0007
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Far from it – there are some very smart cookies in the Remain camp!
Signalcalc
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The sarcasm is understood, not sure where the implication comes from?
If remainers want to discuss and argue various points then why not do it with some substance, if all we hear is rhetoric (and sarcasm), then what is there to discuss?
Signalcalc
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Signalcalc
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Dinosaur politicians trying to save their beloved [European] Union, it's those pesky Ruskies again, round em up, put em in a field and bomb the b*stards 😂
www.theguardian.com
Brexit party's funding must be investigated, says Gordon Brown
Former PM is concerned ‘dirty money’ from foreign donors could reach Nigel Farage’s party
Signalcalc
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And for the sake of balance (there's far too much Brexit Partying going on here 🙃)
Signalcalc
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Saw some headlines about how we can have a Managed Brexit. How marvellous
Someone somewhere finally understands Brexit means Brexit and they are now in a position to Manage Brexit.
Where are the campaign videos for remain, are remainers too embarrassed to post them? Do they concentrate on the benefits of staying in the EU, do they talk about Democracy? Or are they just full of rhetoric about not voting for vile right wing fascists and extremists that want to leave who are too old, thick and racist have been lied to and unduly influenced by social media and the Russians (all of which is embarrassing to state about ordinary people)?
Democracy (Greek: δημοκρατία dēmokratía, literally "rule by people")
barjon
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You mean you haven’t been reading your own posts
It’s a bit rich to talk about remainers discussing things with some substance when the whole leaver case is based on nothing more than wishful thinking, albeit that the thinking is well thought out and may possibly come to pass.
Further flights of fancy about “regime change” ignoring that when the Brexit dust settles it will be the same old left/right, socialism/capitalism battleground.
Oh, and of course the supporters of Farage and his crew lead the polls - no-one else thinks the European elections have the slightest importance. In case it has escaped your notice we are still committed to leaving - the argument is about how we do it. That doesn’t mean remainers have to shut up about expressing their view about the folly of the whole thing, but it does mean they have to accept the commitment.
Atilla
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Beg to differ here Barjon,
The referendum was not legally binding. It was only advisory. Fact that politicians promoted it as such saying they'll do this and the other is just daft politics.
Cameron resigned from top job to pay for his misdeed.
Eurosceptic infested Tories currently with their old strong and stable leader ideally should have obtained a bigger majority if the will of the people were behind Tories move to Brexit. Remember she was the only one who could deliver it. Labour only promoted local issues and remained on the whole quiet about Brexit.
TM invoking article 50 was in haste but Parliament decides that and can just as easily revoke it if the MP voting numbers think it wise to do so.
Democracy is fluid and remember we have had one elections post referendum and about to have another very soon. Brexit party garnering 35% of the vote is hardly a mandate for hard brexit.
British people don't have to accept anything just yet. It's all to play for and up in the air imo. There is no deadline or time pressure to rush into this diabolical display of poor governance and leadership.
Hence, whether we have some kind of new deal or remain as we are is still up for play with 65% of the people (using MEP elections as some kind of proxy vote).
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Signalcalc
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You mean you haven’t been reading your own posts
Select anything I've posted and let's see if it stands up to scrutiny.
You've missed mine and others point, if you are going to argue against or for something, do it with some backup, calling people thick, racist, nazis, whatever does nothing but alienate you from your non-argument and strengthens the opposition (unless its true of course).
Nobody is ignoring anything, of course politics in the UK could revert to normal, to ignore the other potential options is foolish given the current state of politics and the awoken electorate.
No-one but the majority voting for Farage that is
It depends on the definition of leaving, committing to leaving whilst staying under the control of the EU is remaining.
The facts remain, parliament has had 3 years to instigate our leaving the EU, they haven't managed it, time for regime change so that a majority can enact us leaving without a deal, as agreeing to a deal that the EU will accept will clearly not work.
Signalcalc
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Beg to differ here Barjon,
The referendum was not legally binding. It was only advisory. Fact that politicians promoted it as such saying they'll do this and the other is just daft politics.
Cameron resigned from top job to pay for his misdeed.
Eurosceptic infested Tories currently with their old strong and stable leader ideally should have obtained a bigger majority if the will of the people were behind Tories move to Brexit. Remember she was the only one who could deliver it. Labour only promoted local issues and remained on the whole quiet about Brexit.
TM invoking article 50 was in haste but Parliament decides that and can just as easily revoke it if the MP voting numbers think it wise to do so.
Democracy is fluid and remember we have had one elections post referendum and about to have another very soon. Brexit party garnering 35% of the vote is hardly a mandate for hard brexit.
British people don't have to accept anything just yet. It's all to play for and up in the air imo. There is no deadline or time pressure to rush into this diabolical display of poor governance and leadership.
Hence, whether we have some kind of new deal or remain as we are is still up for play with 65% of the people (using MEP elections as some kind of proxy vote).
Still blaming the Tories for Brexit I see, when it is the people that voted to leave, not the Tories, they just gave the people the opportunity to express their wish through a referendum (I'm sure that is part of our democracy), something that should have happened in 1992/3 when we were taken into the political union without debate and when the UKIP opposition got organised these are fundamental issues that led to 2016.
