Overpaid bosses ?

[Pat494]

I was amazed by a programme on R4 this morning about Britain's bosses and their pay, er remuneration as they loftily call it.

The FTSE 100 bosses average pay is £5 million per year + pension + perks.

On average their pay is 81 times the pay of their lowest paid company worker

And Cameron wonders why people who are paid peanuts at the bottom are not wholly committed to the idea that Britain is fair !! Britain has never been fair. It is unlikely that even the most gullible will see that it is. If that "hot air merchant" wants fair then he really must even out the rewards.
I am not saying everyone should be paid the same for a day's work as in Commie fairyland but the present system is a sore that eats away at a company's competivity.

He should be FAIR or shut up about pretending to be, the cheat !!

Most of the bosses are very ordinary folk, with a few exceptions. They are milking the company coffers dry, which means jobs going off to the Far East etc.

 

[Hotch]

Commie

 

[robster970]

It was an interview on the Today programme wasn't it? The private equity guy finished off the interview when being asked by John Humphries whether 81 was fair by saying it is a completely ridiculous multiple especially where the bosses have nothing at risk, which to be fair, none of them do apart from their precious 'reputations'.

The private equity guy also at the beginning of the interview was at pains to point out that the gains in FTSE over the last 2 years have little to do with corporate performance which is masking just how ridiculous the pay is.

 

[Masquerade]

Maybe you should read up on MRP.

 

[robster970]

Maybe you should read up on MRP.

What is it?

 

[robster970]

Found it.

 

[Pat494]

It was an interview on the Today programme wasn't it? The private equity guy finished off the interview when being asked by John Humphries whether 81 was fair by saying it is a completely ridiculous multiple especially where the bosses have nothing at risk, which to be fair, none of them do apart from their precious 'reputations'.

The private equity guy also at the beginning of the interview was at pains to point out that the gains in FTSE over the last 2 years have little to do with corporate performance which is masking just how ridiculous the pay is.

That's right it was

And for the unconvinced I may as well add that their average pay rise last year was a whopping 55% on an already huge figure

Greedy pigs or what !!

 

[amit1986]

And Cameron wonders why people who are paid peanuts at the bottom are not wholly committed to the idea that Britain is fair !! Britain has never been fair.

This doesn't only happen in Britian - it also happens in the U.S. and other well developed countries.

I am not saying everyone should be paid the same for a day's work as in Commie fairyland but the present system is a sore that eats away at a company's competivity.

He should be FAIR or shut up about pretending to be, the cheat !!

Most of the bosses are very ordinary folk, with a few exceptions. They are milking the company coffers dry, which means jobs going off to the Far East etc.

While some of them do get paid a little too much, to say they should even out the pay with all employees is a little too excessive.

Most of these employees haven't put themselves through rigorous education and therefore, aren't as deserving for these rewards.

Most of these employees aren't as dedicated to the firm as the bosses are, who have probably spent blood, sweat and tears into the company.

For all those sacrifices, they are more deserving for higher pay.

No doubt some CEOs do get paid too much (for example, CEO of Goldman Sachs a few years back made hundreds of millions in just one year alone), but they certainly do deserve higher pay than the average staff.

 

[Atilla]

That's right it was

And for the unconvinced I may as well add that their average pay rise last year was a whopping 55% on an already huge figure

Greedy pigs or what !!

No where else is inefficiency and incompetence rewarded in greater scale on planet Earth as it is in England... Been saying this for some time.

Hooraaahhh - At least we lead the world in one area of accomplishment... We make incompetence a class act which is superbly well rewarded and make it look effortless. Beat that. :cheesy:

Even the great USA and Obama has capped bankers pay at $0.5m Cameron and crew have done jack.

Moreover, they are about to legislate the financing of 2nd homes so it will all be legit soon enough.




On a side note - reading this great book by John O'Farrell - http://www.amazon.co.uk/Utterly-Imp...3964/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1294338587&sr=8-3

History of Britain in a tongue and cheek way... Brilliantly funny. Apparently we inherited our snobbery from those stuck up Frenchy Normans...

At least we have someone to blame...

