, is because I’ve spent the past three years putting in a very solid, conservative investment foundation which I shared during our video sessions with Senen…
As stated, that foundation consists of three parts:
Infinite Banking.
Precious metals.
And cash flow real estate.
Second, only with these pieces in place, was I now at a point where I could pursue riskier investments like FX. The money I would put into this kind of opportunity was what I called in the videos, “Vegas Money”. This is money that I was emotionally and financially willing and able to lose every penny of.
Over the next few weeks, I got an email from our resident EVG tax expert Tom Wheelwright, which resulted in an email that has become quite infamous within our community…
Instead of simply re-capping that email, I want to post it in full here, because the message it contains is now more important and tangible than ever…
Those of who have not read this email may find that it’s quite harsh. Part II which has been pasted below will explain why.
================================
PART I:
“I don’t know what to say… I’m, frustrated, angry, and so disappointed in a few EVG Members right now…
I had a great talk with our resident CPA Tom Wheelwright yesterday about my tax strategy, and as we were about to end the call, he mentioned something that left me speechless…
He said, “Mike I’m really concerned… Many of our Wealth Strategy clients have called us up this week, cancelled their wealth strategy sessions with our team, and said they’re putting 100% of their money into Senen’s ProphetMax trading program.”
Upon hearing that, my jaw dropped and I was overcome by sheer disbelief, anger, disgust, and disappointment. I believe, “You have to be ****ing kidding me…”, was my actual response.
But he wasn’t, and now you guys are going to get a giant ****ing wake-up call today.
If you have virgin ears, or if you’re easily offended, stop reading this and contact Elevation Group Support « Mike Dillard's Elevation Group to cancel your membership. I really don’t give a damn.
First and foremost, let’s review what EVG is, and is not…
The Elevation Group is my personal DIARY. I am documenting what I am doing with my money, and sharing the contract information of the people I invest with so that you can work with them should you choose to do so.
My overall goal with EVG has been two-fold…
To generate awareness among our Member’s as to what’s taking place around the world financially so that you may protect yourselves from the risks that continue to mount, and to demonstrate the alternative investments that the rich use, so that you may have the opportunity to turn economic chaos into prosperity.
Revealing the strategies that we’ve revealed over the past year in the candid, personal, and intimate way we have to the public has never been done before, and now I’m finding out why…
While I expect many of our Member’s to contact and work with the incredible people and resources I meet and introduce to the Group like Tom Wheelwright, Paul Haarman, JP, Adrian, Dan, Sean, Senen, etc…
I did not expect people to abandon reason, or to act so irresponsibly when simply given access to information.
Putting 100% of your money into ANY investment, whether that’s gold, Dollars, bonds, stocks, real estate, or anything… Is sheer ****ing stupidity, and the height of recklessness.
Do you want to know how much money I’m trading with Senen’s team?
3% of my net-worth.
3 PERCENT.
AND ON TOP OF THAT… I’m only making this investment because I’ve spent the past three years creating an incredibly safe financial foundation…
First I purchased precious metals back in 2007.
Then I started a home business so I can control my cash-flow.
Next I set up an Infinite Banking System using life-insurance.
After that I started working with Tom to strategically minimize my tax liability so i could, “make money”, by keeping more of it.
A few months ago I purchased an apartment complex with some of the most knowledgable investors on the planet.
And now…. ONLY AFTER 95% of my net-worth has been invested in these safe and conservative vehicles, am I beginning to look at investments that offer higher returns, with more risk.
And yet here I am sitting at dinner last night talking to Tom, and hear that a few of you have decided to, “go all in, and put it all on black.”
If you’re one of these people, I’ll make these very plain and simple for you to understand… You’re a ****ing idiot.
You’ve make me second guess the viability of what we’re trying to do to change the world.
NOW I finally understand why the rich don’t tell the poor or middle class what they’re doing with their money.
Now I understand why most people hand their money over to an advisor, only to get willingly screwed in the ass by most of them… It’s because you’d do even worse if you were left to your own devices.
You’re reckless.
You’re emotional.
You’re desperate.
You don’t take responsibility for your actions.
And you’re jeopardizing an incredible thing for those who ARE ready for this kind of information.
If you’re having to put the majority of your money in Senen’s recommended brokerage company just to meet the minimum funding level of $10,000, THEN YOU HAVE NO BUSINESS INVESTING. PERIOD.
So if you’re one of these people, then I have some advice for you and I want you to take it…
STOP.
At this point in time, you do not have the emotional intelligence necessary to make sound financial decisions. I want you to contact your financial advisor and do exactly what they tell you to do.
You’re welcome to remain an EVG Member if you want to continue developing your financial intelligence, but I want you to sit on the sidelines unless you get authorization from your advisor to contact one of our resources.
And as for the rest of you, let this be a lessoned learned for all. This isn’t a game, and if you’re not ready to act responsibly, you shouldn’t act.
A really pissed-off,
Mike Dillard
=========================================
Which was followed up by Part II a week later…
=========================================
PART II
Well after a great event in Baltimore, Robert and I have just arrived in Vegas for an incredibly special meeting today, as we sit down with Kahn of KahnAcademy.org, Eben Pagan, and Tony Hsieh, the Founder of Zappos.com.
The topic?
How we can reinvent the global education system.
