The end of the EU

[Pat494]

If the Brussel's sprouts had an ounce of sense they would be aiming for full employment in all their countries, especially Greece. Not the sacking of a huge part of the workforce. Is there enough to pay the dole queues ? And are the enforced idle doing anything useful ?

No and no !!

The Greeks can't devalue either. Admittedly their problems are caused mainly by their own incompetence but what they need is good firm leadership. Leave the EU and get stuck in to solve their problems. The EU is being piloted by a hopeless rabble in Brussels or are they in Strasburg currently and won't accept change for the better. Could be on the moon for all the use they are. at great expense.

 

[Pat494]

 

[Atilla]

UK ain't going nowhere.

Simple politics - well played by Cameron.

 

[Pat494]

UK ain't going nowhere.

Simple politics - well played by Cameron.

That's a double negative - so you mean the UK is actually going to do something ?

Or is that cowboy speak - meaning the opposite ?

Or political speak meaning they might do anything or nothing

:clap:

 

[Atilla]

That's a double negative - so you mean the UK is actually going to do something ?

Or is that cowboy speak - meaning the opposite ?

Or political speak meaning they might do anything or nothing

:clap:

I see what you mean - "going nowhere". Wasn't intentional to be honest. What I meant was it's all words with no backing. Something to push UKIP back with.

What are the benefits of dropping out of EC?

I don't understand the why or the numbers?

 

[Pat494]

The eurozone fragments - analysis review - world - FT.com

Well worth a look if you are interested in The Eurozone

 

[Pat494]

It says on the news that Greece needs another E10 billion bailout !!

Well fancy that.

It's even worse than that - Ireland and Portugal need bailouts too !!

Well gosh who would have foreseen that ?

Well not the EU supremos it seems !!

Another failure for democracy too !!

 

[neil]

Little Englanders

It says on the news that Greece needs another E10 billion bailout !!

Well fancy that.

It's even worse than that - Ireland and Portugal need bailouts too !!

Well gosh who would have foreseen that ?

Well not the EU supremos it seems !!

Another failure for democracy too !!

Sigh - Iwish the UK would quit the EU and stop pretending it punches above its 'weight -the UK is just a little island now.

 

[Splitlink]

Sigh - Iwish the UK would quit the EU and stop pretending it punches above its 'weight -the UK is just a little island now.

Spain seems to be dragging itself out of the hole but, much like the UK, the leaders say that the corner has been turned but the man in the street is dubious about that. Too many out of work.

My main thoughts are about Cataluña which seems to be hell bent on breaking away from Spain. We, oldies, worry but the youngsters, as always, see the advantages and not the pitfalls.

Barcelona is the most important port in the Med and Chinese interests own 20% of it.

Without useless rhetoric about we being better off, does anyone have any serious views about Cataluña's prospects outside the EU?

I've heard that many multinationals will leave if we go independent and the massive income, about which our leaders boast so much, will disappear.

Everyone seems confident, also, about our ability to rejoin the EU, which no one wants to leave, but I have heard that entry can be vetoed. Germany and Italy are federal states who may see Cataluña as setting a precedent and, of course, Madrid is an obviously going to veto membership.

If anyone has good links on outside opinion I would like to read them.

 

[Pat494]

Spain seems to be dragging itself out of the hole but, much like the UK, the leaders say that the corner has been turned but the man in the street is dubious about that. Too many out of work.

My main thoughts are about Cataluña which seems to be hell bent on breaking away from Spain. We, oldies, worry but the youngsters, as always, see the advantages and not the pitfalls.

Barcelona is the most important port in the Med and Chinese interests own 20% of it.

Without useless rhetoric about we being better off, does anyone have any serious views about Cataluña's prospects outside the EU?

I've heard that many multinationals will leave if we go independent and the massive income, about which our leaders boast so much, will disappear.

Everyone seems confident, also, about our ability to rejoin the EU, which no one wants to leave, but I have heard that entry can be vetoed. Germany and Italy are federal states who may see Cataluña as setting a precedent and, of course, Madrid is an obviously going to veto membership.

If anyone has good links on outside opinion I would like to read them.

They could improve their position by hooking up with Gibraltar.

 

[Atilla]

They could improve their position by hooking up with Gibraltar.

This rings a bell with respect to Splits blog too.

