stop loss. why????

[BeginnerJoe]

People who fit brakes to their car clearly aren't confident in their ability to drive.

I agree with this. I hardly use the brakes. My analysis and coming to rest projections are almost always spot on. Except on one occasion, I nearly ran over a police officer as he was going on to a zebra crossing. He gave me a very nasty stare.

 

[barjon]

..................What i do find is that none of you like to hear success stories that are different to your methods and go against what you believe to be the trading norm...............

............or you could say that experienced road crossers have learned that you have to wait for a gap in the traffic. 'Course you could just close your eyes and run across, maybe time and time again before the inevitable brings folk to your funeral.

 

[jeffre4]

when i came on this site i was really intimidated i saw all these legendaery members and veterans. I thought i have cracked it here they will all be posting their trades live and that was how they got such an elevated title. i didntr realise it meant that it was the ones who spouted it off the most. Well at least iv'e moved off rookie to junior so it's my turn to brew up and buy the biscuits is it?.

 

[Lickyluciano]

Anyway, congratulations at doubling your account 3 years in a row. Spectacular return which very few achieve. I still do not see the math to back up your claims.

 

[jeffre4]

the only losing trades are the ones posted at present i cannot be more honest than that ive put my trades in the open so we will see which way it goes there is upside i agree but not much more 5660 will be here soon (i think/hope) dam still the junior

 

[BeginnerJoe]

Anyway, congratulations at doubling your account 3 years in a row. Spectacular return which very few achieve. I still do not see the math to back up your claims.

100% is not hard with high leverage. Only last week, I made 65% return on my money in a couple of hours.

 

[Lickyluciano]

100% is not hard with high leverage. Only last week, I made 65% return on my money in a couple of hours.

Do you make that every couple of hours? No. Do you ever lose? Yes. Do you double your account each year like the OP claims......?

 

[jeffre4]

bearing in mind i started with nominal capital it was probably easier to double i retire next year and will have subtantial funds to use however my stakes and goals will be tailered back to achieve 35/40% returns which would cause no sleepless nights and maintains quality of life with all worst case scenarieo's built in maybe so far i have got lucky.

 

[timsk]

yes because the rise as given me the opportunity to add to it i have also hedged long as i said before only time will tell. i also trade daily as i said i am not over exposed so do not see any negatives worked over the past 3 years.

Guys 'n Gels,
The OP's use of punctuation is - how should I put this - economical! As a possible consequence of this, I suspect that post #17 on P3 may have been overlooked.

Tim.

 

[jeffre4]

you have lost me: sorry but i am sure you are trying to expose me as a fraud again. i do not understand you people as i said i may have just been lucky its not like i'm trying to sell you something. The money i have made is miniscule The thread was always stops or no stops period

 

[Albert Carey]

Forgive me if this as been discussed before but new to the site.

I forgive you for your ignorance and audacity.

 

[eztradcomp]

Why does practically everybody put a stop loss on a trade. I believe that it means that you were never confident with the posistion you opened in the first place. If you have done your homework and you believe that whatever you are trading will hit a certain target then you should let run until it does. The companies love stop losses because all you are doing is locking in your losses. How many times do traders say it hit my stop loss then 10mins 1hr 1 day etc it hit my target. Forgive me if this as been discussed before but new to the site.

A stop loss is a reality check to make you aware of the posibilities you might encounter when you enter a trade.
Being aware of how much you can lose on any given trade does not make you a loser but a methodical trader. Anything can happen that is out of your control, so accepting this reality helps keep your emotions in check.

 

[timsk]

you have lost me: sorry but i am sure you are trying to expose me as a fraud again.

Hi jeffre4,
As your post immediately follows mine, I assume (perhaps wrongly) that your comments are directed at me? First, let me assure you that I am not trying to expose you as a fraud! I'm at a loss to know how you might conclude such a thing from my comments - I guess I didn't express myself very clearly - for which I apologize. Anyway, the point I was trying to make is merely that many members have been critical of you for allegedly not using stop losses. I suspect they may have overlooked your post early on in the thread in which you appear to say you've hedged your FTSE short position. Whilst a hedge isn't quite the same as a stop loss obviously - it is a risk management tool and can serve a similar purpose. Therefore, some of the criticism leveled at you may not be warranted. So, if anything, my post is supportive - not critical!