At the time of the 2016 referendum the political Europhiles were so confident that they would win, they promised to uphold the referendum result by passing laws, which they duly did in the form of Art50, that was the last implementation of democracy they managed, since then parliamentary infighting has got us to our current impasse.
The deadline will arrive soon enough, a general election will force people to think hard about what they really want, do they want the status quo, or do they want a proper break from the EU, this weeks elections will provide an indication as to where we are headed in that general election.
The political parties will have the difficult job of selecting remain or leave candidates to be their potential MPs, that is going to be difficult given that support for a WTO Brexit party is currently the most popular.
Signalcalc
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Time for some words from Salvini on the EU. The people of Italy voted for Salvini's Eurosceptic League party to rule Italy in coalition and form a populist government, now according to remainers they would be thick because they didn't know what they were voting for, but as it turns out Italy has the highest IQ rating of all the European countries, so it must have been those Italian voters in the lowest IQ quotient that voted for Salvini eh?
brainstats.com
World ranking of countries by their average IQ
The average IQ of more than 80 countries updated in real time.
brainstats.com
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Atilla
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Why did Cameron resign then if he is not to blame?
Why have the Tories not carried out the will of the people if they are not to blame?
Referendum coincided with a refugee crisis as a consequence of the imperial powers playing silly buggers. It is essentially a continuation/consequence of the US Axis of Evil neo-con strategy to grab remaining oil fields as oil is dwindling in supply. They don't like our freedoms and democratic way of life so but will risk lives and money crossing dangerous waters to get here for a better future.
35% of the vote is not the most popular, simply that the opposition (will of the people) is fractured right now.
Brexiteers have just been p1ssing on EU without a road map. Once again, it is up to the Brexiteers to make their case for Brexit not for remainers to argue why we should stay in! That is obvious. Remainers argument should be counteract, why we should not leave. Farage say UK will do better leading Commonwealth and abolish House of Lords. We'll fall out and default to WTO. He doesn't have any other ideas. He'll crash out of EU and all accompanying trading agreements with 60+ countries and set about starting new negotiations for new FTAs having left the biggest one in the World. PS. Will still have to adhere to EU rules and standards if wanting to export to EU. Some freaking master plan that is.
As for promises, would you lend to a beggar who promises to pay back a loan from you with 100% interest given he has no collateral to back up his promise? I doubt it. Polticians can make all the freaking promises they like on their manifestos, it's the ability to deliver and get it through Parliament that counts. Saying but you promised will get you nought.
Wake up and smell the coffeeeee instead. Control and power rests with parliament. This isn't a banana republic run by one man bands.
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Signalcalc
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Cameron resigned because he fucked up in his gang of political elites. The Tories and elites were so conceited about winning the remain the result that the thought of losing never entered their tiny minds, then they voted another establishment remainer to be their leader and produced a BRINO strategy which has completely backfired on both Tory and Labour, they have both lost big time in local elections making Libdems look good and are about to lose in the EU elections, there's only one way the General Election can go unless the Tories manage to command a majority vote to ACTUALLY LEAVE 😂
Merkel also fucked up, whilst there was a refugee crisis already in operation, the EU saw an opportunity to implement part of their migrant plan that involved millions of migrants who are not refugees flowing uncontrolled into the EU, following a massive backlash and once they managed to get that under control after a couple of years they then went and invented and implemented the Marrakesh agreement, without consultation, to continue the flow of migrants, who are not refugees, into the EU. All this has backfired in the UK and across the EU with lots of populist MEPs expected to march into the EU parliament
So that makes it OK then? For the tiny percentage of actual refugees, they might not like our benefits, culture, religion or way of life, they sure like our freedoms and democracy though, something that our own government seems intent on taking away from us. For those economic migrants and chancers that do like our benefits, well, what more do I need to say really, it's all understood.
The will of the people is like wishing on a star, anything could be the will of the people if you say it is. The Brexit Party is stronger than the remainers, you say 65% wish to remain, yet they can't organise a monkey's tea party as demonstrated by parliament. Brexiteers have had 25+ years to get organised, remain is in tatters, Tories and Labour are in tatters, that's called democracy.
Ah, so you think that not having an argument is an excuse for not arguing, seems logical, but then you'll revert to slander instead!
You've just contradicted your own previous statement about why remainers should not argue! What's it to be, sensible debate or slander, only remainers to decide eh?
You are 100% correct. Farage needs nothing more than what the majority want - Brexit on WTO - people love it
Of course the EU could choose to negotiate trade deals in our favour, but they are not going to are they, or will they if we are actually threatening WTO?
As for promises, would you lend to a beggar who promises to pay back a loan from you with 100% interest given he has no collateral to back up his promise? I doubt it. Polticians can make all the freaking promises they like on their manifestos, it's the ability to deliver and get it through Parliament that counts. Saying but you promised will get you nought.
Wake up and smell the coffeeeee instead. Control and power rests with parliament. This isn't a banana republic run by one man bands.
