Exiting a trade is as important as entering it

[FXhunter]

Sometimes you just have to take a gamble in life to win. I can offer you no guarantees but my word. If you strategy doesn't meet my requirements, I will not use it, nor reveal it to anyone. Also if your method is just a minor variation of my method then again we don't have a deal. In that case you would have lost nothing because we both already know the method.

If I take your method and it makes money, I have no reason not to share with you my gain because there's always more where that is coming from. When someone can get things easily, he becomes generous. So it comes down to how confident you are of your entry method to put me in that generous position.

If I understand it correctly, you already have a entry strategy, but It doesn't perform that good, right?
How about this? You show me your method, I try to see if I can make it become better by applying a filter and If I succeed in doing this we have a deal?

 

[BeginnerJoe]

B J

Take a look at the strategies , they have 60 % hit rate.The box is only for support and resistance trading .........but look at the strategy sheets ....nothing to do with boxes.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/forex/162600-box-breakout-pro-scalping.html#post2025236

Some how I think you are fishing for a deal. But your strat hasn't the characteristics I am looking for.

Hope u understood Barjon's holy grail .

Yes I understood that well, as well as many people. For that reason lies its weakness. When a whole bunch of people become predictable because they are following a particular well flagged strat, they will be subject to exploitation, although not always. When the crowd is big, the strat will succeed. But sometimes the crowd is not so big. Then it's anyone guess what will happen. Due to this crowd's predictability, a game might be deliberately set up to play them. Without knowing the win rate, we won't know how holy this grail is. But in my book, I consider it a fair strategy.

 

[BeginnerJoe]

i thought that was precisely the point of this thread. Poor entries cannot (always) be avoided so what do you do? You have to have an exit in that situation.

My point being that if you can identify the perfect entry then you have identified the bottom of each move, and may have found the holy grail. Since this may not be possible then doesn't t make sense to manage the exit.

I agree that the perfect entry is important, but from the perspective that it may never be possible to identify the perfect bottom (or a top for a short) each time so a good entry is never known, but in each instance the exit can be know before hand.

Wouldn't that constitute a safety margin of a bad entry?

Superior entry provides a positive safety margin, in that you can get the hell out before it turns into a loss. Superior exit provides a negative safety margin, in that you can get the hell out before the loss becomes a bigger loss. I am in search of the positive margin and not the perfect entry at the top or bottom.

 

[BeginnerJoe]

If I understand it correctly, you already have a entry strategy, but It doesn't perform that good, right?
How about this? You show me your method, I try to see if I can make it become better by applying a filter and If I succeed in doing this we have a deal?

My strat is under development with frequent refinements. Its performance is unknown since the trades are done with a slightly different strat over time.

As I am offering to make you rich in exchange for your proven strat and not the other way, it makes no sense for me to give you my strat. My strat could well turn out to be the holy grail. I can't risk giving that away for not even a promise of your getting me rich.

 

[barjon]

........................Superior entry provides a positive safety margin, in that you can get the hell out before it turns into a loss...........

The superiority of the entry has nothing to do with it. Safety margin, or not, it's the superior exit that turns the trick to "get the hell out before it turns into a loss". If you get that wrong then it will either turn into a loss or you will miss out on profit.

I have a feeling that you know this only too well and that you are pulling our Yuletide legs

 

[15 min tlb]

My strat is under development with frequent refinements. Its performance is unknown since the trades are done with a slightly different strat over time.

As I am offering to make you rich in exchange for your proven strat and not the other way, it makes no sense for me to give you my strat. My strat could well turn out to be the holy grail. I can't risk giving that away for not even a promise of your getting me rich.

Try ff where all the noobs write free systems and give them away.

 

[new_trader]

A trader is under no obligation to enter a trade. However a trader is obliged to secure a profit or minimise losses once an entry has been made. This makes the exit more important than the entry. As the saying goes - “It is easier to stay out than get out”.

 

[malaguti]

My strat is under development with frequent refinements. Its performance is unknown since the trades are done with a slightly different strat over time.

As I am offering to make you rich in exchange for your proven strat and not the other way, it makes no sense for me to give you my strat. My strat could well turn out to be the holy grail. I can't risk giving that away for not even a promise of your getting me rich.

I'm not sure I agree with this either. Likewise my system could be as close to the grail as you could ever get. You get rich off my back? Not having that BJ.
I'll stick with my already winning system thanks all the same.