 

[scose-no-doubt]

If you want a real laugh look into nomination committees and how they use a merry-go-round nth degree of separation approach to swerve cross directorships and conflicts of interest on nomination. Same for NEDs pay.
Combined code is a load of **** and institutional shareholders are too busy getting back handers or other perks to give a ****.
Quite lulzy and cartelish imo. If I don't make it in Finance or investment which is what I really want I'm shooting for CFO or similar. Very cushy.

 

[scose-no-doubt]

Amit that's a load of Tosh. Most of these people are nudge winked into their positions. Hate to sound daily mirrory but take Goodwin for example. What the blazes could he possibly offer? Fancy letters don't make a competent businessman or strategic mastermind. It should be based on performance pure qnd simple but given results e.g. Ftse as mentioned earlier this obviously isn't the case.

 

[Atilla]

This doesn't only happen in Britian - it also happens in the U.S. and other well developed countries.




While some of them do get paid a little too much, to say they should even out the pay with all employees is a little too excessive.

Most of these employees haven't put themselves through rigorous education and therefore, aren't as deserving for these rewards.

Most of these employees aren't as dedicated to the firm as the bosses are, who have probably spent blood, sweat and tears into the company.

For all those sacrifices, they are more deserving for higher pay.

No doubt some CEOs do get paid too much (for example, CEO of Goldman Sachs a few years back made hundreds of millions in just one year alone), but they certainly do deserve higher pay than the average staff.

I beg to differ. Consider bonuses in banks.

Higher your grade and higher your bonus.

In contrast people are dead against progressive taxation. There should be flat rate bonuses just as there is taxation.

eg: Everybody in the company should get 10% bonus based on salary.

What happens in reality is grade 2-3 get 5%
3-4 get 7.5%
6-7 get 10%
7-9 get 15&
+ discretionary bonus
+ retention bonus
+ guaranteed bonus

What the fucuk is all that about. More you earn more bonus you get.

Sorry but the system is about as hard as door nails being nailed through ones balls.

Balls busting physical hard work gets peanuts.

Sitting round tables having tea and biscuits gets the millions.


I've had a few arguments at work at suggesting alternatives and some rich *******s go red in the face all scratchy defending their hard work and efforts pretty much as you suggest in your arguments.

There are obviously people on this board who similarly loath me because they feel I have a chip on my shoulder.

No not at all. But there you go... Each to their own...

I call that valuing ones personal **** as smelling of roses whilst being disgusted by the guys in the next cubicle... Such is life.

 

[Pat494]

This doesn't only happen in Britian - it also happens in the U.S. and other well developed countries.

The US and Europe better shape up in the near future or lose many jobs

While some of them do get paid a little too much, to say they should even out the pay with all employees is a little too excessive.

I didn't suggest all employees are paid equally. Pay should be judged on input, commitment, length of service etc. Higher rewards for better work.

Most of these employees haven't put themselves through rigorous education and therefore, aren't as deserving for these rewards.

There a plenty of so-called degree people who contribute very little to the overall performance of the company. The other people would be the best judges of who deserves what plus pay should be tied to the performance of the company. In good times it goes up and in bad times it goes down.



Most of these employees aren't as dedicated to the firm as the bosses are, who have probably spent blood, sweat and tears into the company.

If you were unfairly treated you wouldn't want to

For all those sacrifices, they are more deserving for higher pay.

No doubt some CEOs do get paid too much (for example, CEO of Goldman Sachs a few years back made hundreds of millions in just one year alone), but they certainly do deserve higher pay than the average staff.

Companies have much greater chances of survival if it is a genuine team effort and you won't get that if it is unfair

 

[Hotch]

Everyone getting the same bonus is madness, it should be based on how well you did, if some prat came in late by 2 hours every day and did bugger all he shouldn't get a bonus, should probably get the sack.

 

[scose-no-doubt]

Atilla don't forget the fact that they are paid from the pensions of the ball busted underpaid manual labourer of other companies! It's a spiders web of elitists bending over the little guy just as in politics. Another case of some being more equal in a "capitalist" world.

 

[Pat494]

The company employees know much better than most managements who should be paid what and who is 2 hours late for work regularly.

Many managements hide away on the top floor, with their own lift and car park to make a secretive getaway every night. What rubbish ! The workers would know who is right for which job. Many senior employees don't dare even show their faces on the shop floor. They would get duffed up and they know it.

