A Moderator's View

[vegas]

FWIW, I am finding myself spending more time on Tradestation Forums now than ever before.

Always had access to the Tradestation Forums, but never really spent time before on it, however, recently over the last couple of months (really since the beginning of the year), I have grown ever more tired of the constant meaningless thread postings on T2W - which really consumes time. Endless hours of shifting through postings which is about Ego boosting is meaningless to me.

So, for myself anyway, I have looked to fill the void elsewhere - hence spending more time on the Tradestation Forums.

It does sadden me because I have learnt so much on T2W and have made contact with so many good people.

I cannot see myself not accessing T2W, however, it seems to me to be getting overfilled with system sellers and meanderers.

I do hope this recent route can be reversed.

 

[dc2000]

may i ask what the moderators views are on this subject?

 

[ducati998]

barjon

Good morning chap's, still a little early in NZ.
My primary areas of concern are really these;

*The lack of factual, corroborated material, when advocating trading strategies.
*Advocation of extremely high risk trades, without any acknowledgement that no risk management has been assumed [flying by-the-seat-of-pants]
*Complete disregard for the technical details of placing a position [margin requirements etc]

Somehow, through sheer volume of posting, the vast majority of it purely opinion based, the essence of trading, viz. the assumption of risk, the management of risk, and the basis of doing so, [analysis of technicals, fundamentals, quantitative] has been totally lost.

We are left with, a horrible mish-mash of subjective/objective viewpoints, that veers between on-topic posts, off-topic posts, and personality driven posting.

The psychology section, is not the place for ranting, the correct place is an asylum.
Psychology within the markets [can] have a large quantifiable input.
This input can be explained via any number of theories and studies

Ramping.
Blatent, unethical, borderline legality [depends on who you are, who you work for]
Ramping of stocks, currency, etc. can be a difficult decision for Mods.
Ramping of sites for $400 subscriptions etc is a pretty straightforward call.

Too many sub-forums.
While choice is good, too much choice can be detrimental.
The ability to moderate the sheer volume of traffic has exceeded the capabilities of existing #of mods. Thus, the decline of the overall product.

If, the object is simply to generate pure, indiscriminate traffic, ignoring quality, then I guess you have succeeded.

Quality posting [posters] are drawn by quality posts in topics [areas] that interest them.
They will not contribute constructively when, threads are unduly interrupted by cretins.
Cretins are easily identified, as they offer nothing but unsubstantiated opinion, devoid of any logical reasoning, argument, development, reference, examples, literature, experience, qualification etc.


jog on
d998

 

[barjon]

Thanks everyone - I'm just back from golf and you've given me a lot to chew on.

My own views line up with blackcab's in that there seemed to be many more constructive threads (with adult discussion) in the early days than now. That may be to do with the growing experience of members, as Jack o'Clubs points out, or because the site has become sufficiently popular to attract more of those with an underlying commercial agenda.

Whatever the reason, it is up to members to start such constructive threads and we are in their hands. What really concerns me is the thought that members may be put off starting such threads because they fear that they themselves will be unfairly criticised and/or that the thread would lose its focus because of too much off-topic and personal mud slinging. If that's so it is clearly an important moderating issue.

I think the problem dc2000 mentions (and I do appreciate your thanks dc ) of things slipping recently has been brought about by a lack of moderators at the moment. Hopefully that will be addressed soon (any volunteers?). This has meant that things haven't been nipped in the bud as well as they might have been and also that too much reliance has been put on members reporting bad posts. Thank you, by the way, to all those who take the trouble to report such posts - it really is a great help.

Anyway that's enough for the mo.

Cheers

jon

ps: I do like JTrader's signature quote - "Great minds discuss ideas, mediocre minds discuss events, small minds discuss people." mmm.

 

[ducati998]

barjon

In reference to people not starting threads, first, to start a serious thread implies that the person is willing to invest some time and effort into the topic, and in return hopes to garner some insights, generated by peer discussion. [excludes the "how to threads"]

When the thread is disrupted by endless personal abuse etc. this time & effort will not be invested.......this seems to be the outcome that we are now seeing on the site "generally"

As regards moderation;
The mods require knowledge on the threads that they moderate.
Specifically on the Options threads, there are participants with high levels of *technical knowledge* and in numerous cases industry experience.