But before we begin that discussion, I’d like to finish the one I started on Friday… A conclusion to the rant that sent men and women screaming for the hills, and calling me crazy…
After all, what kind of business owner dares to use profanity in front of a global audience, and then insult his paying customers???
The answer is quite simple…
One that cares about you and your future, more than you know.
I meant every word of what I said on Friday. It was not the first time I’ve sent an email like that over the past eight years, and it will not be the last.
“But is that really necessary Mike? Do you really need to swear like that?”
The answer is yes, and no.
When I sit down and write an email or record a video to our audience, I have one standard that over-rides all else… And that is to be true to myself, and my intentions at any cost.
After I got off the phone with Tom and heard about some of the reckless decisions that a few Members were making, I had several responses to choose from…
A: I could have cared less and done nothing.
B: I could have written a politically correct email that would have been safe to write… Nice, sweet, and inoffensive, but at the end of the day, it would not have been honest or from my core.
Or I could have written the email that I sent on Friday.
An email that was completely unfiltered and from the heart… An email written to grab you by neck and wake you up… An email that you would never forget, an email that you needed to hear, and that no one has had the guts to give you…
I am very well aware of the fact that sending an email like that would cause a few customers to ask for a refund and leave. I knew that it would cause people to unsubscribe from our list, and I knew that it would bring my reputation into question.
So why would I do that?
Because above all things, including money, reputation, or ego, I must be true to myself and my intentions, and if there is a price to be paid for that, then so be it.
That’s what leadership is.
It’s not about doing what’s easy. It’s about doing what’s right.
The reason so many people are in the mess they’re in today, is because no one cared enough about them to man-up and tell them the cold, hard, unfiltered truth about the decisions they’re making.
Well I do, and I will.
I don’t care if it costs us money, our subscribers count, or my reputation. At the end of the day, I don’t give a damn about those things. If I did, I wouldn’t have sent anything at all.
I care about you, and whether you liked that email, or were offended by it, at the very least you know that I will always be true to myself, our mission, and to you, no matter what.
Sincerely,
Mike Dillard
========================================
I can only hope that these words of caution were heeded.
That brings us up to the present week, a few months later…
This past week, a 65% drawdown took place in most Managed FX clients accounts, mine included, due to a human error made by their head trader.
Over the past few days, Senen has sent several emails and held a webinar to explain the reason for the decline, which is summarized here:
“I understand what has happened. I can confirm conclusively that the losses on some accounts were indeed legitimate and
caused by Kevin’s (human) error, not by algorithmic trading.
I can also confirm that not all accounts lost money. Some in fact made money yesterday. I can also confirm that nothing
like this has ever happened in Kevin’s entire trading career, and that Kevin immediately took full responsibility for his error without a single word of defensiveness, blame or justification.”
- Senen
Is it true? A lie? I have no idea…
Whatever the reason may be, I know that it doesn’t change what happened, and that it’s incredibly painful for many of you.
Our goal in EVG is to empower people, and to help them increase their levels of prosperity and wealth in their lives, so having to deal with this kind of loss from one of our recommended resources has been gut wrenching.
I want you to know that our entire team has been affected by this in a very deep way, and while we can’t turn back time, we are taking painful lessons away from this that we will all remember for the rest of our lives.
With that being said, I’d like to answer a few common questions that are on most people’s minds…
1: Do I think we were all victims of an elaborate scam, or a legitimate, yet unfortunate mistake?
It’s possible that this has been a massive scam, but I don’t think so. Here’s why…
ProphetMax has been around for at least three years. If anything like this had happened before, it would have been all over the net. I did not find any negative comments about the program during my review of the company.
If Senen’s intention were to get as many people as possible to invest as much money as possible, he wouldn’t have required people to go through so many hours of training and barriers to entry before getting access to the Managed FX area in Level 3.
In fact, they would have made it as easy as possible to fund your account, which is the exact opposite experience that PM Members have. It’s actually a pain in the ass in my opinion.
The Quant FX accounts were completely unaffected. If they were trying to steal everyone’s money, I’d assume that those accounts would have been affected as well.
Most con artists use fake identities and then “go black” after they’ve stolen a large amount of money. They simply disappear. The email addresses, websites, phone numbers, and everything else simply stop working and the people vanish. Senen isn’t using a fake identity, and he hasn’t gone anywhere, and I find it hard to believe that if this was some giant scheme to defraud us, that he’d still be holding two webinars a week on personal development, as he’s done for the past three years.
I don’t think that Kevin Clarke, the head trader who made the mistake, would have come out in front of an audience with his real name and explained what happened. His name and his reputation are now tied to this story online, and I don’t think an intelligent scam artist would put his identity out there for scrutiny.
Senen has had plans to continue to grow his business in a big way for the long run. You don’t do that by intentionally screwing your customers. Until this “trading error” took place, everyone that I’ve heard from was incredibly happy with their experience as a ProphetMax Member.
So at the end of the day I could be totally wrong, but I just don’t believe this mishap was intentional or that devious motives existed behind it.
Until I see CLEAR evidence that there was intentional fraud (which I have not), I do not have any personal interest in taking legal action. Those who throw that idea around like it’s a casual endeavor, have clearly never been involved in a legal battle.
I went through my first last year, and even though I was the one prosecuting and we won, it took years off my life, and cost over $100,000 with zero chance of ever recovering a dime.
