Schneider Trading Associates: Graduate Training Program

Alright, I left STA yesterday 'cos I was getting disillusioned with spread trading and was running out of money to go in without income. When I got rinsed out yesterday, thought I'll call it a day. Should have left earlier but was starting to make money and that kept me on for a while more. It probably would have taken me a month or maybe two more before I could start to draw money and it was too close a call.

If there are any questions ppl want to know just fire away.

In terms of income, it really depend on the person and how fast you get clipped up. It also depends quite a lot on the market as well.

What you make from trading, you do need to pay income tax but you can also set up as limited company to pay yourself a lower rate like any self employment.
 
TimYoung said:
Alright, I left STA yesterday 'cos I was getting disillusioned with spread trading and was running out of money to go in without income. When I got rinsed out yesterday, thought I'll call it a day. Should have left earlier but was starting to make money and that kept me on for a while more. It probably would have taken me a month or maybe two more before I could start to draw money and it was too close a call.

If there are any questions ppl want to know just fire away.

In terms of income, it really depend on the person and how fast you get clipped up. It also depends quite a lot on the market as well.

What you make from trading, you do need to pay income tax but you can also set up as limited company to pay yourself a lower rate like any self employment.
Click to expand...

OK, So you finally leave the Schneider. This is good for your career.
I was kicked out in the end of week2(although I got 49/50 top math test) I was very disappoint at that moment. Because I worked really hard and these fxxking people (peter and Michael) don't give me any chance. I hold an MBA degree(I go to Schneider simply because it is too tough to get in any big bank, I am not British and I don't speak English) ,But now I got a part time job in a City big name company and deposit my capital with Dukascopy to swim trade FX. Although I didn't make any serious profit from trading FX at moment and I understand that it need more time and experience.

Did you remember when they said there is a CV damage?

In my opinion, the CV damage is not because of you have worked or trained in a Trading Arcade(I don't think this is big problem, because I know lot of people finish 1 month course and get good job in other company. The CV damage is the time you waste in Schneider!! Employer usually don't want to see the career gap, the more time you have spent in Schneider the bigger gap you have!! If you successfully survived in Schneider and make decent profit , that's great!! But 99%people didn't make it and Schneider's mentor they knew it!! For example, you spent 1 year in Schneider and didn't make it. Oh My God , when they kick you out, what you have learned from this year? Nothing! No transferable skills related to any other job.

The Schneider mentor out there themselves even don't know how to trade to make profit and you hope they can lead you to make profit? If they know how to make money as trader why they spend so much time talk about very basic knowledge that you can find at any book or website but not trading by themselves?

So it is good thing to see you leave Schneider, just move on and find a part time job then open an account with other broker.
 
TimYoung said:
Alright, I left STA yesterday 'cos I was getting disillusioned with spread trading and was running out of money to go in without income. When I got rinsed out yesterday, thought I'll call it a day. Should have left earlier but was starting to make money and that kept me on for a while more. It probably would have taken me a month or maybe two more before I could start to draw money and it was too close a call.

If there are any questions ppl want to know just fire away.

In terms of income, it really depend on the person and how fast you get clipped up. It also depends quite a lot on the market as well.

What you make from trading, you do need to pay income tax but you can also set up as limited company to pay yourself a lower rate like any self employment.
Click to expand...

Sorry to hear that Tim. How many people left from the course?
 
financening said:
OK, So you finally leave the Schneider. This is good for your career.
I was kicked out in the end of week2(although I got 49/50 top math test) I was very disappoint at that moment. Because I worked really hard and these fxxking people (peter and Michael) don't give me any chance. I hold an MBA degree(I go to Schneider simply because it is too tough to get in any big bank, I am not British and I don't speak English) ,But now I got a part time job in a City big name company and deposit my capital with Dukascopy to swim trade FX. Although I didn't make any serious profit from trading FX at moment and I understand that it need more time and experience.

Did you remember when they said there is a CV damage?

In my opinion, the CV damage is not because of you have worked or trained in a Trading Arcade(I don't think this is big problem, because I know lot of people finish 1 month course and get good job in other company. The CV damage is the time you waste in Schneider!! Employer usually don't want to see the career gap, the more time you have spent in Schneider the bigger gap you have!! If you successfully survived in Schneider and make decent profit , that's great!! But 99%people didn't make it and Schneider's mentor they knew it!! For example, you spent 1 year in Schneider and didn't make it. Oh My God , when they kick you out, what you have learned from this year? Nothing! No transferable skills related to any other job.

The Schneider mentor out there themselves even don't know how to trade to make profit and you hope they can lead you to make profit? If they know how to make money as trader why they spend so much time talk about very basic knowledge that you can find at any book or website but not trading by themselves?

So it is good thing to see you leave Schneider, just move on and find a part time job then open an account with other broker.
Click to expand...

Well, I left because I didn't believe in what I was doing primarily and the numbers just didn't add up. Not much to do with career. I never saw STA as a career move rather whether I could make money there.

The thing was when I raised the point about how spread trading sucked in the current market since it was high risk low reward rather than the low risk low reward way of trading, the guy agreed and said something about the Euribor was acting a bit strange.. didn't really get what he was getting at, but even with obvious disadvantages of trading it at the current market, he wouldn't let me do outrights not even when I suggested if I could just do one lot.

When the market is trending/unpredictable the strategy is to make like one or two trades a day and mainly using TA rather than trying to range one tick or half ticks with numerous trades. If it is like that there is zero reason to do spread trading. If I were forced to do spread trading in that market, then I am using a negative EV strategy and having to pay through my nose to do it as well.

