Brexit - in or out

[forker]

The property market is not over inflated but prices are at levels to match supply and demand.

As demand is up supply increases to fulfill demand.

When price of homes drop so will supply.

Price of homes will never be what people want. :!:


There was no reason for banks to change their lending criteria. So nothing to stop them as they have done tightening regulations so everyone will need to earn 3.5 x salary to get mortgage they want.

That's just market economics.

It's the rich people with loads of cash driving house prices up.

People with cash are buying to fill the rental market with supply.


What's the solution. Fix migration numbers on UK housing stock? That's a cracking solution. Surprised nobody thought of that before

Last year I seen a studio apartment in docklands going for 600k. I can show you right now dozens of 2 bedroom apartments going for well over a million pounds. We aren't talking huge places. A studio is only 1 level up from a house share and a 2 bedroom is well beyond a typical family size. A few weeks back a garage in West London sold for 180k and I recall seeing a parking space sold for over 100k. There was a space between 2 houses about the width of a car sold to build a house, it was sold for 400k. You say it isn't inflated! What rock are you living under?

 

[Atilla]

Last year I seen a studio apartment in docklands going for 600k. I can show you right now dozens of 2 bedroom apartments going for well over a million pounds. We aren't talking huge places. A studio is only 1 level up from a house share and a 2 bedroom is well beyond a typical family size. A few weeks back a garage in West London sold for 180k and I recall seeing a parking space sold for over 100k. There was a space between 2 houses about the width of a car sold to build a house, it was sold for 400k. You say it isn't inflated! What rock are you living under?

I'm living under Brighton Rock thanks m8. Beautiful place in the garden of England it is.

Without going into a long song and dance about your post it's similar to the Wind and the Trees story.

1. Look at Demand
2. Look at Supply
3. Look at Equilibrium Price where both seller and buyer agree.

So I'm at a loss to understand your gripe. Market is what the market is. Pure capitalists may say you should celebrate a piece of England is worth such a high price and that there is sufficient income floating around to be paid for it.

4. However, I know where you are coming from and I would re-iterate as before if you feel prices are inflated than it is more to do with a skewed distribution of income and unfairness in society rather than the pricing mechanism failing. Your attempt to manipulate Demand is not much different to Keynesian economics if you understood the fundamentals of economics (I don't mean like CV either :cheesy

I said before if you wanted a better priced house you should be looking at Wales, Scotland or Island all equally beautiful places to live in.

If you want to control the factors of production by influencing the price of Land as well as Labour whilst allowing capital to flow, then capital will flow leaving the UK to where it is most productive ie dump British assets and sterling and go to EU Switzerland and Norway where the market place is less likely to be manipulated and better regulated in all fairness to all participants which you are in strong disagreement with. Thus, we saw a 4-5% fall in sterling subsequent to Boris having his spasm of thought and beliefs and the 20% drop in sterling you'll see if the UK leaves the EU.

If GDP figures are measured in US $ to standardise then whether population size falls or not you will see both GDP and per-capita GDP fall.

Brexiters branding about many words as facts and heard some of the tosh on Question time last night which no one on the panel picked up on or challenged. Damn statistics and lies.


Beware guys, there is a shed storm approaching ahoy :whistling

 

[vanillaman]

Do you make this rubbish up as you go along...

So please make up some sense. The kind of sense that says we should exit Europe. Well I will stick with my rubbish which is stay in Europe. I am sure the rest of Britain will vote for the same rubbish.

Like I said, migration is a good for Britain, we need better ways to solve the issues in Europe and it does not involve quitting the beast we were part of constructing because Germany took over. That's just cowardice...

 

[forker]

The property market is not over inflated but prices are at levels to match supply and demand.

As demand is up supply increases to fulfill demand.

When price of homes drop so will supply.

Price of homes will never be what people want. :!:


There was no reason for banks to change their lending criteria. So nothing to stop them as they have done tightening regulations so everyone will need to earn 3.5 x salary to get mortgage they want.

That's just market economics.

It's the rich people with loads of cash driving house prices up.

People with cash are buying to fill the rental market with supply.


What's the solution. Fix migration numbers on UK housing stock? That's a cracking solution. Surprised nobody thought of that before

have you for a moment considered the massive immigration being a factor in driving up prices.

 

[Atilla]

have you for a moment considered the massive immigration being a factor in driving up prices.