On the other hand, I would love to see him make the big man move in some way. At bare minimum I would like to see him honor any refund requests that are made, but that’s his call.
2: What is the state of our relationship with Investment Intelligence Corp, and ProphetMax moving forward?
Even assuming that this was an honest, yet tragic mistake on Kevin’s part that he may very well be able to recover from, Robert and I cannot continue to share ProphetMax to EVG Members moving forward.
Personally, I have been extremely unhappy with the way Senen has handled the situation.
I let him know that I was furious that he took down the ProphetMax Facebook page last week during the middle of this event. If you’re in a leadership position when something like this happens, you humbly stand up and take the arrows, you communicate, listen, apologize, and you do whatever you can to come up with the best possible solution.
When our entire executive team attended the “explanation webinar” last week, we were blown away by the lack of sympathy, empathy, or understanding shown.
Instead, it was a display of ego, contempt, arrogance, and impatience on a level that I still find hard to believe. Even if they manage to recover the losses in our accounts, we cannot do business with a company that does not know how to communicate with their clients effectively and graciously.
As you can see, this letter has replaced the video content of Lesson 19. This will disappear entirely when the new re-design of the site is finished next month.
3: What am I going to do with my Managed FX account, and remaining funds?
I’ve thought about this for quite some time, and have talked to Paul Haarman about it extensively.
Before I share my thoughts, you need to understand that what I do with my personal money has nothing to do with what you should do with yours. Everyone has different circumstances when it comes to their financial means and priorities.
What YOU SHOULD DO, is what I insist on in every single post or video made inside EVG… You should contact Paul or your licensed financial advisor and make a decision with their counsel.
With that being said…
I will absolutely NOT put any additional funds into my account under any circumstance.
I am going to KEEP what I have left in my account. When we held the live Q&A videos about ProphetMax a few months ago, I mentioned several times that the only money I’m putting into something like this is what I consider, “Vegas Money”… Money that I can emotionally and financially afford to lose.I emotionally let go of the tens-of-thousands of dollars I invested into Managed FX the moment I funded the account. As stated in the videos and the emails above, I would never invest money that I NEEDED into an investment like this, and I always take full responsibility for the decisions I make.You are obviously free to pursue a refund or whatever recourse from PM that you feel is necessary. As for me, I will do neither. I take full responsibility for my actions and decisions. No one forced me to fund my account. That was my call.If those decisions end up being painful, that’s good.I want to experience that pain so I can learn from my mistakes. If I were to pursue some kind of recourse, then the lesson I would learn in life is that I’m a victim and that someone else is responsible for the things that happen to me.
That is not who I am, who I want to be, or how I want to live.
My goal in The Elevation Group is to become a better, smarter investor.
Feeling the pain of this decision will move me closer to that goal. Pointing the finger and placing responsibility on someone else will not.
So I feel like I have two choices at this point, and neither of them have to do with money. They have to do with my personal outlook on life and humanity.
If I were to pull out my funds (funds that I do not need), I’d be saying to the universe that I’m a victim, and that I have no faith in the good of people, so I’m going to save and guard what I have left.
On the other hand, by leaving in the funds, I feel like I’m voting for faith in the goodness of man. I want to believe that Kevin Clarke has taken this personally, that he feels remorseful for what’s happened, and that he wants to do everything in his power to make it up to everyone.
That’s the kind of world I’d prefer to live in, so I’m going to give him that chance.
I could very well end up losing every single penny, but I will always view life through a glass half-full, and I will always take action toward the outcome that I want to see. Failure to do so will inevitably lead to a bitter life of victim-hood, and I refuse to accept that outcome.
On the other hand, if I had funded a Quant account which was not affected by this event, I would take this opportunity to look around and learn from what’s happened and I would seriously consider pulling those funds, especially if I couldn’t afford to lose that money. (If that were the case, I shouldn’t have made this investment to begin with).
4: What lessons have we taken away from this?
Prudent words of caution fall on deaf ears when people see Dollar signs.It has become clear that no matter how many times I state that EVG is my personal diary into the world of finance (for better or worse), or that people need to seek counsel from their advisor before making any kind of investment, that this advice is ignored by some.Given this lesson learned, we’re making sweeping changes to The Elevation Group business model and Member’s Area in the coming weeks.We are going to put the majority of our focus on showing people what we’ve learned when it comes to creating a solid foundation in today’s new economy, and we’re going to stay away from higher-risk speculative opportunities.We have come up with a truly incredible, and very safe investment strategy (in my opinion), over the past two years, that’s returning over 30% per year, and we want to continue to put our focus on developing that blueprint. (I’m referring to the vertical stacking of Infinite Banking, freeing your IRA, cash-flow real estate, and tax reduction).
In order to help bring more experience, wisdom, and professional guidance to the Group, Robert and I have asked Paul Haarman to officially join EVG as a Partner this week.I’m happy to say that he has accepted, and in the coming months he will have an official role here.
I have a new appreciation for Mark Ford’s wisdom that was given in Lesson 15…One of the key takeaways that he shared with EVG Members, was that he never puts more than 3% of his investable money into an investment. Now I know why and I will continue to follow this advice.