The moderators need to be able, based on posted material, to distinguish the legitimate posters with something to offer, from the rampers, cretins, and plain insane. [this is true of any specialized area P&V etc]

That is not to say dissention is not welcome, far from it, but structured, reasoned, logical, factual, referenced, qualitative, quantitative, with polite dissention and debate.

The balance, currently has been lost.
Restructuring is required, and in most restructuring, assets are maximised, liabilities trimmed.

jog on
d998

 

[timsk]

Whatever the reason, it is up to members to start such constructive threads and we are in their hands. What really concerns me is the thought that members may be put off starting such threads because they fear that they themselves will be unfairly criticised and/or that the thread would lose its focus because of too much off-topic and personal mud slinging. If that's so it is clearly an important moderating issue.

Hi Jon,
Nail on head; very worrying indeed.

My 2p worth is that having been around T2W for quite a while now, I am very aware that the general tone of the site has gone downhill. It is Increasingly hard to find threads where real debate exists between members who exhibit mutual respect for one another's views, even though said views may be very polarised and articulated with great passion. If you cut out the bun fighting threads and the newbie threads asking 'where do I start', there's precious little wheat left to munch on. I wish I could say that this is because I'm an expert now and I know it all. Sadly, this isn't the case. Nor is it the case that T2W has always been this way. 18 months or so ago, I could log on each day and struggle to read all the threads of interest to me in an hour. Jokes about me being a slow reader aside; I'm afraid T2W ain't what it used to be.

Lastly, I'd just like to add my thanks to you and the other mod's who perform a very difficult and thankless task. I think I have contradicted myself there, but never mind!
Tim.

 

[SOCRATES]

Hi Jon,
Nail on head; very worrying indeed.

My 2p worth is that having been around T2W for quite a while now, I am very aware that the general tone of the site has gone downhill. It is Increasingly hard to find threads where real debate exists between members who exhibit mutual respect for one another's views, even though said views may be very polarised and articulated with great passion. If you cut out the bun fighting threads and the newbie threads asking 'where do I start', there's precious little wheat left to munch on. I wish I could say that this is because I'm an expert now and I know it all. Sadly, this isn't the case. Nor is it the case that T2W has always been this way. 18 months or so ago, I could log on each day and struggle to read all the threads of interest to me in an hour. Jokes about me being a slow reader aside; I'm afraid T2W ain't what it used to be.

Lastly, I'd just like to add my thanks to you and the other mod's who perform a very difficult and thankless task. I think I have contradicted myself there, but never mind!
Tim.

Absolutely, and I second that.

The problem is that the perpetrators of all the mischief are not dealt with as they deserve.

I am criticised because I respond, and when I do so the recipient gets to know it.

When I finish my thread and prove my point then all these mischiefmakers can be left to their own devices.

I personally admire the patience of anyone willing to try to moderate and I am not surprised so many have given up and left.

 

[timm]

T2W is the best public trading forum on the internet; bar none. I applaud the moderators for their restraint. A heavy-handed approach would stifle debate to the detriment of the site.

Jtrader - I disagree with you. I wouldn't want to see the endless discusion on Forex systems that can be found in other places to arrive on this site. This is best kept on those specialist sites. The Forex section of T2W is head and shoulders above these other forums IMO.

ducatti998 - I disagree with you about this not being the place for 'opinions'. The exchange of opinions, even the crazy ones is exactly the purpose of a public forum. Factual discussions about the mechanics of trading are the dullest of threads.

timsk - Agree the intellectual level of discussions has waned. But all the really good topics have been done to death and trading really isn't complicated enough to provide an endless source of material. Inevitably you will be left with a few egos and eager newbies. But there is still a core of real no-nonsense traders on the site.

There are a number of really witty posters that make this site such a good read and there is a good sense of community. Don't mess with the formula just because of a couple of runaway threads. A little more moderation is all that's required to curb the excesses and foster the community spirit.

