Capitalism

[Atilla]

This is all incorrect. I don't know where you get your information.

Socialist Europe is pushing for a financial transaction tax, the UK is adamant this will not happen.
We will see how the UK votes in the referendum. I suspect we will be leaving the EU and good riddance !

Financial tax will happen and it is a great way to claw back tax payers money from the too big to fail banks. In EU and eventually the UK.

UK will vote to stay in the EU as it is foolish to step out of where are interests reside.


No surprises for near negative rates and finally - some tax rises to resolve the mess we find our selves in.

 

[counter_violent]

Financial tax will happen and it is a great way to claw back tax payers money from the too big to fail banks. In EU and eventually the UK.

UK will vote to stay in the EU as it is foolish to step out of where are interests reside.


No surprises for near negative rates and finally - some tax rises to resolve the mess we find our selves in.

You must have been reading a different budget statement than I did yesterday

Osborne reduced corporation tax to attract business to the UK.
He also adjusted personal tax thresholds.
All of this was done because they know we are leaving the EU.
He is hedging his bets. EU is doomed I tell ya

 

[hhiusa]

You must have been reading a different budget statement than I did yesterday

Osborne reduced corporation tax to attract business to the UK.
He also adjusted personal tax thresholds.
All of this was done because they know we are leaving the EU.
He is hedging his bets. EU is doomed I tell ya

17% corporation tax by 2020. :clap:

Are negative corporate tax possible in the UK? I know some UK companies tax invert in the US.
I have paid -16% tax, which is funny because it means you get a tax rebate or net carry forward.
​

Threshold increased for 40% income tax bracket earners.

 

[Atilla]

You must have been reading a different budget statement than I did yesterday

Osborne reduced corporation tax to attract business to the UK.
He also adjusted personal tax thresholds.
All of this was done because they know we are leaving the EU.
He is hedging his bets. EU is doomed I tell ya

Budget was broadly neutral but certainly no give away. They'll say neutral to be friendly but based on poor take up on some of the investment savings (not matching assumptions), outcome will be such that people will not save or invest as they are unable to.

Also, for those people who run their own company will know treatment of dividends as a way of taking profits has become more aggressive as end of year approaches.

I'll certainly be paying more tax.

 

[Pat494]

The budget was a disgraceful attack on the weak and vulnerable. This sort of unfair assault on the disabled just shows what Osbourne and the Tories are made of. It stinks. Scrapping useless waste of money systems like Trident would have been a better option imho

 

[Atilla]

The budget was a disgraceful attack on the weak and vulnerable. This sort of unfair assault on the disabled just shows what Osbourne and the Tories are made of. It stinks. Scrapping useless waste of money systems like Trident would have been a better option imho

I support cutting back on disabled help though as far too generous in this country. Some people who can walk better than my mother who suffers from arthritis get cars on tax payers money.

If you are disabled and you don't have family to look after you then you shouldn't be driving in a personal private car. Use public transport or hoppa dial-a-ride service.

This one guy I know even has a small holding digging up dirt all day long with a bad back and government car. What is he? An MP?

Not saying they are all bent but a lot of waste in the system that needs to be tidied up.

If you are disabled stay at home and join the library or travel at your own expense. Life is hard.


As I like to say, life is a beach learn to swim.

 

[Splitlink]

The budget was a disgraceful attack on the weak and vulnerable. This sort of unfair assault on the disabled just shows what Osbourne and the Tories are made of. It stinks. Scrapping useless waste of money systems like Trident would have been a better option imho

I listened to some of it, yesterday. It does not affect me but it sounds like a party they were having in Parliament. Ours is nowhere near as entertaining.

Osbourne was jumping over himself with happiness at all the generosity he was spreading around, but you pour cold water on everything. In fact, you sound, very much, like Jeremy.

I think that the tax on sugar is overdue. When I was a kid Cokes were sold in small bottles. Now a kid will knock back a whole litre of it and ask his Mum for more.

 

[hhiusa]

I listened to some of it, yesterday. It does not affect me but it sounds like a party they were having in Parliament. Ours is nowhere near as entertaining.

