Brexit and the Consequences

[Atilla]

Indians not interested?

A bilateral trade agreement between the UK and India would be a deal “made in heaven” and would pave the way for increased trade in the wake of Britain leaving the EU, the head of India’s business group has said.

https://webcache.googleusercontent....6-b22f-79eb4891c97d+&cd=5&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

Absolutely agree and I'm all for it. Yes lots of enthusiasm. They give cheap labour, we supply techknowhow. For that to happen we would like access to their financial services too.

I do hope it comes true. I really do. 👍


They have tried the same with the EU but no go!

Why have we not achieved such a trade deal already who knows? Let's just blame the EU for stopping us and hope they were wrong!

 

[Atilla]

Atilla's dream plan

You got me wrong forker. I've always liked the Australian immigration control system. Have said so before.

I would sink their boats crossing and justify the death of 20 if it saves 1000s of other sinking boats and migrant drownings.

Don't see them as refugees fleeing war, as we don't have war on our borders. They are economic migrants and should be sent back and go through usual controlled process.

The open borders is with like for like countries or the EU which has worked well for us imo.

 

[forker]

Absolutely agree and I'm all for it. Yes lots of enthusiasm. They give cheap labour, we supply techknowhow. For that to happen we would like access to their financial services too.

I do hope it comes true. I really do. 👍


They have tried the same with the EU but no go!

Why have we not achieved such a trade deal already who knows? Let's just blame the EU for stopping us and hope they were wrong!

Well you only need to look at the EU Canada deal to see why any deal with the EU is extremely complex as you need all EU members to agree

 

[Mr. Charts]

The more highly qualified Indian people who come here the better. I don't like generalising about people on the basis of origin, nationality, religion, ethnicity and all that crap, but generally speaking Indian people have enriched this country and May should be open armed and welcoming.

 

[Pat494]

The more highly qualified Indian people who come here the better. I don't like generalising about people on the basis of origin, nationality, religion, ethnicity and all that crap, but generally speaking Indian people have enriched this country and May should be open armed and welcoming.

Restricting it to qualified people is discrimination.
I expect you would let in say 100 million ?
Maybe 200 million ? Even that many is barely a noticeable loss to India. Wish we had the room but must be practical.
It is this wooly headed thinking of do-gooders that causes these problems.

 

[forker]

Restricting it to qualified people is discrimination.
I expect you would let in say 100 million ?
Maybe 200 million ? Even that many is barely a noticeable loss to India. Wish we had the room but must be practical.
It is this wooly headed thinking of do-gooders that causes these problems.

I had a conversation with a remoaner today and his thinking was the same. Let them in. Where exactly are these people going to live and what effect will it have on wages. I can't get my head around this thinking.

 

[Splitlink]

The more highly qualified Indian people who come here the better. I don't like generalising about people on the basis of origin, nationality, religion, ethnicity and all that crap, but generally speaking Indian people have enriched this country and May should be open armed and welcoming.

We had a GP called Gunasakara. He came from Ceylon. When the raids were on. in 1943, he used to sit in his Austin 10, waiting for the bombs to drop. When he located the direction he was off to the district where they had fallen. One of the guys who didn't get the medal he deserved.

 

[Atilla]

This is a very sobering must read article. Brings reality home.

Britain's Empire Strikes Back

Really going off Theresa May. Fact that she hasn't supported the judges speaks volumes that she is just another politician and not a true leader representing the UK. Does not bode well for the future of the land or our Parliamentary process imo. 👎

 

[forker]

Sorry but since when does free trade need to be accompanied by migration policy? Is it not enough that their economy will be able to sell to our economy without restrictions? The issue of global integration is a mess and causes more problems than it does good. Lowers wages, splits communities, increases hate, raises costs of living, increased pollution, increased stress on public services... I can't get my head around this mentality of "if you want to trade with us you must also allow our people into your country"

 

[Splitlink]

Sorry but since when does free trade need to be accompanied by migration policy? Is it not enough that their economy will be able to sell to our economy without restrictions? The issue of global integration is a mess and causes more problems than it does good. Lowers wages, splits communities, increases hate, raises costs of living, increased pollution, increased stress on public services... I can't get my head around this mentality of "if you want to trade with us you must also allow our people into your country"

I think that free trade is a misnomer. You'll get free trade in return for something else. That is what is called an agreement. The "something else" could be anything, including a migration policy. Migration is not going to go away, note the India talks

 

[forker]

Migration should be a separate issue to trade. Other countries, especially large ones by population, shouldn't be demanding such things especially when we are already overpopulated and public services breaking. The last thing I want for the uk is hoards of Indians flooding in

 

[Splitlink]

What you want and what you get are two different topics. Other countries will use trade as a bartering tool for anything else. Now, you may be lucky and have something the other side wants. That will give you something to trade with.