Any and every future investment opportunity we explore will be fully vetted by Paul, professional analysts, and our legal team. Even though this may help us reduce risk to the smallest level possible, there is no such thing as a “sure thing.”The “human error” that took place in Managed FX could have just as easily happened no matter how much scrutiny and diligence had been performed. Diligence can only help reduce risk. It cannot remove it.
That despite the greatest of intentions, life finds a way to humble you.
So those are my feelings on this topic and our decisions about it. I want to thank those of you who have been patient and supportive through this process.
Paul has graciously offered to provide free phone consultation to those of you who’d like his guidance in planning your course of action… His information can be found on the resource page, but
****** PLEASE ******
1: Do not call him unless you REALLY need his help.
2: Do not expect a call back immediately.
He is currently fighting cancer, going through chemo, etc…
He’s the kind of guy that wants to help at any cost, but he has his physical limits right now…
This has been a massive source of lessons learned for all of us here at EVG, and it will ultimately help us become wiser, stronger, and more effective as we move into the future…
Sincerely,
Mike Dillard
[You can Vomit if you would like because over 1000 people in his group are commending him for his courage. This needs to be stopped as the members seem to be under a strange spell]
[Updated Friday, May 25, 2012]
From the very beginning, The Elevation Group has been a diary based on my own personal adventures into the world of finance and investing.
And one of the unique traits of a diary is that it’s only relevant if you include the positive moments along with the bad… The thrill of victory, and the agony of defeat.
Since this project launched in December of 2010, I’ve had nothing but victories to share with you, but I knew when I started EVG, that a flawless streak of wins was an impossibility, and that at some point, a loss would occur.
Well I regret to say, that day has finally arrived.
While it would be much easier to sweep this loss under the rug and try to save face, it would be a lie, and it would go against the spirit of this entire project.
The lessons learned from a defeat are infinitely more valuable than those learned from a victory, so in reality, this post may be the most valuable (yet painful) I’ve ever had to write.
This past January, Robert and I flew down to Brisbane, Australia to interview Senen Pousa about his product ProphetMax, which I’d casually kept an eye on for several years.
In 2011, I finally purchased a PM Membership and was extremely impressed by the content I found, and the potential returns that were possible through their recommended trading resources.
I sat and watched for another six months, until Robert and I finally decided to personally invest in their Managed FX program, and share this resource with EVG Members.
Now I’m a bit old-fashioned and idealistic when it comes to business relationships, as a handshake and a man’s word means infinitely more to me than a contract.
So Robert and I decided to fly to Brisbane to spend three days with Senen in person, in order to frankly, judge him as a person (I’m sure he was doing the same with us).
The bottom line is that we all came away from that meeting as kindred spirits with the same mission to revolutionize the financial industry, and empower the middle class.
We felt great about ProphetMax… We loved the content, and the fact that you were required to go through a fairly extensive education process before you were even given access to their trading partners. Requiring education before investment demonstrated to us that we were aligned from a priority standpoint.
In February, we introduced Senen to EVG, and it was the single most popular post we’ve ever made.
People truly resonated with him as a person, his message, and the potential opportunity to make 100%+ returns per year, based on their previous 48 month track record.
And it was during this time that I learned Lesson #1…
“Prudent words of caution fall on deaf ears when people see Dollar signs.”
Whenever I release a new lesson or discuss an investment opportunity inside EVG, I always make sure that it’s put into context of my overall strategy.
In this case, I shared quite a few words of wisdom that where seemingly unheeded by many…
First, I made it clear that the only reason I’m even considering forex trading, is because I’ve spent the past three years putting in a very solid, conservative investment foundation which I shared during our video sessions with Senen…
As stated, that foundation consists of three parts:
Infinite Banking.
Precious metals.
And cash flow real estate.
Second, only with these pieces in place, was I now at a point where I could pursue riskier investments like FX. The money I would put into this kind of opportunity was what I called in the videos, “Vegas Money”. This is money that I was emotionally and financially willing and able to lose every penny of.
Over the next few weeks, I got an email from our resident EVG tax expert Tom Wheelwright, which resulted in an email that has become quite infamous within our community…
Instead of simply re-capping that email, I want to post it in full here, because the message it contains is now more important and tangible than ever…
Those of who have not read this email may find that it’s quite harsh. Part II which has been pasted below will explain why.
================================
PART I:
“I don’t know what to say… I’m, frustrated, angry, and so disappointed in a few EVG Members right now…
I had a great talk with our resident CPA Tom Wheelwright yesterday about my tax strategy, and as we were about to end the call, he mentioned something that left me speechless…
He said, “Mike I’m really concerned… Many of our Wealth Strategy clients have called us up this week, cancelled their wealth strategy sessions with our team, and said they’re putting 100% of their money into Senen’s ProphetMax trading program.”
Upon hearing that, my jaw dropped and I was overcome by sheer disbelief, anger, disgust, and disappointment. I believe, “You have to be ****ing kidding me…”, was my actual response.
But he wasn’t, and now you guys are going to get a giant ****ing wake-up call today.
If you have virgin ears, or if you’re easily offended, stop reading this and contact Elevation Group Support « Mike Dillard's Elevation Group to cancel your membership. I really don’t give a damn.
First and foremost, let’s review what EVG is, and is not…
The Elevation Group is my personal DIARY. I am documenting what I am doing with my money, and sharing the contract information of the people I invest with so that you can work with them should you choose to do so.