Osbourne was jumping over himself with happiness at all the generosity he was spreading around, but you pour cold water on everything. In fact, you sound, very much, like Jeremy.

I think that the tax on sugar is overdue. When I was a kid Cokes were sold in small bottles. Now a kid will knock back a whole litre of it and ask his Mum for more.

It is interesting that you mention Coke. Coke contains lots of artificial sugar which leads to type II diabetes, which in turn costs the government even more when you have to pay for those peoples ailments.

The NHS went from spending £2,000,000 on type II diabetes to spending £55,000,000 on type II diabetes within a few short years.

I am almost never a proponent for taxes but in this case I think it is worthwhile.

 

[trendie]

It is interesting that you mention Coke. Coke contains lots of artificial sugar which leads to type II diabetes, which in turn costs the government even more when you have to pay for those peoples ailments.

The NHS went from spending £2,000,000 on type II diabetes to spending £55,000,000 on type II diabetes within a few short years.

I am almost never a proponent for taxes but in this case I think it is worthwhile.

If you were any kind of a capitalist, you would want more sugar in Coke, and be investing in diabetic-meds companies.
Instead, you're advocating policies that help people.

You've been spending so much time with us pinko-leftie-socialists, you seem to be developing a conscience.
Be careful!

 

[counter_violent]

The budget was a disgraceful attack on the weak and vulnerable. This sort of unfair assault on the disabled just shows what Osbourne and the Tories are made of. It stinks. Scrapping useless waste of money systems like Trident would have been a better option imho

Pat, here we are once again.

As chancellor of the exchequer Osborne is in the business of allocating funds and running the country's budget in such a manner as to get growth from economic activity whilst keeping a lid of spending. All of this in an effort to balance the books, ie zero borrowing. Even when this aim is achieved, it still only means that we have stopped borrowing on the credit card to fund the lifestyle we think we deserve. The reality though is that we still owe the capital sum, which needs to be paid back.

Now, if you were chancellor, would it not make sense to allocate capital to the fittest, where there is a greater probability of return?

Whether we like it or not, someone has to take responsibility for our country's finances and the country has voted in the Tories to carry out this job.

 

[hhiusa]

If you were any kind of a capitalist, you would want more sugar in Coke, and be investing in diabetic-meds companies.
Instead, you're advocating policies that help people.

You've been spending so much time with us pinko-leftie-socialists, you seem to be developing a conscience.
Be careful!

My conscience is related to the fact that somebody has to fund the NHS to pay for an ever increasing obese population. I am thinking like a capitalist. A sugar tax is like an opt-in tax. If I do not drink coke, then I do not have to pay the tax. The NHS has to be funded somehow. Everyone will end up paying more taxes because the population is growing more obese. Their health concerns become everyone else's financial concerns. Why should I or anybody else have to pay somebody else's lack of impulse control?

 

[Atilla]

Pat, here we are once again.

As chancellor of the exchequer Osborne is in the business of allocating funds and running the country's budget in such a manner as to get growth from economic activity whilst keeping a lid of spending. All of this in an effort to balance the books, ie zero borrowing. Even when this aim is achieved, it still only means that we have stopped borrowing on the credit card to fund the lifestyle we think we deserve. The reality though is that we still owe the capital sum, which needs to be paid back.

Now, if you were chancellor, would it not make sense to allocate capital to the fittest, where there is a greater probability of return?

Whether we like it or not, someone has to take responsibility for our country's finances and the country has voted in the Tories to carry out this job.

Agree absolutely and most people do not know the ratio of money spent on supporting the infirm and very elderly prolonging life for another 5-10 years of pain is disproportionately higher than what is spent supporting young children who are in danger and are victimis of their parents who them selves need support.

 

[Splitlink]

I would not go down that road, Atilla. It's very complicated. It is not a question of prolonging life. It's more of helping those who can hardly get out of bed, let alone get to the toilet and some need to go several times a night. I prefer to keep an open mind on this.

