Vendor Performance Thread

[new_trader]

Since nothing new is being said here and the same old bone is being chewed once again, I suggest that the site adopt the position of some other similar sites and ask the registered vendors either to pay up for the privilege of posting/advertising there or take a hike.

I'm sure this suggestion will be implemented forthwith.

I'd give you a rep but it says I have to spread it around. You know, that's another anoying thing, why do I have to....

 

[wasp]

And as to the "live trade" thing, anyone who believes that any trade posted on a message board is live is being extremely naive.

you mean people might lie

 

[Mathemagician]

You may know little about math, but nothing about Markets.

It appears I know at least as much about markets as you know about people. Sorry if I offended you somehow.

jj

 

[dbphoenix]

I think everyone would agree we need more open communication, but also concrete action points and a timetable for implementing them, that's why I think a weekly chat session between members, advisors, staff and myself - would be an excellent idea. Basically we'd set up a realtime room either on the website (probably) or IRC, and we can have an open discussion. We can have the first session sometime this week.

While I am all for direct communication between those who are responsible for implementing changes and the members, I suggest that the number of people who would attend a "chat session" will likely be disappointing, after which we get a new round of "why don't people participate?"

So the question becomes why a chat session is superior to a thread?

 

[Devilicus]

And as to the "live trade" thing, anyone who believes that any trade posted on a message board is live is being extremely naive.

i don't get it.
Me and a few others like to post live trades.

 

[dbphoenix]

you mean people might lie

 

[trader_dante]

And as to the "live trade" thing, anyone who believes that any trade posted on a message board is live is being extremely naive.

Well, messages are timestamped so if you post as you trade then I guess they are live.

 

[wasp]

So why not have, as New_trader has suggested, a required a period of live trading? A lie or not to whether the trade is placed, surely the facts are then there to show whether the trades would have proved consistency or not and thus negating the problem?

 

[Depth Trade]

It appears I know at least as much about markets as you know about people. Sorry if I offended you somehow.

jj

You already proved how little you know.

 

[Mathemagician]

There's enough lag in posting to create lots of wiggle room. It's not even hard to fake extraordinary scalping results based on a couple seconds of lag in a live chat room.

jj

 

[Depth Trade]

Yeah, you offended me.

? Why drag in more regulatory bodies, expecially forcibly when they have zero authority.

I don't get people like you or like them.

 

[dbphoenix]

Well, messages are timestamped so if you post as you trade then I guess they are live.

Sorry, no. Even trades in chat rooms aren't necessarily "live".

You're probably too nice a person to know these tricks, but I've seen just about all of them. Which is why I pay no attention to anyone who doesn't explain in detail what he's trading and why and how. Like you do.

But at the very least, anything in the past tense is almost surely baloney ("I went long at", "there was a selling climax at", and so forth) and is as useless as market "analysis" of yesterday.

 

[Depth Trade]

There's enough lag in posting to create lots of wiggle room. It's not even hard to fake extraordinary scalping results based on a couple seconds of lag in a live chat room.

jj

Hey Math, tell me why you think 'they' have authority.

 

[firewalker99]

I think everyone would agree we need more open communication, but also concrete action points and a timetable for implementing them, that's why I think a weekly chat session between members, advisors, staff and myself - would be an excellent idea. Basically we'd set up a realtime room either on the website (probably) or IRC, and we can have an open discussion. We can have the first session sometime this week.

While I am all for direct communication between those who are responsible for implementing changes and the members, I suggest that the number of people who would attend a "chat session" will likely be disappointing, after which we get a new round of "why don't people participate?"

So the question becomes why a chat session is superior to a thread?

Sharky, I agree with dbphoenix on this. I see no reason to use any other means of communication than those who are already in place. I believe you already proposed that in the advisor group, and there wasn't exactly much anime at that time neither.

It would be nice to have a timetable, but perhaps easier than that is just to create a discussion thread where after a week or so a poll is initiated and some decisions are being made, after everybody who showed interest has had the chance to share their opinion.

