Quality rebuttal versus trading gurus such as James 16

[Black Swan]

Personally I'm stunned by the intensity and number responses to criticising somebody off the internet.

This Jim16 might be a nice chap and good trader but frankly, why does anybody really give a ****? It is after all, just the internet.

I don't see it as being particularly subjective towards an anonamous individual, (thought I'd share the post made on FF), moreover it's a bit of lulz aimed in the general direction of educators/gurus and their *methods*...

 

[pboyles]

I coded them for PRT a while back, it was pretty simple but unfortunately I no longer have the code. If you plot the pivots you can go through manually and see how the PINs would or would not gave worked. There will only be a few trades per instrument per week.

By the way all of the above refers to futures, no FX and never on a spreadbet account. Try either of those and it's guaranteed to lose.

 

[robster970]

I don't see it as being particularly subjective towards an anonamous individual, (thought I'd share the post made on FF), moreover it's a bit of lulz aimed in the general direction of educators/gurus and their *methods*...

Sorry I wasn't being a bit more clear man - the giving a **** part is the fact that so many people care about these people that are on pedestals. I agree with your sentiment wholeheartedly.

 

[robster970]

You guys have really no idea what your talking about, if you are at all interested you'll need to go learn what he's all about, there is also plenty of guys that trade this stuff that will help anyone wanting to learn.

I don't need the help but thanks for the offer

 

[glyder]

rah rah,

Whilst I agree with you re the J16 stuff, maybe you are a bit new here, you have to be fair. Many of the guys here you are referring to are experienced traders and do know their stuff, its just different style of stuff to what you may trade.
Most people only need one or two 'systems methods' that work for them. Not everyone need to be a J16 trader. Don't mean that they need to knock his methods either. To be honest, from my point of view all methods are different ways of looking at the same data and aiming for the same result.

You guys have really no idea what your talking about, if you are at all interested you'll need to go learn what he's all about, there is also plenty of guys that trade this stuff that will help anyone wanting to learn.

But if you are looking for a system with a exact set of rules that you do everytime then his stuff won't be for u.

If you want learn how to trade all different market conditions, then go check it out, but dont' expect to learn it in 5 mins, and no, it's not all about pinbars, pinbars is a small part of what they teach.

ANyway, i'm sure this is falling on deaf ears, so whatever.

EDIT: If you need help getting moving at a faster rate, look for Mike, or Jarroo, or Ghous, esp mike he really kicks ass and is a great help, with any kind of trading.

And of course James.

 

[squall321]

Personally I'm stunned by the intensity and number responses to criticising somebody off the internet.

This Jim16 might be a nice chap and good trader but frankly, why does anybody really give a ****? It is after all, just the internet.

dramaaaaa innit

if people want to pay money for old rope then there's no point stopping them

and they say "it's all for free on the free thread" but that's like saying television is free because no one forces anyone to buy from adverts. if 100 people see the free thread, 3 might join the group for $129 then thats a churn of 3%, as long as people come to the free thread the money will keep coming. its a numbers game

 

[robster970]

dramaaaaa innit

if people want to pay money for old rope then there's no point stopping them

I suppose it gives some people hope.

 

[advfntrader]

the Stuff J16 teaches WORKS and it works on ANY timeframe. It may not be new but it has certainly turned my trading around and thats just the free thread.

 

[meanreversion]

I coded them for PRT a while back, it was pretty simple but unfortunately I no longer have the code. If you plot the pivots you can go through manually and see how the PINs would or would not gave worked. There will only be a few trades per instrument per week.

By the way all of the above refers to futures, no FX and never on a spreadbet account. Try either of those and it's guaranteed to lose.

Hmmm.. I'm not familiar with either pivots or pin bars but I'm going to take a look.. the pivots look interesting and coding them should be straightforward.

 

[robster970]

the Stuff J16 teaches WORKS and it works on ANY timeframe. It may not be new but it has certainly turned my trading around and thats just the free thread.

I'm genuinely pleased that you're trading has turned a corner - I sincereley mean that.

Kimo'sabby advised me some time ago 'What gets you in, gets you out'. That single statement nailed my consistency problem for me in a moment of clarity.

I don't evangelise Kimo'sabby and his teachings, although I'm sure he'd have quite a laugh about it if I did.

Can you see that there is a difference between taking information that is of value TO YOU from the internet vs putting the author on a pedestal?

I think it's all projection in a psychological sense, which when it comes to trading is probably not a healthy thing.

