The Market Matrix

Thanks for the replies. First off, I don`t want to create any arguments here. I appreciate what you`re saying Sandra and it wouldn`t be the first time Ive heard it (re trading someone elses system). But, you know, Im ashamed to keep thinking that there maybe an easier way out there to kick off this trading game. Im sure I speak for so many that I have spent so much time looking at one scheme or the other that you just become so confused that you don`t know where to turn!
And, when a new system comes along, such as MM, you think `could this be the one`.
My head is buzzing and I feel like Im getting nowehere very very quickly.
Thank you for your views.


sandrab said:
Hi all

MM - yep - I use it as a sidekick. I follow my system. Nobody CAN use somebody's system. Copan sells his idea for £2000. Knowing full well NOBODY can replicat it. Money 4 nought.

Ask Robster4. His views are well known. Nowhere to be seen now. He said sell!!!!!!!!!! . MM said Sell. Yep. I can tell you it did. But the market went UP. Follow that TOM, ROBSTER4, - and ofcourse Copam. But does he care. Well yes . He got a lot of you doubting the system.. So £2000 down the drain. From Ex............rer, L*****art, and the rest of you.

MM - in my view - well it works for Copam. But for you and me, NO! unless you can adapt it to suit you. I've had MM for 3 months. I could have spent £50 on a book on Fib/gann/cycles.

Sorry copam. But got to be honest to all here.

Mail m if you ned anything else.

See u

S
 
Hmmm.
At the risk of being treated rudely... I'm not an MM fan, but would be interested to see it work more than not - for what it's worth if it predicted short then okay, bad call, but a reasonable stop gets you out and if it's right a little more than it's wrong you are still making money. Personally I don't see the need to predict turns, I still consider it far more useful to notice and react to them. The low on the 13th is clearly a short term turn point (to me it's changed trend, not a bear market rally, but it's right at the price level to confirm that tonight), and you couldn't possibly short the SPX today on the basis of looking at yesterday's EoD chart... not without seeing some significant topping action today at least, which never occurred.

I'm honestly not looking to argue here, nor to disparage MM - I thought the SPX would drop 2 weeks ago, it never quite got as low as I thought it might so I'm not claiming anything here... just making the point that IF you use things like MM, Delta and so on then you do still need to do some basic bar/candlechart reading, if only to filter out when the system gets it wrong so you only take trade the moves that stand some chance of coming off.

For MM - well, no system is going to be 100% right, surely? Not knowing MM I can't say this is so, but Delta certainly included suggestions on confirming entry/exit with simple chart reading, perhaps an MM user could let us know if Mr Copan's system similarly includes advice to users on this (to my mind essential) confirmation process... you have the turn date indicated, you only enter if you then see the chart showing a turn in progress?

And that, unless suckered in by reasoned argument, is it for me for another fortnight!

Dave
 
Hi

I bought MM - with the idea similar to your's. Finding the Holy Grail ( which I must add - what MM suggests) is not possible.

The system U use must suit ur personality. A simple systm of RSI - i adapted by many a succesful trader. I have a friend who totally relies on RSI - he makes £5000 to £8000 consistently every week usng just this. I showed him MM - he said great - but too complex - one wastes time analysing the market - rather than trading. He is correct.

So from a great trader - like my friend - find ur own system - that suits you.

Good luck

Sandra


BF1 said:
Thanks for the replies. First off, I don`t want to create any arguments here. I appreciate what you`re saying Sandra and it wouldn`t be the first time Ive heard it (re trading someone elses system). But, you know, Im ashamed to keep thinking that there maybe an easier way out there to kick off this trading game. Im sure I speak for so many that I have spent so much time looking at one scheme or the other that you just become so confused that you don`t know where to turn!
And, when a new system comes along, such as MM, you think `could this be the one`.
My head is buzzing and I feel like Im getting nowehere very very quickly.
Thank you for your views.
 
Hi
THE HOLY GRAIL

“Learn how a simple scientifically-based trading rule transformed a £10 spread bet into £90,000 IN ONE DAY and how you could do the same!”



“I made £18,000 in 2 days on a £25 bet using the Market Matrix”

Mark H, London

Colin W, in his forties, recently retired from his job on an oil rig and purchased a Lamborghini and a new home with his profits!

“I took my £88,500 pension fund to £340,000 in the space of 18 months using the Market Matrix”

Derek Pinder, aged 71, from Bedfordshire

That’s over 380% in just 18 months!


Non Disclosure - well this is on the site. Nothing to do with me.
 
