stop loss. why????

people here seem to be confusing Stop loss with closing a position ....the two should only meet in extreme circumstances

N
 
Regardless of uses of stop loss, and whether you'll go bankrupt or not if you don't, the opening poster claims to make 100% per year.

He entered a trade at 5350 short, with a target of 90 points, and the FTSE is now at 5800+. Purely on that position, if he was aiming for 2% for the 90 points, he'd now be 10%+ down, and that's from 4 months and growing. Even if it comes back, he'll have 2% for the 4 months plus the time it takes to come back. This doesn't quite match up with the 100% per year statement. Added to this, the fact that he's adding in even more as it goes against him, means that unless he's risking huge drawdown, he was aiming for less than 2% initially anyway, and again, the 100% a year claim doesn't seem to hold.

I think it's a poor sign if someone blames the stop for their losses. Stop location, yes, that may be poor, that may cause unnecessary losses, but the use of stops is not what is causing losses. And as the above shows, getting out of losing trades isn't just about controlling losses, but also about getting out of those bad trades and re-allocating capital to better ones, rather than sit on your hands for 4months to a year hoping, while all your capital is tied up.
 
BeginnerJoe said:
Hmmm, yes, that calls for a statement, a 3 year statement. Maybe he really meant he was 100% right each year for the last 3 years using the hold until win strategy.
Click to expand...

Yes, the 100% claim seems rediculous especially with this averaging down plan. Averaging down can work but when it does its luck. Soon that luck will turn and you will lose more than you earn. Especially in a short trade.

"The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent."
 
wasnt going to come back on and defend myself but here goes.
Supposing i now have 4 positions open all short spread out from 5350 to 5840 which accounts for say 8% of my trading capital none of which are daily it does not hinder me trading daily long or short. i believe that the market will go down to 5660 quite soon which would enable me to close one position off at a profit leaving 3 positions open and making my 3 outstanding positions only 5% of my capital. if i was to take all your advice as you all seem to beieve that the only way is up and close them off i am stili on course to double my money by the year end. granted i am a small stakes player . However i am not going to close them off so watch this space
My point from the start was that if you believe cetain targets are vaild then why would i not hold mp positions it does not affect me still trading. when you open up a position you all have reasons for doing so. Before somebody comes back at me at says that news/sentiment may change i do not believe so long term.
What i do find is that none of you like to hear success stories that are different to your methods and go against what you believe to be the trading norm. I could also say that i never close a losing posistion but you dont like that either.
I also do not have to sit in front of the laptop for hours on end scalping isn't life grand.
 
I don't see trading only 8% of your account on an idea, waiting months for a 5-10% correction equating to doubling your money in a year. Where's your math logic?
 
I haven't traded futures in years. I suppose the reason you only use 8% of your capital is the huge leverage in futures and how you figure you will double your money.

Not sure on the FTSE but you should check out the pros at stock twits. The sentiment there at the moment is that shorting this market is nuts. Of course, they are speaking of the U.S. markets. Let us say hypothetically speaking, the FTSE never goes back to your call of 5260. Then what?
It's nice that you say it is a valid target but everyone says that when they put on a trade. This is not good enough. You could be wrong and it could never hit that target for years. Then what?
 
Lickyluciano said:
I haven't traded futures in years. I suppose the reason you only use 8% of your capital is the huge leverage in futures and how you figure you will double your money.

Not sure on the FTSE but you should check out the pros at stock twits. The sentiment there at the moment is that shorting this market is nuts. Of course, they are speaking of the U.S. markets. Let us say hypothetically speaking, the FTSE never goes back to your call of 5260. Then what?
It's nice that you say it is a valid target but everyone says that when they put on a trade. This is not good enough. You could be wrong and it could never hit that target for years. Then what?
Click to expand...

He's on December contracts. So the money doubling is happening within 2 months.
 
jeffre4 said:
My point from the start was that if you believe certain targets are valid
Click to expand...

because no trader should 'believe' anything.
a trader's job is to anticipate market direction to the best of his ability, position himself for such a move,
and then either quit quickly if the action proves him wrong, or to take profits if correct
 
jeffre4 said:
wasnt going to come back on and defend myself but here goes.
Supposing i now have 4 positions open all short spread out from 5350 to 5840 which accounts for say 8% of my trading capital none of which are daily it does not hinder me trading daily long or short. i believe that the market will go down to 5660 quite soon which would enable me to close one position off at a profit leaving 3 positions open and making my 3 outstanding positions only 5% of my capital. if i was to take all your advice as you all seem to beieve that the only way is up and close them off i am stili on course to double my money by the year end. granted i am a small stakes player . However i am not going to close them off so watch this space
My point from the start was that if you believe cetain targets are vaild then why would i not hold mp positions it does not affect me still trading. when you open up a position you all have reasons for doing so. Before somebody comes back at me at says that news/sentiment may change i do not believe so long term.
What i do find is that none of you like to hear success stories that are different to your methods and go against what you believe to be the trading norm. I could also say that i never close a losing posistion but you dont like that either.
I also do not have to sit in front of the laptop for hours on end scalping isn't life grand.
Click to expand...

Roulette, double up after a loss.
You'll make your 100% quicker.
This strategy can never lose...... just like yours.
 
before all the sceptics just over my last comment again 100% profitable trades was incorrect i do close trades off if it appears that a fresher target appears which may mean closing one trade at a small loss to receice a larger gainb that is not the same as stop loss but a calculated close. re the maths are round if i am stil making around 2-3 trades a day profitable why can i not still be on track
 
jeffre4 said:
Why does practically everybody put a stop loss on a trade. I believe that it means that you were never confident with the posistion you opened in the first place. If you have done your homework and you believe that whatever you are trading will hit a certain target then you should let run until it does. The companies love stop losses because all you are doing is locking in your losses. How many times do traders say it hit my stop loss then 10mins 1hr 1 day etc it hit my target. Forgive me if this as been discussed before but new to the site.
Click to expand...

Without even a mental stop loss, how do you work out your position size?

Anyway, as long as your happy paying margin calls and telling yourself that losing positions are gonna come back, then good luck to you.
 
Last edited:
jeffre4 said:
What i do find is that none of you like to hear success stories that are different to your methods and go against what you believe to be the trading norm.
Click to expand...

I do, however, agree with this!
 
People who fit brakes to their car clearly aren't confident in their ability to drive.
 
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