My overall goal with EVG has been two-fold…
To generate awareness among our Member’s as to what’s taking place around the world financially so that you may protect yourselves from the risks that continue to mount, and to demonstrate the alternative investments that the rich use, so that you may have the opportunity to turn economic chaos into prosperity.
Revealing the strategies that we’ve revealed over the past year in the candid, personal, and intimate way we have to the public has never been done before, and now I’m finding out why…
While I expect many of our Member’s to contact and work with the incredible people and resources I meet and introduce to the Group like Tom Wheelwright, Paul Haarman, JP, Adrian, Dan, Sean, Senen, etc…
I did not expect people to abandon reason, or to act so irresponsibly when simply given access to information.
Putting 100% of your money into ANY investment, whether that’s gold, Dollars, bonds, stocks, real estate, or anything… Is sheer ****ing stupidity, and the height of recklessness.
Do you want to know how much money I’m trading with Senen’s team?
3% of my net-worth.
3 PERCENT.
AND ON TOP OF THAT… I’m only making this investment because I’ve spent the past three years creating an incredibly safe financial foundation…
First I purchased precious metals back in 2007.
Then I started a home business so I can control my cash-flow.
Next I set up an Infinite Banking System using life-insurance.
After that I started working with Tom to strategically minimize my tax liability so i could, “make money”, by keeping more of it.
A few months ago I purchased an apartment complex with some of the most knowledgable investors on the planet.
And now…. ONLY AFTER 95% of my net-worth has been invested in these safe and conservative vehicles, am I beginning to look at investments that offer higher returns, with more risk.
And yet here I am sitting at dinner last night talking to Tom, and hear that a few of you have decided to, “go all in, and put it all on black.”
If you’re one of these people, I’ll make these very plain and simple for you to understand… You’re a ****ing idiot.
You’ve make me second guess the viability of what we’re trying to do to change the world.
NOW I finally understand why the rich don’t tell the poor or middle class what they’re doing with their money.
Now I understand why most people hand their money over to an advisor, only to get willingly screwed in the ass by most of them… It’s because you’d do even worse if you were left to your own devices.
You’re reckless.
You’re emotional.
You’re desperate.
You don’t take responsibility for your actions.
And you’re jeopardizing an incredible thing for those who ARE ready for this kind of information.
If you’re having to put the majority of your money in Senen’s recommended brokerage company just to meet the minimum funding level of $10,000, THEN YOU HAVE NO BUSINESS INVESTING. PERIOD.
So if you’re one of these people, then I have some advice for you and I want you to take it…
STOP.
At this point in time, you do not have the emotional intelligence necessary to make sound financial decisions. I want you to contact your financial advisor and do exactly what they tell you to do.
You’re welcome to remain an EVG Member if you want to continue developing your financial intelligence, but I want you to sit on the sidelines unless you get authorization from your advisor to contact one of our resources.
And as for the rest of you, let this be a lessoned learned for all. This isn’t a game, and if you’re not ready to act responsibly, you shouldn’t act.
A really pissed-off,
Mike Dillard
=========================================
Which was followed up by Part II a week later…
=========================================
PART II
Well after a great event in Baltimore, Robert and I have just arrived in Vegas for an incredibly special meeting today, as we sit down with Kahn of KahnAcademy.org, Eben Pagan, and Tony Hsieh, the Founder of Zappos.com.
The topic?
How we can reinvent the global education system.
But before we begin that discussion, I’d like to finish the one I started on Friday… A conclusion to the rant that sent men and women screaming for the hills, and calling me crazy…
After all, what kind of business owner dares to use profanity in front of a global audience, and then insult his paying customers???
The answer is quite simple…
One that cares about you and your future, more than you know.
I meant every word of what I said on Friday. It was not the first time I’ve sent an email like that over the past eight years, and it will not be the last.
“But is that really necessary Mike? Do you really need to swear like that?”
The answer is yes, and no.
When I sit down and write an email or record a video to our audience, I have one standard that over-rides all else… And that is to be true to myself, and my intentions at any cost.
After I got off the phone with Tom and heard about some of the reckless decisions that a few Members were making, I had several responses to choose from…
A: I could have cared less and done nothing.
B: I could have written a politically correct email that would have been safe to write… Nice, sweet, and inoffensive, but at the end of the day, it would not have been honest or from my core.
Or I could have written the email that I sent on Friday.
An email that was completely unfiltered and from the heart… An email written to grab you by neck and wake you up… An email that you would never forget, an email that you needed to hear, and that no one has had the guts to give you…
I am very well aware of the fact that sending an email like that would cause a few customers to ask for a refund and leave. I knew that it would cause people to unsubscribe from our list, and I knew that it would bring my reputation into question.
So why would I do that?
Because above all things, including money, reputation, or ego, I must be true to myself and my intentions, and if there is a price to be paid for that, then so be it.
That’s what leadership is.
It’s not about doing what’s easy. It’s about doing what’s right.
The reason so many people are in the mess they’re in today, is because no one cared enough about them to man-up and tell them the cold, hard, unfiltered truth about the decisions they’re making.
Well I do, and I will.
I don’t care if it costs us money, our subscribers count, or my reputation. At the end of the day, I don’t give a damn about those things. If I did, I wouldn’t have sent anything at all.