I'd be happy to help if it means I can bang some heads together. There's a couple on this thread beginning to annoy me ;-)

regards
Tim

 

[zupcon]

There is no problem.

Go through the boards, you'll see.

There is a T2W circus that occupies a handful of threads at any time, but only a few.

All the usual suspects on thier respected sides are there as part of the circus.

First the clowns come out throwing buckets of water at each other......it's all too predictable.......tradable......and all very psychological.

The mods play golf these days, they've seen the circus too many times now to laugh.

The rest of the site looks after itself.

Maybe the circus needs a new juggler or human cannonball?

Yes the circus is funny, and amusing to small children and adults......until

the lion tamer gets his head bitten off, or the knife thrower accidentally embeds a knife in his assistants throat, or the trapeze arist falls 150 feet without a net and breaks his neck.

The vindictive personal attacks on several members are nothing short of witnessing an accident at the circus, most of us cant help but take a quick look at the carnage, out of morbid curiosity, but it's still all rather sickening.

 

[nine]

The Roman empire declined and fell (actually so did the British - where are the barbarians?) so why shouldn't T2W?

 

[andycan]

its always the few that buggers it for the rest,

 

[barjon]

Well, I didn't expect to have to moderate this thread (silly me ) but I've removed/edited some to de-personalise it.

We're talking about the health of your site here.

I ought to correct the view expressed by some and summed up by Jack O'Clubs when he says
"Controversial threads = traffic. Traffic = advertising revenue" . Sharky can speak for himself (he's in New York at the moment) but I know he is much more interested in the quality of the site than the traffic. Certainly, it's never been mentioned to me - perhaps if it had I'd never have deleted around 100 posts from a current thread that may have attracted your attention :cheesy:

cheers

jon

 

[jhaughey]

Barjon I used to love this site, but unfortunatley its turned into a feeding frenzy of stupidity. The options section in this place is REDONKULOUS I really hope no up and coming option traders have taken any heed of the plain vanilla option thread.... its embarrassing....
there are people on this thread who are being totally underruled by (Whats the plural of Anuses? Ani?) anyway Ani...

if you want options go to fattail.org

 

[nine]

I support jahaughey's view ... if you want quality you are going to need to do some quality control including killing a few wayward processes.

 

[JTrader]

With mods thin on the ground lately, it's been difficult to be about at the right time to nip things in the bud and stop some threads lurching out of control. I was engaged last night in the somewhat thankless task of trying to pick up the pieces on one such thread and I was struck by two comments:...........................................

cheers

jon

to be honest, I'm really surprised that Moderators are not financially paid for their time and efforts, when you consider that this site is a business, and must bring in quite a lot of cash through advertising.

 

[JTrader]

As with threads in the foyer, i suggest having threads in the commercial trading systems for sale, also not appearing in the main menu.
On the whole, i regard these threads as spam, started by unscrupulous opportunists, and if members want to view these, they should go and look for them - they know where they are.

eg. New member joins T2W today, his first post is selling a system. He expects people are going to donate $200 to his retirment fund via paypal!

 

[Lightning McQueen]

We are drawn to the thread motorway pile ups like moths to a flame......after all it is fun to watch the odd spat or two :cheesy:

When the much vaunted new site kicks into life, perhaps we can moderate our own viewing by being able to ignore threads in the same way we currently can put individuals on ignore, which to my mind doest go far enough in blocking out the individual.

Frugi was a wee bit of a silly billy on the circle thread by broadcasting the fact he was off on holiday, it all kicked off a bit from then, what a Naughty boy

 

[barjon]

......Frugi was a wee bit of a silly billy on the circle thread by broadcasting the fact he was off on holiday, it all kicked off a bit from then, what a Naughty boy .........

lm

You may have noticed from his tag that frugi has hung up his moderator boots (although he does lend a hand when he can) so he can enjoy care-free holidays without feeling naughty :cheesy:

cheers

jon

 

[Mr. Charts]

I'm sorry to see frugi go. I have had my disagreements with him but always had a lot of respect for him.
Richard

 

[Mayfly]

Hmmm, it definitely seems to me that less is more, unless we're talking about moderators?

Mayfly