The Journey from the Basement

[SOCRATES]

Socrates, I fully agree that darksiders are the minority. I began the same jouney myself a couple of years ago and still consider myself a newbie at this art. As an amateur musician, I can appreciate that the transition from mechanical to intuitive can take many many hours of practice.

Thats right. Tell me, what instrument do you play ?

 

[SOCRATES]

Oaty, the matter is the matter that engages our interest as all of us here are devoted to the pursuit of knowledge, so if you are willing or able to expand, I am sure the audience would greatly appriciate it.
Thanks.

 

[china white]

QUOTE: "I fear that there is a danger here of creating a "Zen" like mysticism that will alienate many who are seeking to trade without indicators."

Spike, I will rather unusually for this Forum quote the Bible here - "Do not make idols for yourself"

generally I wud fully agree with u, and I'd be the last person to create idols. However, on this occasion I will respectfully disagree. Dark side is NOT about going to see a new shaman - IT IS ABOUT changing your trading PSYCOLOGY in such a way that u start "seeing", not just "clicking" between the screens. AND that is not creating a "love potion" to make the market fall in love with u - that is starting to understand her moves in their manifestations so well, that u can conquer her!

 

[harryp]

You do'nt want to conquer the market china .............. you want to conquer yourself

 

[china white]

that is exactly the point mate! it's one's good own self where one's problems are harboured! and dark side addresses exactly that in order to be successful in the market!

 

[SOCRATES]

Now this is drifting into interesting territory again.....

 

[SOCRATES]

By the way, Trader 333, now is the appropriate moment to refer you to your posting:
"Leading indicators as opposed to lagging indicators"
Look at my reply to your post again, please.
You are not doing any homework.
Please do your homework.
I cannot do it for you.

When you have done it come back to me please.

 

[SOCRATES]

Yes, I know what you mean, but the correct way is to channel them ~
not to walk it for them, as I am absolutely determined to take them higher,
if they will let me.
That is all.

 

[SOCRATES]

Oaty, why have you sloped off and are now searching forums ?
What is in front of you above is what you have to put your attention on,
and not flitting from one corner to another, if you want to progress,
that is ? Otherwise not.

 

[oatman]

I'm always searching forums. This time it was for antivirus.
I'm still thinking on your poser but I'm afraid it hasn't clicked yet.

 

[SOCRATES]

Good, that's all right. But you must put your attention on it with serious focus.
If you crack it your head will explode with delight.

And it is not a poser. I do not give people riddles for fun.
I have other more imporant things to engage my interest.
This is something you have to carry out yourself , on your own.

But you have to earn it.

And I can help you but I want you to help me to help you. OK?

I cannot do it alone for you.

Go away and think about it ~ it may not come immediately,
but if you seriously work on it ~ it will happen, and you will love it.

 

[SOCRATES]

mmm, but we have been looking at the ftse index on here recently. It is not directly traded so why should it be manipulated? Surely manipulation campaigns will be in the constituent, directly traded shares? The index may reflect the manipulation of its constituent shares but does it? For example a number of narrow range bars could merely represent the average of a series of fairly wide up movements in some consituents counteracted by fairly wide down movements in others?

Dear barjon, I will proceed to unravel this riddle for you as soon as possible, but not now, Later.

 

[china white]

barjon, ftse not manipulated? please mate like football games never fixed....

 

[firehorse]

By the way, Trader 333, now is the appropriate moment to refer you to your posting:
"Leading indicators as opposed to lagging indicators"
Look at my reply to your post again, please.
You are not doing any homework.
Please do your homework.
I cannot do it for you.

When you have done it come back to me please.

Other than:

Price
Volume,
Time and Sales
Level II

Are there any other leading indicators that anyone can think of ?

Are there any other leading indicators that anyone can think of ?



Funny you should mention it, but the answer you seek to the question you ask is inside
the question itself. I suggest you read your own question carefully.
The tragedy is that the great majority of people are not able to do it.