Tim.

 

[jeffre4]

apologies i expect every post to be negative

 

[Hoggums]

People who fit brakes to their car clearly aren't confident in their ability to drive.

You can't predict a road you've never driven down. Every day in the markets is a different road.

People who don't fit brakes to their car soon end up crashing.

 

[new_trader]

Hi jeffre4,
As your post immediately follows mine, I assume (perhaps wrongly) that your comments are directed at me? First, let me assure you that I am not trying to expose you as a fraud! I'm at a loss to know how you might conclude such a thing from my comments - I guess I didn't express myself very clearly - for which I apologize. Anyway, the point I was trying to make is merely that many members have been critical of you for allegedly not using stop losses. I suspect they may have overlooked your post early on in the thread in which you appear to say you've hedged your FTSE short position. Whilst a hedge isn't quite the same as a stop loss obviously - it is a risk management tool and can serve a similar purpose. Therefore, some of the criticism leveled at you may not be warranted. So, if anything, my post is supportive - not critical!

Tim.

The OP has been so vague and ambiguous that it's hard to understand what the point of this thread was.

A hedge is used instead of a STOP, s/he states in one post "I could also say that i never close a losing posistion but you dont like that either." then in another posts writes "i do close trades off if it appears that a fresher target appears which may mean closing one trade at a small loss"

So basically, WTF?

 

[BeginnerJoe]

You can't predict a road you've never driven down. Every day in the markets is a different road.

The OP has strong convictions the road will lead back to the last major lows, by December.

 

[timsk]

apologies i expect every post to be negative

Hi jeffre4,
My job - or part of it at least - is to encourage and facilitate constructive debate - not to stifle it! So, I applaud your thread and am slightly surprised there aren't more members putting forward an argument against the use of stop losses. That said, I think the comments from your critics that appear harsh are - often as not - well meaning.

In its 10 year history, the boards of T2W are littered with former members who thought they could judge market sentiment and, instead of using a stop loss, would average down - convinced that the market would bounce back in their favour. I'm not saying that this can't be done - or should never be done - but those who utilise this approach successfully need some sort of fail safe mechanism in place for the one time when the market doesn't bounce back. And that time will surely come - as I know to my own cost. Many years ago, I grew my account by 26% in under 3 months and then blew up, losing 70% of it on one trade that went disastrously wrong. Whilst this may not be a fair characterization of your trading style, hopefully, you'll understand why members might conclude from your posts that this is what you're doing and why they then make the comments that they do.
Tim.

 

[jeffre4]

timisk your comments are more constructive. My post was meant to be just that a debate for and against but the problem seems to be that when i post a comment now other parties are going back and looking back at previous comments i made to try and trip me up i think they spend to much time in front of their computers analysing everthing. Re my own posistions my losses that are running are not a problem as i said i still trade daily at a profit and the market would have to move a long long way against me for these losing positions to be more than just iritating . (Still adamant that 5665 is just round the corner)

 

[barjon]

I don't think people are deliberately trying to trip you up , jeff, it's just a style of trading that you and your post advance that people think is bound to lead to disaster.

In essence what you are saying is that your analysis has led you to a conclusion of where price will go and that you should be prepared to suffer whatever drawdown occurs whilst that analysis remains valid until it eventually arrives at the target. Even, if I got it right, adding to the original position during the drawdown period.

I take issue with that on three counts:

1. However good the analysis there is never, ever, a certainty that price will arrive at the target.

2. Eventually, there must come a point during a continuing adverse move that the price action, news, surrounding economic circumstances, or whatever you use as the bones of your analysis leads you to a different conclusion thus leaving the target no longer valid. Whatever loss you are suffering must be taken at that point presumably.

3. If additions to the original position are made during the adverse move then, given your assertion about the validity of the target, they too should be held until that target is reached. In effect, therefore, you have staked far more than you originally intended, increased your risk and probably blown your money management plan apart.

If, however, those additions have been made because you'll then be able to exit with some profit before your target is reached then you are saying, in effect, that your original target is no longer valid which ruins the original proposition to hold until target.