 

[Black Swan]

Sorry I wasn't being a bit more clear man - the giving a **** part is the fact that so many people care about these people that are on pedestals. I agree with your sentiment wholeheartedly.

tbh there is I reckon a bit of green eye at work.."5hit!! 100 dollars a mug, if you get 600 of 'em that's loads of money..." hence we see the emergence of one or two "Yes sirree this is the new improved snake-oil.." type posters on the journal sections etc each week..

You know the pitch by now, they suddenly find T2W inside the last six months, (bit odd that after apparently being successful traders since the birth of the interweb they only find one of the first trader sites in the last six months), and they all want want to *share*, they're on a mission to help newbies..then it starts,

The odd mention of the tw@tter account, the new forum they've created...'kin saddos...
But they'll never reach the critical mass of punters the Jackos and James have built up and crashed and burned from years back, the ship has sailed and yes they may find a new dock and get a half full ship of fools to sail again, but it's unlikely...good lulz though eh?

 

[Black Swan]

I'm genuinely pleased that you're trading has turned a corner - I sincereley mean that.

Kimo'sabby advised me some time ago 'What gets you in, gets you out'. That single statement nailed my consistency problem for me in a moment of clarity.

D'ya know, if more simply stuck to that basic rule (particularly day trading forex) then they'd prolly be net positive nearly every trading day..and I include myself in that group as the attention/distraction meter has been off the scale today..

 

[robster970]

D'ya know, if more simply stuck to that basic rule (particularly day trading forex) then they'd prolly be net positive nearly every trading day..and I include myself in that group as the attention/distraction meter has been off the scale today..

Yep. In one foul swoop that nailed stunningly good entries which were being murdered by mixed timeframes and poor exits.

I'm waiting today. Suspect it might be a quiet one for me hence the higher than usual amount of posting.

 

[trader_dante]

Re: Quality rebutall versus trading gurus such as James 16

Here's an interesting snippet, which is related....



So - Trader_Dante was taught by James16 and started the epic pin bar thread that people quote to this day and....

he doesn't use pin bars !

I actually covered that almost 9 months ago: http://www.trade2win.com/boards/fir...reasing-trader-performance-5.html#post1031896 (paragraph 5).

But don't let that little oversight get in the way of some good lulz ;-)

 

[Trader333]

if people want to pay money for old rope then there's no point stopping them

Someone tried this on eBay and it did get sold with several bids proving that people literally will pay money for old rope.


Paul

 

[Shakone]

Overall I quite like James16's stuff. The free video 'rants and charts' was useful to me. I don't know whether he can trade or not, and I agree with quite a lot that is here in this thread and in the opening post.

One of the things that I don't like about James16 materials is that the risk reward is usually very bad. I saw another video, and it said that he didn't really care about risk reward, would take partial profits at the first trouble area, could be 30-50 pips, whereas his initial stop was a the length of a daily bar 100-150 pips. This rang a few alarm bells.

I also agree with meanreversion (I think it was him at least). This gives you an ok entry, and a reasonable place to put your stop. How you manage it from there will make all the difference, and that isn't covered very well.

 

[meanreversion]

Overall I quite like James16's stuff. The free video 'rants and charts' was useful to me. I don't know whether he can trade or not, and I agree with quite a lot that is here in this thread and in the opening post.

One of the things that I don't like about James16 materials is that the risk reward is usually very bad. I saw another video, and it said that he didn't really care about risk reward, would take partial profits at the first trouble area, could be 30-50 pips, whereas his initial stop was a the length of a daily bar 100-150 pips. This rang a few alarm bells.

I also agree with meanreversion (I think it was him at least). This gives you an ok entry, and a reasonable place to put your stop. How you manage it from there will make all the difference, and that isn't covered very well.

The easiest way to get your win percentage up is to move your stops out and your take profits in, which is what you reference here.

I have to say, I've learned quite a bit from reading this thread, I had no idea that guru-dom was such a large industry. Furthermore, it arouses some fairly extreme emotions in people, not dissimilar to religion.

 

[meanreversion]

Someone tried this on eBay and it did get sold with several bids proving that people literally will pay money for old rope.


Paul

If Apple announced it was selling iRope, there would be a line of 500 people outside each of their stores the next day.

 

[arabianights]

I don't evangelise Kimo'sabby and his teachings.

I do.

 

[DionysusToast]

If Apple announced it was selling iRope, there would be a line of 500 people outside each of their stores the next day.

Don't be silly, I have a Mac, iPhone, 3 iPods and an iPad touch and I wouldn't buy an iRope if they brought one out now.

I'd wait for the 4g version.