I'll have a crack at this!

If the answer is inside the question then the only part of the sentence that give me a possible answer is "think". Which means the only "leading indicator" is whatever you think or rather how you think.

If you can go behind the "mechanical" side of price and volume and get into the mind/psychology of the big boys, then the chart will become an open book and you can see ahead of time what might happen so your "thinking" becomes your leading indicator.

I'm not sure why "homework" wasn't done as the previous analysis by Paul was
"I have looked at it carefully.
Can't fault it, very good, well done!"
so I can only think something was revealed in the latest trade where "mechanical trading" was done where there was an opportunity to do even better

If I've got this completely wrong then at least I've had the chance to teach other people who follow what the wrong answer was!

 

[SOCRATES]

Well done Firehorse !
Look at this all of you, you see how engaging brain yields results ,
and the mind gets nourished !
Unfortunately you have exonerated 333 from doing the work,
which was the object of the excercise for him to have a realisation
as a result of him cracking it for himself.
But in any case it is perfect.
Most people overlook the significance of the obvious, but Firehorse here has
done marvellously well to have tackled this. Good, very good !
And he is only a learner, crikey !
And the most important observation to be made of this is that he has taught himself to "learn."
And this pleases me enormously, I can tell you.

 

[firehorse]

Well done Firehorse !

Phew!

I couldn't comment on Paul's trade on my previous post as I'm still busy trying to figure out which way to turn the map to read it correctly!

But I did wake up this morning with something I thought would be worth sharing. It's about the right kind of mind/attitude to trading.
#1134

Socrates, I fully agree that darksiders are the minority. I began the same jouney myself a couple of years ago and still consider myself a newbie at this art. As an amateur musician, I can appreciate that the transition from mechanical to intuitive can take many many hours of practice.

As a follow on to this - in the past I've studied martial arts.

To be really effective, you must lose your ego.

If you are scared you're going to get hit, that will tense your muscles, slow you down and you will get hit. (Worried you will lose money)

If you celebrate the fact you've managed to 'tag' someone, then that takes your focus away from the task at hand and you are liable to be hit by the counter attack. (Overconfidence after a win)

If you "think" you are better than the other person then you will try to "force" your technique. But the "force" creates tension, which slows you down and you will get hit (Trying to make trades where there are none).

If you think you will lose then you will miss any chance of a counter-attack so you will lose (losing confidence after a loss)

The only way to be at your best is to operate without any ego, learn from your mistakes and move on. Do not get tied up in the fact you got hit. Do not spend time celebrating you tagged someone. After the bout you can spend time to reflect on any lessons learnt and savour techniques successfully carried out

I assume that a successful trader will have this kind of mindset.

#690

You are all motorists aren't you ?

You are either going in one direction or another aren't you ? The key thing is that you have to be AWARE ot he traffic, but the traffic itself does not prevent you from reaching your destination, but you must be AWARE of the behaviour of other motorists in order to get home safely as you originally planned.

Therefore what you must concentrate on is developing an awareness of what is happening and what to do about it, within a living organism that has dimensions instead of a map, which is just flat.

The driving analogy can be explored further.

If someone cuts you up, do you let it pass, or do you swear at the person, gesticulating wildly, taking your focus off the road and possibly having an accident. Does your outburst serve any purpose other than massaging your own bruised ego? Do you let your buttons be pushed by other people?

If you can detach from those kind of events then it would then be good to apply that to trading so that emotions do not come into influencing your trading decision. Do not let the market push your buttons! and have a financial accident!

#634

...but above all you must have the right character.
If you do not pass the character test, you cannot ever succeed,
you may muddle along but the Star Chamber will remain firmly locked.

I'm hoping that the above helps people in character development if they require it!