He said something about if I was allowed to do it, I would create bad habits for myself or something which was ridiculous. I lost money in my first month and a half trying to trade the spread trading way and had to change my strategy to make money when the market wasn't right for spread trading. If I wasn't able to adapt and only traded on habits, I would have lost money continuously.

In the course, you were taught Market -> You -> £££

When the market is not right for spread trading, I should respond by using a different strategy rather than bang my head against the wall trying to do the same fail strategy over and over again. When the guy was quite equivocal there was no way in a million years I could do outrights... actually not even allowed to leg... arf... that pretty much seal the deal for me. It was easy to wake up like 5am to get to work at 6.30am but as soon as I lost faith in what I was doing, everything became so much harder and I just lost motivation to go in.

Yeah, there were suppose to be a few guys there that was there for ten months and made zero money but just paying their desk fees. Not really sure why anybody would stay for so long.

Like I said, I think spread trading have it uses in certain market conditions but as my only means of trading? No way. I really can't see why they can't be more flexible about it. What is the difference in how I make money as long as I make money there? Don't understand that.
 
Arbu said:
Sorry to hear that Tim. How many people left from the course?
Click to expand...

Neah, no biggie. Knew the risk involved when I started. Probably stayed just a month longer than I should have done 'cos I was starting to make money and didn't want to waste the time I had already spent there.

On my course, there were 32 people and think about 12 people got on it. 10 on my floor and 2 on the fourth floor. One got kicked and another left 'cos he found a job. So with me gone 7 left after three months.
 
TimYoung said:
Neah, no biggie. Knew the risk involved when I started. Probably stayed just a month longer than I should have done 'cos I was starting to make money and didn't want to waste the time I had already spent there.

On my course, there were 32 people and think about 12 people got on it. 10 on my floor and 2 on the fourth floor. One got kicked and another left 'cos he found a job. So with me gone 7 left after three months.
Click to expand...

7/32 that is a pretty good result I would say.
 
Yeah, there were suppose to be a few guys there that was there for ten months and made zero money but just paying their desk fees. Not really sure why anybody would stay for so long.

I guess may be these gays love to trade spread. Otherwise they have no place to go.

Pay the desk fee and commission as well that is how schneider make profit
 
Been at Schneider for 'coming-on-to' 3 weeks now. Trading is great, love it a lot. Been trading the Bund/Bobl/Schatz, and now this working going onto Oil Trading (Light Sweet Crude)

Riveting stuff and have been looking over the contract. Going to go for it.
 
Anyway, going to get my head down and enjoy the fun. If anyone from my class reads this post then chin up and see you soon fellow
 
the most common ratio for crack I think is 3-2-1, but all the contracts are not quoted by the same amount (like per gallon instead of per barrel, iirc. that can catch you out). It's not a fly though, it's long 3(crude), short the 2 (RBOB) and the 1 (fuel oil).

dunno bout cushing mind
 
good cos thats about everything I know about energies. IEA, EIA inventories maybe. Platts estimates are noteworthy for those.
 
Xylem said:
Ive done the course and was not impressed...

I advise new ppl still to do it just for the experience but dont waste money on their reading lists or anything else.

They dont teach you how to trade they teach you how to use their platforms.

Any profitable firm should have some idea on a strategy that makes money, these jokers never provided 1 to us.

Curious to know if any1 from my course is still there?
We started on Sept 4 or 6th... We had a guy called Nonde who was kicked out on the second day?
Click to expand...


I personally think Schneider offers a good deal for newbies, and its no different than many commission only programs in New York's financial district. The fact that you get free trading and the potential to trade someone else's money and prove yourself, is a good deal. Its also a good practice point. But one month training to become a "good" trader? A bit unrealistic.

However, you do have a good point. For Schneider to maximize their benefit from taking on new people they should naturally teach them to become profitable. Its their own loss if they don't. They may lose out on finding real talent by limited training. Makes no sense to me but if that's their business model, who am I to argue. Maybe this is the reason why so many prop firms go bust?

I think Marty Schwartz started as a scalp trader and then became a financial analyst (or the other way around). His profit curve was limited, yet when he went private he ended being one of the world's best traders.
 
I think STA is a joke.

They rely on so-called graduates and newbies to act as liquidity monkeys thereby lining their pockets when it comes to rebates and commissions.

They also want you to pay exorbitant desk costs you can easily avoid ... its all about plugging and selling their products. If any "graduate" or new trader on their program wants to know how they can do what they're currently doing for less give me a shout.

PS I used to be on their program so I know what I'm talking about.
 
Is it true that the top earners at STA aren't actually spread traders but outright scalpers? I read that on this forum somewhere and wondered if it was true.

Thanks.
 
Been there, left after 1 day, so could not say much about it. I left for personal reasons, could not pay to sit in a room to trade(Same products can be traded with an IB account from the comfort of a couch) something I never traded and could not find an edge on it(yet). The place was really only interested in trading "discretionary" on those products alone, esotherics, rumours in my oppinion. But for those beginning traders wishing to gain some insight, I'd advise it but with such a limited experience with them I will only say "what's the harm?". As with any contracts you sign, you'd better read that stuff before you find out you donated a kidney or such.
P.S. : When I was in London, could not open a bank account to receive funds from my trading account(US), or my bank account(RO).Was the only solution to walk/fly around with money?!
Best regards, Adrian
 
evermore said:
P.S. : When I was in London, could not open a bank account to receive funds from my trading account(US), or my bank account(RO).Was the only solution to walk/fly around with money?!
Click to expand...

I'm afraid that a lot of foreigners report the same problems in this country. The legislators' intention is to make life difficult for money-launderers but it seems that either they don't think or aren't bothered about the effects that their regulations have on ordinary people.
 
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