Anarchists rebel against authority and the establishment but end up all dressing the same conforming with their new idea of what and how the establishment should be.

I was thinking team up with the similar arrogant basque separatists and any other separatist movement and establish a new world order whipping people into line.

One government is not enough lets have 00s. I think these are just pure politics with rich people interested in keeping more of their money re-arranging the rules.

Same issues simmering in Italy between North and South.

Human stuff. No getting away from it. :whistling

 

[Pat494]

This rings a bell with respect to Splits blog too.

Anarchists rebel against authority and the establishment but end up all dressing the same conforming with their new idea of what and how the establishment should be.

I was thinking team up with the similar arrogant basque separatists and any other separatist movement and establish a new world order whipping people into line.

One government is not enough lets have 00s. I think these are just pure politics with rich people interested in keeping more of their money re-arranging the rules.

Same issues simmering in Italy between North and South.

Human stuff. No getting away from it. :whistling

True indeed. Nothing much changes in that department. The "haves" trying to cling on to what they have got and the "have nots" trying to grab a bigger share for themselves.
The irony is that if the "have nots" win, they become just the same as the "haves" they defeated.
So the answer is really to spread what's going, around fairly. But at whose expense is the problem.

It is in the EU's interest to split member states up into smaller states by encouraging diversity. That makes them weaker and more controllable. Britain is being split into its component parts of Wales, Scotland, N. Ireland and England. France, Spain and Germany are on their hit list too, in time.

 

[Atilla]

True indeed. Nothing much changes in that department. The "haves" trying to cling on to what they have got and the "have nots" trying to grab a bigger share for themselves.
The irony is that if the "have nots" win, they become just the same as the "haves" they defeated.
So the answer is really to spread what's going, around fairly. But at whose expense is the problem.

The weak or even better the weakest. :idea:

 

[barjon]

...........So the answer is really to spread what's going, around fairly. But at whose expense is the problem...........

.

The only problem with that is that one man's fairness is another man's gross injustice.

 

[Splitlink]

They could improve their position by hooking up with Gibraltar.

Each has to argue it's case on its own merits. Does Cataluña "belong" to Spain? Does Gibraltar? Gibraltar has a link with the UK that stops Spain from walking in, otherwise it would have been Spanish years ago. Cataluña, on the other hand, notwithstanding the excellent relations we have with the UK now, considers that the UK dropped Cataluña in the bog in 1713 and, if they did it once they could do it again.

I can see, though,from the border delays at Gib, what could happen to us! Millions of people have business and family connections across our borders and I can see no end of other difficulties, as well.

 

[Splitlink]

I found this.

http://www.thenewfederalist.eu/Goodbye-Spain-Hello-Europe,05712

 

[Pat494]

If it's one thing that gets the masses onto the streets for a bit of flag waving, it's Nationalism. The argument has been fine honed over the centuries. But once achieved it usually turns to dust, forced by reality. The Nazis are the foul embodiment of nationalism. Decent people as in Syria are pushed out of the way by the violent and greedy for power.

I would urge caution before inviting nationalist thugs to take over your affairs.

 

[barjon]

I think people are tribal and competitive by nature and need to feel a sense of belonging and superiority. This comes out in many ways - from family through to country (and world if the Martians arrive) in geographic groupings and in "intellectual" groupings (religion etc).

Because of that basic tribalism and competitiveness it's pretty easy for "leaders" to prey on those feelings for good or bad and disturb the balance.

 

[Splitlink]

If it's one thing that gets the masses onto the streets for a bit flag waving it's Nationalism. The argument has been fine honed over the centuries. But once achieved it usually turns to dust, forced by reality. The Nazis are the foul embodiment of nationalism. Decent people as in Syria are pushed out of the way by the violent and greedy for power.

I would urge caution before inviting nationalist thugs to take over your affairs.

Pat, I agree with you 100%. The reality is, though, that there is a lot of flag waving going on and sensible people do not know what their situation is going to become.

Hitler said "tell a lie a million times and it becomes the truth" (or something like that).

 

[Atilla]

The leader of France's far right National Front, which is expected to score well in upcoming European polls, pledged Thursday to do all in her power to facilitate the collapse of the EU.

http://www.expatica.com/fr/news/fre...-it-collapse-says-france-s-le-pen_282386.html

I think EU is on path to full expansion and integration.