I care about you, and whether you liked that email, or were offended by it, at the very least you know that I will always be true to myself, our mission, and to you, no matter what.
Sincerely,
Mike Dillard
========================================
I can only hope that these words of caution were heeded.
That brings us up to the present week, a few months later…
This past week, a 65% drawdown took place in most Managed FX clients accounts, mine included, due to a human error made by their head trader.
Over the past few days, Senen has sent several emails and held a webinar to explain the reason for the decline, which is summarized here:
“I understand what has happened. I can confirm conclusively that the losses on some accounts were indeed legitimate and
caused by Kevin’s (human) error, not by algorithmic trading.
I can also confirm that not all accounts lost money. Some in fact made money yesterday. I can also confirm that nothing
like this has ever happened in Kevin’s entire trading career, and that Kevin immediately took full responsibility for his error without a single word of defensiveness, blame or justification.”
- Senen
Is it true? A lie? I have no idea…
Whatever the reason may be, I know that it doesn’t change what happened, and that it’s incredibly painful for many of you.
Our goal in EVG is to empower people, and to help them increase their levels of prosperity and wealth in their lives, so having to deal with this kind of loss from one of our recommended resources has been gut wrenching.
I want you to know that our entire team has been affected by this in a very deep way, and while we can’t turn back time, we are taking painful lessons away from this that we will all remember for the rest of our lives.
With that being said, I’d like to answer a few common questions that are on most people’s minds…
1: Do I think we were all victims of an elaborate scam, or a legitimate, yet unfortunate mistake?
It’s possible that this has been a massive scam, but I don’t think so. Here’s why…
ProphetMax has been around for at least three years. If anything like this had happened before, it would have been all over the net. I did not find any negative comments about the program during my review of the company.
If Senen’s intention were to get as many people as possible to invest as much money as possible, he wouldn’t have required people to go through so many hours of training and barriers to entry before getting access to the Managed FX area in Level 3.
In fact, they would have made it as easy as possible to fund your account, which is the exact opposite experience that PM Members have. It’s actually a pain in the ass in my opinion.
The Quant FX accounts were completely unaffected. If they were trying to steal everyone’s money, I’d assume that those accounts would have been affected as well.
Most con artists use fake identities and then “go black” after they’ve stolen a large amount of money. They simply disappear. The email addresses, websites, phone numbers, and everything else simply stop working and the people vanish. Senen isn’t using a fake identity, and he hasn’t gone anywhere, and I find it hard to believe that if this was some giant scheme to defraud us, that he’d still be holding two webinars a week on personal development, as he’s done for the past three years.
I don’t think that Kevin Clarke, the head trader who made the mistake, would have come out in front of an audience with his real name and explained what happened. His name and his reputation are now tied to this story online, and I don’t think an intelligent scam artist would put his identity out there for scrutiny.
Senen has had plans to continue to grow his business in a big way for the long run. You don’t do that by intentionally screwing your customers. Until this “trading error” took place, everyone that I’ve heard from was incredibly happy with their experience as a ProphetMax Member.
So at the end of the day I could be totally wrong, but I just don’t believe this mishap was intentional or that devious motives existed behind it.
Until I see CLEAR evidence that there was intentional fraud (which I have not), I do not have any personal interest in taking legal action. Those who throw that idea around like it’s a casual endeavor, have clearly never been involved in a legal battle.
I went through my first last year, and even though I was the one prosecuting and we won, it took years off my life, and cost over $100,000 with zero chance of ever recovering a dime.
On the other hand, I would love to see him make the big man move in some way. At bare minimum I would like to see him honor any refund requests that are made, but that’s his call.
2: What is the state of our relationship with Investment Intelligence Corp, and ProphetMax moving forward?
Even assuming that this was an honest, yet tragic mistake on Kevin’s part that he may very well be able to recover from, Robert and I cannot continue to share ProphetMax to EVG Members moving forward.
Personally, I have been extremely unhappy with the way Senen has handled the situation.
I let him know that I was furious that he took down the ProphetMax Facebook page last week during the middle of this event. If you’re in a leadership position when something like this happens, you humbly stand up and take the arrows, you communicate, listen, apologize, and you do whatever you can to come up with the best possible solution.
When our entire executive team attended the “explanation webinar” last week, we were blown away by the lack of sympathy, empathy, or understanding shown.
Instead, it was a display of ego, contempt, arrogance, and impatience on a level that I still find hard to believe. Even if they manage to recover the losses in our accounts, we cannot do business with a company that does not know how to communicate with their clients effectively and graciously.
As you can see, this letter has replaced the video content of Lesson 19. This will disappear entirely when the new re-design of the site is finished next month.
3: What am I going to do with my Managed FX account, and remaining funds?
I’ve thought about this for quite some time, and have talked to Paul Haarman about it extensively.
Before I share my thoughts, you need to understand that what I do with my personal money has nothing to do with what you should do with yours. Everyone has different circumstances when it comes to their financial means and priorities.
What YOU SHOULD DO, is what I insist on in every single post or video made inside EVG… You should contact Paul or your licensed financial advisor and make a decision with their counsel.
With that being said…
I will absolutely NOT put any additional funds into my account under any circumstance.