 

[wasp]

So why not have, as New_trader has suggested, a required a period of live trading? A lie or not to whether the trade is placed, surely the facts are then there to show whether the trades would have proved consistency or not and thus negating the problem?

Sorry, no. Even trades in chat rooms aren't necessarily "live".

You're probably too nice a person to know these tricks, but I've seen just about all of them. Which is why I pay no attention to anyone who doesn't explain in detail what he's trading and why and how. Like you do.

But at the very least, anything in the past tense is almost surely baloney ("I went long at", "there was a selling climax at", and so forth) and is as useless as market "analysis" of yesterday.

If that is the case, nothing is gained. Not much is gained in regards to integrity or proof through asking for payment though either as one punter could justify the costs but still what they sell is unprofitable.

 

[new_trader]

Sorry, no. Even trades in chat rooms aren't necessarily "live".

You're probably too nice a person to know these tricks, but I've seen just about all of them. Which is why I pay no attention to anyone who doesn't explain in detail what he's trading and why and how. Like you do.

But at the very least, anything in the past tense is almost surely baloney ("I went long at", "there was a selling climax at", and so forth) and is as useless as market "analysis" of yesterday.

Maybe I am too naive because I'm certainly not too nice to understand what you mean. When you say trade calls are not live, do you mean that they are only a paper trades (ie/ no money) OR they are not a call being made at the exact time the trade is made?

I would be satisfied with someone in a live chat room saying short NOW@X whether there was real money at stake or not. Especially if they were trying to show in principle that their methodology is sound. They wouldn't even need to explain the how's and why's.

 

[Depth Trade]

It appears I know at least as much about markets as you know about people. Sorry if I offended you somehow.

jj

The NFA and CFTC are criminal entities that have flooded the market with fraudulent 'paper' contracts that have ruined the pricing of free markets.

Once they get in full control they'll be in 'pole' position to completely manipulate the markets at there free will.

Just look at gold prices on contract (920-925) compared to physycal gold offer $1033

< that is fraud.

 

[firewalker99]

I would be satisfied with someone in a live chat room saying short NOW@X whether there was real money at stake or not. Especially if they were trying to show in principle that their methodology is sound. They wouldn't even need to explain the how's and why's.

I post at least 3 trades each week where I usually - beforehand - post where I will go long or where I would go short. Then, at the time of the actual trade, I make the announcement on the appropriate thread, with a stop attached to it so anybody can tell when I'll be wrong or not. At then end of the day I explain on a chart, with full analysis why I went wrong or short at that particular price level. If I'm not in a trade, I even post the analysis during the day or make references to it while the pattern is forming (for example: "I will go long if price breaks out of the triangle at 12350...").

Ofcourse nobody can proof whether I'm trading real money or not, but that's beside the point. Anybody can see whether it is working or not. Or at least 'anybody' who is part of the private group "real live trading". Vendors are more than welcome to show their stuff.

Or they could open a journal like trader_dante did.

 

[dbphoenix]

If that is the case, nothing is gained. Not much is gained in regards to integrity or proof through asking for payment though either as one punter could justify the costs but still what they sell is unprofitable.

You're skipping over the central point: "explain in detail what he's trading and why and how".

The best traders I've worked with -- including Teresa Lo, Linda Raschke, and Bo Yoder -- always explained in detail exactly what it was they were looking for and why and what they planned to do with it if and when it appeared. None of this "can't give away my secrets" nonsense. Therefore, when a trade came up that they should have taken, those paying attention could rightfully ask why the trade hadn't been taken. Or if one was taken that on the face of it should not have been taken, they could ask why. This is how one learns principles. This is a primary method of learning how to trade, whether someone else's system or a system which one has created as a result of what he has learned.

Anyone who tries to get away with "went long at" or "had a great day today" can't be expected to be taken seriously.

 

[wasp]

You're skipping over the central point: "explain in detail what he's trading and why and how".

I thought N_T's central point was not why, but why should any one buy your system? Prove it works and is profitable? This isn't about other traders here and their skills, but about system sellers and their claims of X, Y and Z, regardless of how.