Have you considered who the builders building / maintaining houses are?

 

[counter_violent]

Have you considered who the builders building / maintaining houses are?

Have you considered that all those who will work for less are driving down the cost of labour and therefore putting the existing population back on the breadline.
Where does it all end? When everyone is working for minimum wage !

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/902294bc-5f5c-11e4-986c-00144feabdc0.html#axzz49qzgkIEb


Labour market economist John Philpott said the minimum wage had become a “de facto going rate” for the low-paid sector.

“The clustering is due to the fact that there has been a big increase in the supply of workers in the low-paid sector that is outstripping demand and that is pushing wages levels down – they would probably go through the floor if it wasn’t for the minimum wage,” he said.

Part of this was due to the increasing polarisation of employment into high or low skill jobs, with some of those previously in the middle moving down rather than up, as well as new immigrants willing to accept lower wages, he added.

 

[Atilla]

Have you considered that all those who will work for less are driving down the cost of labour and therefore putting the existing population back on the breadline.
Where does it all end? When everyone is working for minimum wage !

Let me get this straight!

1. You propose raising the cost of labour to build housing whilst

2. Reducing demand/price of housing by curbing migration

Is this what you are proposing? Have I understood your proposal correctly


Bearing in mind fall in sterling will also hit cost of goods / inputs that go into producing housing too.

 

[forker]

The min wage is attracting immigration as it is higher than the pay available in some EU members. They all come here outstrip our workers in their ability to work for min wage and living in caravans or multiple people per room or back shed. This demand invites property investors as they have ample supply and ample demand. The investors then drive up house prices as they compete alongside people trying to buy a houme. I know many people with multiple houses doing this. You must have sat in the Brighton sun too long as you seem to have a very odd view of how things actually work

 

[counter_violent]

Let me get this straight!

1. You propose raising the cost of labour to build housing whilst

2. Reducing demand/price of housing by curbing migration

Is this what you are proposing? Have I understood your proposal correctly


Bearing in mind fall in sterling will also hit cost of goods / inputs that go into producing housing too.

You are incapable of getting anything straight. This is why it's a futile exercise engaging you.

 

[forker]

Rising house prices to force a million more youngsters to live with parents

The reality facing the next generation - Thank you EU
At least some of us in Brighton aren't affected because who really wants to live by a pebble beach anyway

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...youngsters-to-live-with-parents-a7051746.html

 

[Atilla]

I can imagine all you Brexiters must live in your perfect little minds with short horizons and narrow passageways.

Sadly it is about as far from truth based on facts and reality as the planet pluto is to Earth!

 

[counter_violent]

I can imagine all you Brexiters must live in your perfect little minds with short horizons and narrow passageways.

Sadly it is about as far from truth based on facts and reality as the planet pluto is to Earth!

So let me get this straight.

You have no answers to the perfectly valid points raised, which incidentally, are backed up by evidence.

Is that what you are saying?

 

[Atilla]

So let me get this straight.

You have no answers to the perfectly valid points raised, which incidentally, are backed up by evidence.

Is that what you are saying?

I think I made my point.

Simply trying to clarify your perfectly valid points to make sure I understood them correctly.


Thanks

 

[Signalcalc]

Doesn't buying mania, whether it be £1million for a run down council house in docklands, £100,000 for a parking space or £150,000 for a shed on Brighton beach usually signify a bubble with a correction to follow?

It will be laughable if we stay in Europe and the economies of the world collapse because of global pressures, the referendum will have played no part in the process as it was always going to happen with record levels of sovereign debt, credit defaults, low commodity prices and strengthening dollar.

But then the remainians will get the blame they will so rightly deserve anyway, the 2020 general election will be interesting indeed, as will the fall of the EU empire.

The EU will disintegrate regardless if we stay in or not, migration will become the biggest issue alongside the economic disaster. People will rise against the establishment leading to civil war that no EU army will be able to control, the EU will be fighting the threat from the Middle East and North Africa as well as home grown unrest.

President Trump will have created all sorts of unforeseen problems that we are not yet aware of and won't be sending US troops to help bail out the unrest in the EU and then the Chinese, NKoreans, Russians and IS will be wanting to stir it up as well, just as oil reaches $350/barrel.

Lots to look forward to - I'll revisit this thread in 15 years and see where we are and maybe make some adjustments to my predictions, the EU referendum will pale into insignificance.