I am going to KEEP what I have left in my account. When we held the live Q&A videos about ProphetMax a few months ago, I mentioned several times that the only money I’m putting into something like this is what I consider, “Vegas Money”… Money that I can emotionally and financially afford to lose.I emotionally let go of the tens-of-thousands of dollars I invested into Managed FX the moment I funded the account. As stated in the videos and the emails above, I would never invest money that I NEEDED into an investment like this, and I always take full responsibility for the decisions I make.You are obviously free to pursue a refund or whatever recourse from PM that you feel is necessary. As for me, I will do neither. I take full responsibility for my actions and decisions. No one forced me to fund my account. That was my call.If those decisions end up being painful, that’s good.I want to experience that pain so I can learn from my mistakes. If I were to pursue some kind of recourse, then the lesson I would learn in life is that I’m a victim and that someone else is responsible for the things that happen to me.
That is not who I am, who I want to be, or how I want to live.
My goal in The Elevation Group is to become a better, smarter investor.
Feeling the pain of this decision will move me closer to that goal. Pointing the finger and placing responsibility on someone else will not.
So I feel like I have two choices at this point, and neither of them have to do with money. They have to do with my personal outlook on life and humanity.
If I were to pull out my funds (funds that I do not need), I’d be saying to the universe that I’m a victim, and that I have no faith in the good of people, so I’m going to save and guard what I have left.
On the other hand, by leaving in the funds, I feel like I’m voting for faith in the goodness of man. I want to believe that Kevin Clarke has taken this personally, that he feels remorseful for what’s happened, and that he wants to do everything in his power to make it up to everyone.
That’s the kind of world I’d prefer to live in, so I’m going to give him that chance.
I could very well end up losing every single penny, but I will always view life through a glass half-full, and I will always take action toward the outcome that I want to see. Failure to do so will inevitably lead to a bitter life of victim-hood, and I refuse to accept that outcome.
On the other hand, if I had funded a Quant account which was not affected by this event, I would take this opportunity to look around and learn from what’s happened and I would seriously consider pulling those funds, especially if I couldn’t afford to lose that money. (If that were the case, I shouldn’t have made this investment to begin with).
4: What lessons have we taken away from this?
Prudent words of caution fall on deaf ears when people see Dollar signs.It has become clear that no matter how many times I state that EVG is my personal diary into the world of finance (for better or worse), or that people need to seek counsel from their advisor before making any kind of investment, that this advice is ignored by some.Given this lesson learned, we’re making sweeping changes to The Elevation Group business model and Member’s Area in the coming weeks.We are going to put the majority of our focus on showing people what we’ve learned when it comes to creating a solid foundation in today’s new economy, and we’re going to stay away from higher-risk speculative opportunities.We have come up with a truly incredible, and very safe investment strategy (in my opinion), over the past two years, that’s returning over 30% per year, and we want to continue to put our focus on developing that blueprint. (I’m referring to the vertical stacking of Infinite Banking, freeing your IRA, cash-flow real estate, and tax reduction).
In order to help bring more experience, wisdom, and professional guidance to the Group, Robert and I have asked Paul Haarman to officially join EVG as a Partner this week.I’m happy to say that he has accepted, and in the coming months he will have an official role here.
I have a new appreciation for Mark Ford’s wisdom that was given in Lesson 15…One of the key takeaways that he shared with EVG Members, was that he never puts more than 3% of his investable money into an investment. Now I know why and I will continue to follow this advice.
Any and every future investment opportunity we explore will be fully vetted by Paul, professional analysts, and our legal team. Even though this may help us reduce risk to the smallest level possible, there is no such thing as a “sure thing.”The “human error” that took place in Managed FX could have just as easily happened no matter how much scrutiny and diligence had been performed. Diligence can only help reduce risk. It cannot remove it.
That despite the greatest of intentions, life finds a way to humble you.
So those are my feelings on this topic and our decisions about it. I want to thank those of you who have been patient and supportive through this process.
Paul has graciously offered to provide free phone consultation to those of you who’d like his guidance in planning your course of action… His information can be found on the resource page, but
****** PLEASE ******
1: Do not call him unless you REALLY need his help.
2: Do not expect a call back immediately.
He is currently fighting cancer, going through chemo, etc…
He’s the kind of guy that wants to help at any cost, but he has his physical limits right now…
This has been a massive source of lessons learned for all of us here at EVG, and it will ultimately help us become wiser, stronger, and more effective as we move into the future…
Sincerely,
Mike Dillard
[You can Vomit if you would like because over 1000 people in his group are commending him for his courage. This needs to be stopped as the members seem to be under a strange spell]
I have plenty of compassion, and yes a heard all the talk that Senen told us about how it was supposed to work, it is tragic, no doubt about it. But getting on here and spreading lies, half truths and stirring up trouble doesn't do one single thing to solve the problem. The Government is not going to do anything unless there was straight up fraud period. Just like the brief someone posted earlier about a Kevin Clark. You can not get your money back, it is gone, if you made a mistake and invested more than you can afford to, like I did, I am the dip**** that borrowed 100,000 on my house and deposited it two days before the losses, then we are down 63%, well I have a long way to go to get even. Let's get started. I have been in for six weeks total and its not started very good, but I am not touching the money for two years period. If the trade had went the other way and I was up 63% I still wouldn't touch the money for two years. Its called have a plan and investing with a plan for the longterm. No one has lost anything yet, you just have a smaller balance in your account, at the end of your period, two years, five years, ten years, that is when you realize your wins or lossess.