The Brexit Party doesn't need a manifesto and hasn't got one, it is campaigning on a single issue, nothing more, stick to the subject of the thread and you'll be OK
Oh and vote for the
party
Atilla
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That's not an answer. He never thought referendum would take place - as he wasn't expecting a majority thinking libdems would oppose referendum - just as TM wasn't expecting to lose majority. I wish you stop deviating to your alternative reality to align your inconsistent and inaccurate perspective. There are facts and then there is repeating total rubbish. Each to their own on how they like to interpret all the shenanigans.
Yes but what you say confirms referendum coincided with fiasco and wrong judgement calls in EU. Attacking Syria was to place a US friendly regime to enable opening gas and oil pipelines to Mediterranean to supply EU's energy requirements to further sideline Russia and deal a blow on her foreign earnings selling gas and oil.
Referendum still coincided with refugee crises which has no bearing on UK entry. I agree with you most coming to UK economic migrants and I wouldn't let them in. I'd also like to see UK stop interfering with other nations democracy.
I didn't say they, 65%, wish to remain. I said they were fractured on what they want; leave with a deal or remain. It should be CLEAR TO THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE that they don't have a freaking majority and you lot should GET OFF YOUR BOXES.
If anyone knew what Brexiteers plans are they could. WTO head already disagrees with Farage's interpretation of WTO but who's listening. Pot calling the kettle black.
You are 100% correct. Farage needs nothing more than what the majority want - Brexit on WTO - people love it
Of course the EU could choose to negotiate trade deals in our favour, but they are not going to are they, or will they if we are actually threatening WTO?
Majority with 35%. haha good one.
The Brexit Party doesn't need a manifesto and hasn't got one, it is campaigning on a single issue, nothing more, stick to the subject of the thread and you'll be OK
The manifesto is:
1. Crash out of EU and default to WTO with no deal (only vote in Parliament that got through was not leaving without a deal)
2. Get rid of the House of Lords (replace with what?)
3. Increase trade with the Commonwealth (hardly compensates for loss of disposable income power EU block has)
4. Make FTAs with rest of the World. (whilst losing EU FTA + 60+ other countries we already have deals with)
5. Nobody said this would be easy.
Anything else?
Honestly guys, I'm listening to anything worthy coming out of Nigels mouth and there is no substance for anyone who understands or knows what this guy is talkign about. He is a danger to the UK future going forward. Mark my words. When it comes to the hard stuff this guy will walk away. He is a deserter. He likes to criticise but says very little positives.
He talked Norway and Swiss models to the skies and now his denouncing his past rhetoric.
Brexiteers need to pick leaders carefully.
Enjoy...
Signalcalc
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That's not an answer. He never thought referendum would take place - as he wasn't expecting a majority thinking libdems would oppose referendum - just as TM wasn't expecting to lose majority. I wish you stop deviating to your alternative reality to align your inconsistent and inaccurate perspective. There are facts and then there is repeating total rubbish. Each to their own on how they like to interpret all the shenanigans.
Yes but what you say confirms referendum coincided with fiasco and wrong judgement calls in EU. Attacking Syria was to place a US friendly regime to enable opening gas and oil pipelines to Mediterranean to supply EU's energy requirements to further sideline Russia and deal a blow on her foreign earnings selling gas and oil.
Referendum still coincided with refugee crises which has no bearing on UK entry. I agree with you most coming to UK economic migrants and I wouldn't let them in. I'd also like to see UK stop interfering with other nations democracy.
I didn't say they, 65%, wish to remain. I said they were fractured on what they want; leave with a deal or remain. It should be CLEAR TO THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE that they don't have a freaking majority and you lot should GET OFF YOUR BOXES.
If anyone knew what Brexiteers plans are they could. WTO head already disagrees with Farage's interpretation of WTO but who's listening. Pot calling the kettle black.
Majority with 35%. haha good one.
The manifesto is:
1. Crash out of EU and default to WTO with no deal (only vote in Parliament that got through was not leaving without a deal)
2. Get rid of the House of Lords (replace with what?)
3. Increase trade with the Commonwealth (hardly compensates for loss of disposable income power EU block has)
4. Make FTAs with rest of the World. (whilst losing EU FTA + 60+ other countries we already have deals with)
5. Nobody said this would be easy.
Anything else?
Honestly guys, I'm listening to anything worthy coming out of Nigels mouth and there is no substance for anyone who understands or knows what this guy is talkign about. He is a danger to the UK future going forward. Mark my words. When it comes to the hard stuff this guy will walk away. He is a deserter. He likes to criticise but says very little positives.
He talked Norway and Swiss models to the skies and now his denouncing his past rhetoric.
Brexiteers need to pick leaders carefully.
Enjoy...
I guess you won’t be voting Brexit party then [emoji1360]
counter_violent
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I hope the Brexit Party does shake the establishment to it's core. Long overdue btw.
Ill set us off with Two policies. Abolition of the HOL and the BBC.
Now who wouldn't vote for those !
counter_violent
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Thick Northern Racist Brexiteers.
counter_violent
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