 

[vanillaman]

Doesn't buying mania, whether it be £1million for a run down council house in docklands, £100,000 for a parking space or £150,000 for a shed on Brighton beach usually signify a bubble with a correction to follow?

It will be laughable if we stay in Europe and the economies of the world collapse because of global pressures, the referendum will have played no part in the process as it was always going to happen with record levels of sovereign debt, credit defaults, low commodity prices and strengthening dollar.

But then the remainians will get the blame they will so rightly deserve anyway, the 2020 general election will be interesting indeed, as will the fall of the EU empire.

The EU will disintegrate regardless if we stay in or not, migration will become the biggest issue alongside the economic disaster. People will rise against the establishment leading to civil war that no EU army will be able to control, the EU will be fighting the threat from the Middle East and North Africa as well as home grown unrest.

President Trump will have created all sorts of unforeseen problems that we are not yet aware of and won't be sending US troops to help bail out the unrest in the EU and then the Chinese, NKoreans, Russians and IS will be wanting to stir it up as well, just as oil reaches $350/barrel.

Lots to look forward to - I'll revisit this thread in 15 years and see where we are and maybe make some adjustments to my predictions, the EU referendum will pale into insignificance.

Welcome signal! Sounds like World of war craft.

 

[ffsear]

That reminds me, i must pre-order Civilisation 6!

http://www.alphr.com/games/1003540/civilization-6-news-and-release-date-8-things-you-need-to-know

 

[Signalcalc]

That reminds me, i must pre-order Civilisation 6!

http://www.alphr.com/games/1003540/civilization-6-news-and-release-date-8-things-you-need-to-know

It's the future :medieval:

 

[Signalcalc]

We would actually be in a very strong negotiating position with the EU if we get a Brexit win. This is actually all about Russia. Its difficult to pinpoint the reason why Cameron et al want us to stay in, maybe he thinks that we need to support European forces in keeping Russia out of Poland. But I think we would have a stronger hand in future negotiations on trade etc if we are out because the EU will still need our military support in NATO and we can barter for better deals on trade agreements as well as increase our defence industry sales. We have always been a good exporter of military knowledge and expertise and we are world leaders in the security game (with the help of the US of course).

Just look at what Russia is doing with Greece at the moment, a new axis of power is developing right in the heart of the EU. Russia is up to its old tricks and preying on the weak in order to gain leverage to eventually topple the EU organisation. Clever Russian chess players.

By overtly distancing ourselves from these brewing troubles, I think we stand a better chance of making objective decisions, otherwise we will be at the mercy of central planners that will try and maneouvre for the greater good and will ignore individual states when it comes to matters of defence. A fractured organisation is not something we should be part of or indeed should we be trying to fix it. A different approach and strategies might be needed when playing with the Russians.

 

[forker]

Brexit warnings wrong on trade

http://news.sky.com/story/1702853/brexit-warnings-wrong-on-trade-think-tank

 

[Atilla]

To lubricate the grey cells, here are some challenges facing the UK:


1. How do we pay off the national debt. Currently at 90% of GDP (GDP @ 2.7 Tr as of 2013)?


2. How do we meet UK pension liability? (WWII baby boomers reaching retirement)

3. How do we support aging population? http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/if/3493352.stm

4. How do we get birth rates up from 1.35 (pure British) 1.85 (UK Wide) levels?

5. How do we rectify the century long BoP current account deficit?

FYI - a pretty good report on the relative health of the current UK economy from PWC. http://www.pwc.co.uk/assets/pdf/ukeo/ukeo-summary-report-march-2016.pdf




Coming to the EU some questions and how UK should respond to two scenarios.


1. EU unable to pay off collective GDP-debt and support PIGS. EU facing brake up wrt PIGS. Germany, Holland and France and Benulux countries unite. PIGS and others break away.

A) Is it better for the UK to be outside
B) Is it better for the UK to be inside
C) No impact or difference on UK position


2. EU comes together, applies harmonised fiscal rules (passes Finance Transaction Tax) and supported by CBE makes progress on paying off collective GDP-debt. GDP grows and debt as % falls and thus maintains global position.

A) Is it better for the UK to be outside
B) Is it better for the UK to be inside
C) No impact or difference on UK position

Does the EU referendum really matter?