Feel free to call me any name you want to call me, it only proves my point. you people are only hear for evil, to call names, spout lies, spread misery and be victims. Way to be Proud Americans. Hate the fat lady on foodstamps with six kids, that still has a car, phone and cigaretts while she plays at the casino, and hate the Government for making it happen, but the first time an investment looses money run to the government to save you. You are pathetic, hypocrites with no pride, no wisdom and no honor. So call me names, attack those that offer to help you and sit here in your misery consoling others with their misery. PATHETIC
chestnut13
Junior member
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Seriously man, people on here are trying to help you. I feel for you. Everyone feels for you. But you are being obtuse. GET THE F**K OUT. There is no logical reason not to. Wake up and smell the coffee.
I feel bad for ya bro. Not because you lost your money, but because even after having your bank account brutally raped you're still willing to defend this massacre.
Best of luck.
Lightning McQueen
Moderator
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i'm sorry to break the news to you bigolboy that you may be the one that is "PATHETIC" how does your family feel on you borrowing 100K on the family home? have you even come clean yet to the 63% loss? i believe they may think you are the evil one.
anyways, sorry to hear of your losses. i really think you need to stop hitting out at the wrong people, maybe look in the mirror for starters. then think about who sold you this, good luck
anyways, sorry to hear of your losses. i really think you need to stop hitting out at the wrong people, maybe look in the mirror for starters. then think about who sold you this, good luck
Not one person here is trying to help with anything. Every single one of you are about spreading crap and creating antimosity. But your right about right about one thing I should get out and leave you maggots to woller in your pathetic victim mentality. Leave you to you lies and misreprsentations, so that you can feel strong in your numbers, no wait I don't think I will since i guess I live in a free country, and I have pride and I am willing to stand up to bullies like you.
If you want me to shut up, I would love to, all you have to do is stick to the facts of what happened, give people your opinion on what you think happened and differenciate between the two...Stop telling lies and then acting like that is the truth. and you will not see another post from my sorry ass.
i'm sorry to break the news to you bigolboy that you may be the one that is "PATHETIC" how does your family feel on you borrowing 100K on the family home? have you even come clean yet to the 63% loss? i believe they may think you are the evil one.
anyways, sorry to hear of your losses. i really think you need to stop hitting out at the wrong people, maybe look in the mirror for starters. then think about who sold you this, good luck
I appreciate your false concern for my family, and yes the wife does know of the events, but she has a brain and she understands that one days balance two years before we are going to touch the money doesn't make a bit of difference, other than an oh crap, instead of a yeehaw. I am not the least bit angry about the loss or the way it happened or the investments, I am ****ing pissed that for 118 pages all you guys do is lie, misrepresent, name call and spread crap instead of being productive in a bad situation.
:clap: I appriciate you kind words. But my account will be just fine. And the very best of luck to you.
thepixelpusher
Well-known member
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Seriously, stop by an accountant and let him show you how long it will take to get back to your $100,000 at whatever rate you think PM can reliably get you per month.
During that time it takes you won't have earned positive interest on your account and will not have earned any extra money to pay the interest on the loan. Assuming things don't go wrong again, you might not even have any money to pay back the equity loan in your house and they will come to take your home from you.
I understand you're upset and you desperately hope the situation resolves itself and feel we're unfair.
We aren't.
No normal financial business runs under these pyramid marketing tricks, I know because I've had financial companies as clients. The people on this forum have seen these threads before, and probably will see them again. The end is always the same...devastation to those who wait and lose more. These risky instruments are only for those that understand and can judge the quality of the trades and actions of the brokers. What happened with ProphetMax is not typical with world class brokers. People here have demonstrated that with evidence, as well as some emotional comments. Read the evidence in the this thread and strip away the emotion and judge for yourself whether you're willing to stake losing your home over this risky, risky investment that was sold as solid, safe and secure.
I don't blame you for buying into this if you don't know about Forex investing. Mike Dillard was masterful at selling hope when the economy is taking a toll on every last cent we have saved.
Hey Pixel, what you don't understand is I am not a victum. I know full well where I stand, I don't need to sit down with an accountant I am perfectly capable to running the numbers. You say "people have demonstated that with evidence" there is not one shread of evidence in this forum that PM is a scam. Now I have all the evidence in the world that what happened should not have happened, and that it was stupid that it even could happen. And perhaps that means it isn't a worhty investment and that is a fine conclusion for people to come to. I choose to say it is worth the risk for me. I would not recommend it to my mom, but if I lose 100k the so be it, but if the track records prove right then in a few years I'll be back and have a story to tell when it done.
I have no problems with all you telling you stories, good or bad. But just stick to the facts and when you voice your opinion say in my opinion. Don't tell people this is a scam, tell them the truth, people were oversold on the safety and then they lost 63% in one day. That alone is scary enough to keep any sane person away. But when you pile one, spread lies and carry on like you have been you become the one in the wrong not Senen.
The positions are closed, the losses have been crystalised - that's a loss bigolboy. I don't know where you learned to trade or invest but here's another cold hard fact for you: to RECOVER your LOSS with only the 35% left in your account will require Kevin and co to make 300% profit just to get you back to break even. How long were you planning to keep your funds in this account again ...? :whistling
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