Last edited:
Very interesting discussion guys/gals on MM, I remember the Copan guy teaching it to a select few from TACTICAL TRADER and PROMISED/VOWED to NEVER disclose it again .

A load of bololcks!

Typical marketing ploy to increase sales, now with it being advertised on Bloomy as well.

As A320 says - nothing new under the sun.

Exterminator I am becoming a fan of yours, I've looked at Bryce's book bt will also look into Jenkins to see if I can pick up something in addition.

Totally agree sandra - keeping it simple is the key.
 
For what it is worth, for the reasons he gives, I agree with exterminator. 1195 also appears to be about the end of a minor wave E.
 
DaveJB said:
Hmmm.
At the risk of being treated rudely... I'm not an MM fan, but would be interested to see it work more than not - for what it's worth if it predicted short then okay, bad call, but a reasonable stop gets you out and if it's right a little more than it's wrong you are still making money. Personally I don't see the need to predict turns, I still consider it far more useful to notice and react to them. The low on the 13th is clearly a short term turn point (to me it's changed trend, not a bear market rally, but it's right at the price level to confirm that tonight), and you couldn't possibly short the SPX today on the basis of looking at yesterday's EoD chart... not without seeing some significant topping action today at least, which never occurred.

I'm honestly not looking to argue here, nor to disparage MM - I thought the SPX would drop 2 weeks ago, it never quite got as low as I thought it might so I'm not claiming anything here... just making the point that IF you use things like MM, Delta and so on then you do still need to do some basic bar/candlechart reading, if only to filter out when the system gets it wrong so you only take trade the moves that stand some chance of coming off.

For MM - well, no system is going to be 100% right, surely? Not knowing MM I can't say this is so, but Delta certainly included suggestions on confirming entry/exit with simple chart reading, perhaps an MM user could let us know if Mr Copan's system similarly includes advice to users on this (to my mind essential) confirmation process... you have the turn date indicated, you only enter if you then see the chart showing a turn in progress?

And that, unless suckered in by reasoned argument, is it for me for another fortnight!

Dave

Well put Dave.

I have been looking at fib counts / levels myself following posts on this board to see if i can tie these in with turning points with any degree of accuracy. I am looking at spx & this told me we were due to go down round about now / early next week. I was basing this on moves from the recent major high in march and low in april. That, plus everyone here was screaming to go short. So it all looked good.

However, looking at the spx charts yesterday, no matter what timeframe, there was absolutely nothing that i could see to confirm that shorting was the right thing to do, so i didn't. The thing that was troubling me was the speed of the ascent from the 1164 area, based on this i felt that further consolidation in a range was likely before a further significant move (up or down).

This obviously could have been pure good fortune on my part, & we may well go down today, but i'm pleased that i stuck to simple chart reading to tell me whether to enter the trade or not.

SandraB,

Can i ask why you seem to have become so negative about the MM suddenely? From your first posts i thought you were actually quite positive. Is it just because of this one incorrect call, or some other reason?

thanks.
 
LevII said:
For what it is worth, for the reasons he gives, I agree with exterminator. 1195 also appears to be about the end of a minor wave E.

Hi LevII,

I can't see that wave E. Could you put up a chart ?

TIA.

Regards,

Ivor
 
ferrari1 said:
Mofo,

To quote you... ' am looking at spx & this told me we were due to go down round about now / early next week. I was basing this on moves from the recent major high in march and low in april'

If you listen to what Steve says on his audio interviews, you'll see that what you did there was the classic mistake. Basing things on highs and lows from just a few months ago simply doesnt provide the type of accuracy that the matrix does. You need to take a whole load of things into account going back far far longer than a few months.

If you havent done so, listen to the audio's below, they've just added a second on too...

www.clickevents.co.uk/stevecopan.htm

I agree with your comment on SandraB tho! She was extremely positive a few posts ago???

Hi Ferrari

Yep, i'm aware of the importance of obtaining confirmation from larger timeframes. Be interested to hear how you get on with it.
 
Hi Exterminator

I am not sure that what I am about to do is a good idea, but here goes.

I was taught the original Market Matrix method some time back. This was in June last year. It was taught by Steve Copan and lasted a full day. It taught the method of Delta and the extension of this work, which Steve called NEXUS. The seminar cost me £3200. It was good day BUT it was too compact. There was simply too much information to digest in such a short space of time. Furthermore the seminar was 10 hours long and it was difficult to give 100% attention to material taught at 8pm, 10 hours after we started.

A couple of guys at the seminar including myself suggested it might be a good idea to put the material down on a disc. This was later done, and it is available as the Market Matrix.