 

[Pat494]

Hi CV
Yes I used to believe in those capitalist ideas once but have seen the light since. It is getting awfully close to Nazism when the weak and vulnerable are picked on by the fit and rich. Only a small step to " putting them out of their misery ", you may say and save XXX pounds. Words like euthanasia crop up. Probably OK with the person's consent but a dark path never-the-less.

 

[Pat494]

The budget was a disgraceful attack on the weak and vulnerable. This sort of unfair assault on the disabled just shows what Osbourne and the Tories are made of. It stinks. Scrapping useless waste of money systems like Trident would have been a better option imho

and set a precedent hopefully before wackos like Kim, Putin, Trump etc. let them fly. They may be tired of living but not everyone shares that view.

 

[Splitlink]

My wife and I are old and we have "controllable" aches and pains. I don't know anyone of our age who does not have something. We, also have two children living near. My wife landed in "urgencias" this week and she had three family members with her which gave her a lot of comfort. Lots do not have that luxury but are, still, able to get out and about. Some are all alone, cold, with no one to talk to and really must have help if we live in a civilised society. I do not begrudge them that basic need.

 

[tomorton]

Best wishes to Mrs. Split.

 

[Splitlink]

Best wishes to Mrs. Split.

Thanks a lot. A nasty fright, but she's fine. Out and about and very pleased with Spanish Social Services. The people are, all, very kind.

 

[tomorton]

Capitalism is built on the idea that we should all work harder for less, borrow more, pay up front to buy things we don't need.

Great system huh !

That's only one side of the coin (to coin a phrase).
Capitalism is equally a system that allows you to sell your labour to the higher bidder even if your current employer (which could be an essential public service) really needs you. Even if you don't strictly need the extra money. It allows you to aspire to a greater level of wealth for you and your family and your descendants (though too often people take a short-termist view of this, leading to disappointment). It allows you to devote your capital, plus the benefits of credit, towards goals which are important to you and you alone, not the state or some commisariat. It allows you to waste money buying goods which therefore brings employment to a host of other people involved in their manufacture, delivery and sale.

Naturally, in a head to head battle with one single employer over rewards, the individual is likely to lose. But you can always say stuff them and re-locate to another city and work for another employer. In fact, you can even set up your own business, and that's where credit will really come in handy. Hard to picture successful business start-ups in a socialist state.

And that's where anti-capitalist sentiments fall down - there has to be something to replace what you don't like, you can't simply destroy it and leave a socio-economic vacuum. And socialism or at least a form of managed economy is what normally steps in. But at least they leave everyone's lives equally impoverished, so I guess that's fair.

 

[counter_violent]

That's only one side of the coin (to coin a phrase).
Capitalism is equally a system that allows you to sell your labour to the higher bidder even if your current employer (which could be an essential public service) really needs you. Even if you don't strictly need the extra money. It allows you to aspire to a greater level of wealth for you and your family and your descendants (though too often people take a short-termist view of this, leading to disappointment). It allows you to devote your capital, plus the benefits of credit, towards goals which are important to you and you alone, not the state or some commisariat. It allows you to waste money buying goods which therefore brings employment to a host of other people involved in their manufacture, delivery and sale.

Naturally, in a head to head battle with one single employer over rewards, the individual is likely to lose. But you can always say stuff them and re-locate to another city and work for another employer. In fact, you can even set up your own business, and that's where credit will really come in handy. Hard to picture successful business start-ups in a socialist state.

And that's where anti-capitalist sentiments fall down - there has to be something to replace what you don't like, you can't simply destroy it and leave a socio-economic vacuum. And socialism or at least a form of managed economy is what normally steps in. But at least they leave everyone's lives equally impoverished, so I guess that's fair.

Classic line

Hi Tom, I've thought long and hard over the years about devising a system that accommodates everyone in society. First though I should outline what I think is wrong with the kind of capitalism we have currently. Essentially, Govt controlled and lead crony corporate capitalism.
Capitalism is probably the least worst system under which to operate. However, it could be much improved.
Here are some of the ways I would go about it along Libertarian style principles.
More to follow.