Did Willy Walsh get to the BA cabin staff Christmas get-togethor ? I doubt it

 

[Atilla]

Everyone getting the same bonus is madness, it should be based on how well you did, if some prat came in late by 2 hours every day and did bugger all he shouldn't get a bonus, should probably get the sack.

I think you'll find that prat happens to be management layer more often than the plebs.

I agree some management and personnel work much longer hours but often the higher the pay less the work.

Greater the authority greater the **** take.


Here is a true story. Previous company hired an IT CEO who messed up in previous company. This guys decides to internalise outsourced services in an effort to centralise a global business. Spends literally 10 million developing a system that does not meet satelite office requirements or performance and decides to internally cross charge 20X upwards the cost of what they are paying for equivalent superior local service today.

Now I have left that company which I was contracting for three years and the talk in year one was it was wrong strategy. SalesForce is a great product but to try and mixit with umpteen difference sources and services and cater for international business with different requirements for customers - finance and sales was simply pie in the sky.

In all honesty and sincerity guys if I was sitting on the board the outcome of this project was written on the board clear as day for all to see. I've recently found out the project after almost 4 years is on its last legs as none of the international sites have signed up to it and it is littered with production problems.

Bunch of stupid ******s. Never liked the idiot. Same goes for the board. I'm talking a FTSE100 company.

I'm sure he'll get a golden handshake and no doubt go off and screw another company.


Only positive is that a whole bunch of contractors such as my self were kept off the streets and in our fancy cars. Really really shiite IT CEO beggars belief.

True story. I'll let you know when he gets the boot as I'll be celebrating with mi ol colleagues with more than a few pints...

 

[Pat494]

I think you'll find that prat happens to be management layer more often than the plebs.

I agree some management and personnel work much longer hours but often the higher the pay less the work.

Greater the authority greater the **** take.


Here is a true story. Previous company hired an IT CEO who messed up in previous company. This guys decides to internalise outsourced services in an effort to centralise a global business. Spends literally 10 million developing a system that does not meet satelite office requirements or performance and decides to internally cross charge 20X upwards the cost of what they are paying for equivalent superior local service today.

Now I have left that company which I was contracting for three years and the talk in year one was it was wrong strategy. SalesForce is a great product but to try and mixit with umpteen difference sources and services and cater for international business with different requirements for customers - finance and sales was simply pie in the sky.

In all honesty and sincerity guys if I was sitting on the board the outcome of this project was written on the board clear as day for all to see. I've recently found out the project after almost 4 years is on its last legs as none of the international sites have signed up to it and it is littered with production problems.

Bunch of stupid ******s. Never liked the idiot. Same goes for the board. I'm talking a FTSE100 company.

I'm sure he'll get a golden handshake and no doubt go off and screw another company.


Only positive is that a whole bunch of contractors such as my self were kept off the streets and in our fancy cars. Really really shiite IT CEO beggars belief.

True story. I'll let you know when he gets the boot as I'll be celebrating with mi ol colleagues with more than a few pints...

Similiar story with the Ford Motor co.
They fired the CEO just in time before the idiot wrecked the company and brought in Alan Mulally.

 

[amit1986]

A lot of you have pretty much said the same thing to my reply, so I'll reply here once:

It's true - education and smartness aren't perfectly positively correlated. However, I can guarantee you that if you check out the educational qualifications of all the FTSE 100 CEOs, a majority of them will be highly educated. This is no mere coincidence. Getting higher education from top institutions does require smartness. It's this smartness that makes these guys/girls reach the top. The education doesn't make them smart - they already were smart.

I used to work at an investment bank part-time and most people there would come in the morning and leave in the evening. There was one individual, however, who would often arrive earlier and stay later than most. He rarely went out for lunch, instead sat on his table while eating. It's been a couple of years since then but I talked to him a while back and now he's been promoted several times and has all the perks to go with a nicer job title. So, while everyone was doing the same thing day-in day-out, this guy was really pushing himself (hence the "blood, sweat, and tears" remark).

Most of the people who get to the top with pure hard work deserve higher pay. No doubt though, some pay is far too excessive.

 

[Pento]

Who do I need to sleep with to get one of these "CEO" jobs you are all talking about?