 

[forker]

We do, it's 75 million people to trade freely with.

 

[Atilla]

To put it simply factors of production are:

1. Labour
2. Capital (technology & money)
3. Land

Perfect example US expansion into the new world:

1. Labour (Chinese)
2. Capital and knowhow (British finance and railways)
3. Land (The US of A)

So what what do we sell India and what can they offer us?

Given the distance involved just out of human geography, China and India being virtual neighbours along with the rest of the Asian tigers other than finance and services what can we sell them? We don't produce anything!

They are near ME energy resources, Russia, China and Asian tigers. Largest democracy pursuing peaceful policies, non-expansionary. Investing and trying to grow its own finance industry in Mumbai trying to become another hub along with everyone else.

Suggesting cutting aid to them - I agree with. They really don't need it. They'll be giving us aid soon.



The bigger question however, is they want us to remain in Europe leveraging their interests. However, Europe are right not to because they are very hard negotiators and offer little. Look at Vodafones experience in India!!!

The mist should now be lifting as to the benefits that Europe provides the UK. This idea that we can trade with the rest of the World and replace Europe is cheap talk. Same goes for Australia and China.


Here is one big vision which is where our government should be taking us.

Driver less cars and Uber and robotics is the next big thing. UK should be investing heavilly in these growth industries and offer to jump or leap over the usual road rail infrastructure by linking cities with new infrastructure that are future friendly.

I would add solar, wind and green energies to this list. Then we can go to these countries and sell them our technology and expertise.

Trying to sell on our financial services (will diminish outside of EU) and what a great place UK is to do biz outside of EU is just old hat and everybody but the Brexiters know it. :idea:

 

[Atilla]

Chinese and German industry already linking up in development of robotics to compete with the Japanese.

UK should allow all Indian engineers who study and obtain their degree in the UK the right to remain and work here indefinitely.

Theresa May and rest of Brexiters are absolutely barmy to say no!

Instead anyone with half an interest can't do any engineering course because it is simply prohibitively expensive.

I would make university degree course free in the field of computer programming and engineering. Let the soft arts and classical studies pay for themselves as we have enough. Same goes for finance.


We are so on the wrong track no one has vision other than to withdraw back into our greatness of the past. Which is like a wounded animal going back into their hole.

HS2 may well be a mistake too. There are now studies showing that driver-less cars may replace trains as being computer controlled, they can travel much faster in safety avoiding traffic and congestion.

I do support investment in rail infrastructure and nationalising it. Leaving a natural monopoly to the so called free market has been a failure imo.

 

[counter_violent]

Sorry but since when does free trade need to be accompanied by migration policy? Is it not enough that their economy will be able to sell to our economy without restrictions? The issue of global integration is a mess and causes more problems than it does good. Lowers wages, splits communities, increases hate, raises costs of living, increased pollution, increased stress on public services... I can't get my head around this mentality of "if you want to trade with us you must also allow our people into your country"

It's all part and parcel of the EU's socialist agenda, whereby redistribution of wealth occurs from the haves, (middle classes) down to the (have not's) working classes. You might note that it does not include a redistribution from the upper class, landed gentry, capitalist and political elites. At that level, it is unenforceable, because they have sufficient wherewithal, funds, and political clout to ensure that they don't become part of the "we're all in it together" group. Holland tried to over tax the wealthy in France. So they all left 😆

Not only do the EU do this redistribution by country, they also redistribute from richer countries to poorer Ones within the group.

Now if all of this wasn't enough, we then have the free movement issue to contend with, whereby any Tom, Dick or Harry who cannot get a job in a poorer country, can simply up sticks and move to a richer country, where his standard of living goes exponential, compared to staying within his own country. The problem with this is that over time, the standard of living for the majority of citizens of the richer countries goes down.
It also has a severe knock on effect in the countries that suffer the exodus. So much so that they don't have a hope of establishing themselves as equal competitors within the group. All the brains, talent and youth have left.

The EU is a problem and the socialism behind it is an even bigger problem.

That's why we left !

 

[Mr. Charts]

The last two posts from Atilla and c_v are both spot on. Well said !

 

[Atilla]

The last two posts from Atilla and c_v are both spot on. Well said !

LOL do you really mean that Mr C or you stirring :cheesy:

 

[Mr. Charts]

Stirring? Why stir a boiling pot?

 

[Mr. Charts]

I agree about HS2.
We should have invested in a new airport in the Thames Estuary. Damn the local birds (they can go to the same place as the pigeons from Trafalgar Square when Red Ken expelled them) and earthworms and newts (speaking of Red Ken).