The Market Matrix is an awesome piece of work. It might be expensive in absolute terms, but there is no deducting from the content. The CDs were finished in the first days of November 2004. In the final CD Copan looks forward to the months ahead in the SP500, and he shows the viewer how he arrives at the 3rd of January 2005 as the high in the SP500 cash index at a price of 1118. It is a true testiment to the value of the Market Matrix, and it is done 2 months ahead of the actual day.

Here is the flipside. There will always be people who are cynical at financial promotions or seminars. Have I not been HIGHLY cynical at Darren Winter's seminars? Yes, I have. Yet there may be many who liked the seminars he did.

The Market Matrix is NOT an easy method to come to grips with. I "promote" the method but I do NOT receive money from it. I don't take money and I simply send people directly to Copan himself. I have had people emailing me and phoning me about the Market Matrix. I try to tell as much as I can and explain what it is and what it is not. I have had a handful of people who had no experience in trading whom I told that they would waste their money by buying the Matrix because they had too little general experience. I put it on my site because I received the Matrix very cheap. In all fairness I did pay the full amount for the original course and I know those who attended have all received an offer of getting the Matrix cheaper than the offer price at £2000.


So it might be a good idea to talk about what the Matrix is. The best way I can describe the content of the CDs is as follows:

The general theme of the 3 CDs is is to teach the viewer how to calculate turning points in the market, whichever market that may be. It could be in stocks, commodities, currencies or indices. The method makes use of Welles Wilders Delta points as the foundation. The Market Matrix is however all about one thing and one thing only: TIME. It is designed to teach the user how you use time as the most important tool in your trading decisions. Calculating price targets actually comes second to time. This is not a new theme. Gann made the same assumption. I have lost count the amount of times Copan has said to me "Time is the most important tool".

The foundation that is used in the Matrix are Fibonacci numbers, extensions of Fibonacci, and ratios of Fibonacci. It is used in conjunction with Delta turning points and the aim of course is to pinpoint turns in the markets. The Matrix can be used for intra-day trading, swing trading and longer term position trading. In my experience the hardest bit to master is the intra-day trading, while trading over a couple of days is "much easier". I put this in brackets because I would never tell anyone at any time that the Market Matrix was an easy method to get your head around.

I hope this has answered a few of the things floating around. As I said in the beginning of the post, it might have been a bad idea to do this, as it often means you are opening a can of worms. I only heard about this thread because someone was kind enough to tell me my name had been mentioned. If you have any questions regarding the MM, you are welcome to email me on [email protected]

Regards
Tom
 
More information on Market Matrix:

the CDs goes through the USE of Delta very elaborately, the use of Elliott Wave ( not in a complicated way) and the use of Fibonacci numbers. A lot of time is spent on teaching how the Delta points tie in with waves and Fibonacci counts/numbers. The last CD of the 3 CDs deals exclusively with time ( and price as well) and the "how to " step by step. I think the last CD is the best of the 3 because it goes into great detail of how to go about solving the time element in the market.

There is a user group available to those buy the method. It is a discussion board where members can ask questions to each.

Regards
Tom
 
Now that I got warmed up and is posting again I might as well continue.

I remember when Chris Lock ( TA guy from CNBC) told me about the Delta book, it really annoyed me you were not allowed to talk about the method. It annoyed me that everyone who had the book were so cagey about the material. I bought the book and although it is a great method, I can easily see its limitations as well. I thought what is the big deal, but Welles of course is a great marketer and has kept the "secrecy" intact for a number of years. I dont understand how one can "monopolise" this information and sue people for talking about it, but there you go.

Chris used the Delta extensively, but I dont know if he does so anymore. I also know he then started to use Chris Carolans work in his forecast. What I find interesting is that Chris Carolan ( read Spiral Calendar ) is using a method which in its heart might as well have been Delta or Matrix. The Spiral Calendar makes use of the harmonic cycle of the moons rotation and projects forward using squared Fibonacci numbers. It is quite a clever method.

What of course is even more funny is when you talk to guys like Steve Rifkin and Bryce Gilmore. These guys detest anyone who makes forecasts and strictly believe in preparation using support and resistance, balance points and Fib retrace and extentions. Both are hugely succesful and believe in trading what you see, and not what you think.

Anyway, I better stop my ramblings here before I get banned for boring people

Regards
Tom
 
ivorm said:
OK. No problem.

Regards,

Ivor
Got it.

Pretty good Wolfe Wave as well.
 

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sandrab said:
Hi

Could you tell me how you can attach files into this thread.

Thanks
Sure,
Click 'reply'
click 'Manage Attachments'
Click 'Browse' and browse to the saved file.
Click 'Upload'
Voila.
 
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