 

[oatman]

You are either going in one direction or another aren't you ? The key thing is that you have to be AWARE ot he traffic, but the traffic itself does not prevent you from reaching your destination, but you must be AWARE of the behaviour of other motorists in order to get home safely as you originally planned.

There's a difference, are you "going along", or are you "driving"?

 

[SOCRATES]

Animal Lesson Number 4:~ This is the apprpropiate opportunity to deliver this lesson, so please pay attention :~


Somewhere in Africa a farmer had his farm invaded by a Rhino. This brute went about crashing into things, trampling on other things, snorting and threatening the other animals.

Fortunately Rhinos are not carnivorous, but their sheer size and bulk pose a threat to the tranquility and order of agriculture. That is why they are kept in special game reserves under the control of rangers.

The farmer was beside himself as this beast is a protected species you see, do you get my drift ?

(rather like their human counterparts in society that are nuisances but are also protected species and some of them are really grave nuisances and the tragedy is that it is not possible to cull them, although they breed and reproduce themselves and proliferate and there are rangers to look after them in specially designated enclaves ) but I digress, because the farmer was really at his wits end.

He decided to make a quick visit to the headman in the village, so he gets into his Land Rover and roars off. The headman receives him very politely in his hut, and listens very carefully to his story, without interrupting. When the farmer finishes his tale of woe, the headman nods at his four sons and dispatches them to accompany the distraught farmer back to his farm.

By this time the Rhino had crashed his way into a barn and was playing havoc wth the bales of hay in there, charging at them and tossing them in the air, and trampling on them, anyway, mayhem ! Can you imagine such a scene, fortunately no one had been hurt and no really serious damage had been done to the property or vehicle or any of the animals.

The farmer and the four tribesmen arrive in the yard and get out of the Land Rover. It is only now that the farmer realises that the tribesmen are not carrying their spears. This to the farmer is very unusual, since wherever they go these tribesmen carry a shield, a spear and a knobkerrie, which is a club, (lethal it is). But on this occasion the four tribesmen are unarmed.

The farmer is puzzled as to what is going to happen next you see, because this is not a joke.
In his mind's eye he has visions of one or all these tribesmen who are only youngsters, getting killed or maimed. The consequences of this happenening carries dire implications. Therefore the farmer is very worried. But the four tribesmen appear not to be worried at all .....Do you find this interesting so far? Yes, good, I will continue.

Now the farmer does not know what to do. He thinks that to allow the four young tribesmen near this wild beast constitutes a great risk, but of course one must add that the farmer had never been near a Rhino,his experience had been limited to viewing them through binoculars, which is a very different proposition to gettting up close to such an animal.

So now he asks the boys how it is that they are going to go about it. To his utter astonishment they ask
for what no one would expect. What is it ? "Three blankets Bwana please"....."You're joking ! You mean you are going to trap an angry Rhino with 3 blankets ! ? ". "yes Bwana, 3 blankets please Bwana".
"We know how to handle beasts (nudge) give us the blankets" So the farmer goes off muttering and
comes back with the 3 blankets. By this time the Rhino has taken an interest in a hand cart , but seeing
that the hand cart does not respond either now turns round to look for something else to have a go at,
you see, because now the Rhino is bored. Boredom is a terrible afflilction(nudge), like ignorance.

The boys approach the Rhino from three sides with the blankets outstretched. The Rhino snorts and
paws the dirt, but does not charge. They close in and the Rhino is enclosed in a rectangular space
created by the blankets. The Rhino suddenly calms down. The boys can now do as they please with
him.

Think of this story and see what realisations it can trigger in your thinking.

 

[SOCRATES]

There's a difference, are you "going along", or are you "driving"?

You choose, because it makes no difference.

 

[oatman]

Haven't you seen the people "going along"? They are not confident so they stay in the middle lane all the time.They are frightened to leave the middle lane, yet they think they're driving correctly. They won't move to the left when the lane is clear. They won't overtake when their lane slows down. They're not in control. The difference is confidence.