 

[Lee Shepherd]

Superior entry provides a positive safety margin, in that you can get the hell out before it turns into a loss. Superior exit provides a negative safety margin, in that you can get the hell out before the loss becomes a bigger loss. I am in search of the positive margin and not the perfect entry at the top or bottom.

Sorry BJ for cutting in here but as Barjon said it would seem you are pulling our yule tide legs.

If not and if I were to take this remotely serious then I would first question this line that you have re-iterated in various ways on various posts.

"you can get the hell out before it turns into a loss"

Every trade begins with a loss.

Anyway, before anyone gives up their hard earned system you should provide a statement.

Happy Christmas

Lee Shepherd

 

[BeginnerJoe]

Every trade begins with a loss.

This is precisely why you need a good entry to get yourself out of that deficit as quickly as possible. While a good exit strat would be nothing but a looser in that situation.

 

[FXhunter]

My strat is under development with frequent refinements. Its performance is unknown since the trades are done with a slightly different strat over time.

As I am offering to make you rich in exchange for your proven strat and not the other way, it makes no sense for me to give you my strat. My strat could well turn out to be the holy grail. I can't risk giving that away for not even a promise of your getting me rich.

Yeah, but if it makes not sense for you to give me your strat, that is under development. So I understand that it doesn't generate profits. Why should I give you my strat, that is proven. Well... at least I made 25 trades on the real account this year.

I asked for a strat that is not making profits.(If I've got it correctly) so it's useless.
I need only the entry method. If I manage to find a filter I give it to you and we have a deal.

I have to say that I "discovered" the entry method that I'm using now, by filtering other method. Otherwise I was getting good periods and bad periods. This way I increased the probability and reduced the number of consecutive loses.

Now I'm testing other methods, It looks like a I have good paper results. But I didn't start to trade it yet. If I started to real trade the new method I would risk to give you the one I'm using now. I'm sorry, but for the moment I can't take this risk

 

[the hare]

Thank heavens we finally descended into some classic lulz. I was getting worried for a while.

 

[15 min tlb]

Now I'm testing other methods, It looks like a I have good paper results. But I didn't start to trade it yet. If I started to real trade the new method I would risk to give you the one I'm using now. I'm sorry, but for the moment I can't take this risk

Isn't he saying , if he had a method which worked , he would say bye bye ? Would he market it and sell it ...write books ...sell courses ...sell education , make eas and sell them to us .......?

Will you give him your phsyche ?You have phsyche issue with running profits and he has a problem following other people's systems.

 

[15 min tlb]

B J

Have you found a box ? It was in the joke thread.There was never any box.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/6856-joke-day-441.html#post2025124

 

[15 min tlb]

Now I'm testing other methods, It looks like a I have good paper results. But I didn't start to trade it yet. If I started to real trade the new method I would risk to give you the one I'm using now. I'm sorry, but for the moment I can't take this risk

Most methods are no better than this method for entries.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/forex/162600-box-breakout-pro-scalping-61.html#post2041258

 

[counter_violent]

Very true, but we have to use something. I feel that if I put a hard stop on the trade, the market will take it out. That does not, always, happen, it is true, but it happens enough for me to want to make sure that it is`not spiking, so I give it a few more points within the time it takes for that bar to complete. If it is not below the SL, by then, I cut the trade. I use closes and line charts a lot, anyway,

Nevertheless, as I said before, I am not, really, satisfied with how I exit and, probably. never shall be.

I thought Barjon had explained this previously....stop using stops and start using a hedge when required. The hedge need only serve to neutralize any offside open position until such time as the fog clears. Once neutralizing has been mastered, then we can move on to biasing on either side of the pair play.

 

[BeginnerJoe]

I thought Barjon had explained this previously....stop using stops and start using a hedge when required. The hedge need only serve to neutralize any offside open position until such time as the fog clears. Once neutralizing has been mastered, then we can move on to biasing on either side of the pair play.

Well stops have been total beeches for me. You have got to have them, and you are dead the moment you do.

So how does this hedging work ? Say I want long eur-usd, what do I use to hedge it ?

 

[andyibet]

Well stops have been total beeches for me. You have got to have them, and you are dead the moment you do.

So how does this hedging work ? Say I want long eur-usd, what do I use to hedge it ?

conifers for you i think.

 

[BeginnerJoe]

conifers for you i think.

For a master trader like you, surely you can do better ? But I suppose, you can never quite tell who is what on the interwebs.

 

[Jason101]

Well stops have been total beeches for me. You have got to have them, and you are dead the moment you do.

So how does this hedging work ? Say I want long eur-usd, what do I use to hedge it ?

Thats a fair question.