Fear of missing out

[FXX]

Good watch as part of your ongoing education, especially those who don't understand inflation and fiat and who is doing what to who.

With fiat money the government can control the flow of money and thereby able to deal with economic cycles. If fiat money goes then how are economic cycles going to be controlled? Furthermore, who is going to guarantee individual savings accounts if for example someone gets hacked and their life savings is stolen. If a government needs to lend money to meet its obligations, how does it raise money without being able to provide a guarantee to lenders making their credit rating system, one which forms the basis of nearly all investments, rendered useless. How also does credit work because fiat money uses credit to increase the money flow. If I lend from institution ABC can they then lend out more money based on a ratio of deposits? Who also controls the amount of money in the system?

So please do elaborate how some of these critical elements of the economic system are going to be solved? Please don't provide an answer such as "it will be sorted out" or "a new system will develop" because I am pretty confident nobody is going to be willing to start a new system that would require every aspect of it being redesigned.

Have you even thought about this or is the prospect of unlimited riches blinding you?

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[Brumby]

With fiat money the government can control the flow of money and thereby able to deal with economic cycles. If fiat money goes then how are economic cycles going to be controlled? Furthermore, who is going to guarantee individual savings accounts if for example someone gets hacked and their life savings is stolen. If a government needs to lend money to meet its obligations, how does it raise money without being able to provide a guarantee to lenders making their credit rating system, one which forms the basis of nearly all investments, rendered useless. How also does credit work because fiat money uses credit to increase the money flow. If I lend from institution ABC can they then lend out more money based on a ratio of deposits? Who also controls the amount of money in the system?

So please do elaborate how some of these critical elements of the economic system are going to be solved? Please don't provide an answer such as "it will be sorted out" or "a new system will develop" because I am pretty confident nobody is going to be willing to start a new system that would require every aspect of it being redesigned.

Have you even thought about this or is the prospect of unlimited riches blinding you?

Confirmation bias and herd mentality in play.

If people wish to speculate then speculate with a trade plan. There are no fundamentals because it is all hype once the one dimensional and shallow arguments are exposed.

A functioning currency only works in conjunction with a functioning government that provides security, law and order. It is the foundation of an orderly and civil society. Cryptocurrency will not work outside an orderly system. The notion that somehow it can operate independently and in an orderly manner is simply delusional.

 

[Garvo]

Ok, THIS IS a bullish market!

 

[Quantt]

I love me my FIAT money!

 

[Pat494]

It looks like the block chain coins have been overtaken with a new type of coin system. One of these is called IOTA. It has many advantages.

 

[FXX]

If governments can't control cryptocurrencies and harness the technology, they will destroy them, Jeffrey Gundlach said in a CNBC interview Wednesday.

The bond fund manager said Bitcoin technology could ultimately backfire against anti-government proponents because it may give the government a way to track payments and funds.

"The government will be able to particularly able to control it," he said, adding that he believes some of the key technology was developed by the NSA.

"Governments will fight tooth and nail to suppress it," Gundlach said. "There is a complete inconsistency between cryptocurrency and a world of nation-states,"


Forexlive (he manages over 100bln in assets)

 

[counter_violent]

If governments can't control cryptocurrencies and harness the technology, they will destroy them, Jeffrey Gundlach said in a CNBC interview Wednesday.

The bond fund manager said Bitcoin technology could ultimately backfire against anti-government proponents because it may give the government a way to track payments and funds.

"The government will be able to particularly able to control it," he said, adding that he believes some of the key technology was developed by the NSA.

"Governments will fight tooth and nail to suppress it," Gundlach said. "There is a complete inconsistency between cryptocurrency and a world of nation-states,"


Forexlive (he manages over 100bln in assets)

Yeah he should be particularly worried.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/bond-market-moment-of-truth-gundlach-2017-10?r=US&IR=T

 

[FXX]

Yeah he should be particularly worried.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/bond-market-moment-of-truth-gundlach-2017-10?r=US&IR=T

He was referring to cryptos, not the bond market.

 

[counter_violent]

He was referring to cryptos, not the bond market.

That's why he's worried. Anyone with a vested interest should be.

 

[FXX]

That's why he's worried. Anyone with a vested interest should be.

Doubtful. Anyone with half a brain understands crypto currencies are never going to replace fiat. Anyone who believes crypto will replace fiat are firmly placed in the conspiracy camp. What's your call sign? They all have one with a pet website project and YouTube channel.

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[darktone]

With fiat money the government can control the flow of money and thereby able to deal with economic cycles. If fiat money goes then how are economic cycles going to be controlled? Furthermore, who is going to guarantee individual savings accounts if for example someone gets hacked and their life savings is stolen. If a government needs to lend money to meet its obligations, how does it raise money without being able to provide a guarantee to lenders making their credit rating system, one which forms the basis of nearly all investments, rendered useless. How also does credit work because fiat money uses credit to increase the money flow. If I lend from institution ABC can they then lend out more money based on a ratio of deposits? Who also controls the amount of money in the system?

So please do elaborate how some of these critical elements of the economic system are going to be solved? Please don't provide an answer such as "it will be sorted out" or "a new system will develop" because I am pretty confident nobody is going to be willing to start a new system that would require every aspect of it being redesigned.

Have you even thought about this or is the prospect of unlimited riches blinding you?

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

"With fiat money the government can control the flow of money and thereby able to deal with economic cycles."
Are you sure about that? I didnt think government has much control over our money in any significant way.

"How also does credit work because fiat money uses credit to increase the money flow."
Im lost there too tbh.

"If I lend from institution ABC can they then lend out more money based on a ratio of deposits?"
I didnt think that lending depended much on deposits. In fact I thought deposits are created by borrowing.
Who really has control of and creates our money? and who gets to allocate where its first spent?

 

[Quantt]

"With fiat money the government can control the flow of money and thereby able to deal with economic cycles."
Are you sure about that? I didnt think government has much control over our money in any significant way.

"How also does credit work because fiat money uses credit to increase the money flow."
Im lost there too tbh.

"If I lend from institution ABC can they then lend out more money based on a ratio of deposits?"
I didnt think that lending depended much on deposits. In fact I thought deposits are created by borrowing.
Who really has control of and creates our money? and who gets to allocate where its first spent?

Oh, the Fed/Central banks have all the control with the interest rate. Lending by the banks depends on a ratio connected to the deposits and regulated by the government. The democratically elected government decides where to spend the money.

Even tough I am bit of anarchist, I like this model and I don't want the crypto voting model where the more coins you have, the more votes you get, the feudalism died long time ago in the western world...

 

[FXX]

"With fiat money the government can control the flow of money and thereby able to deal with economic cycles."
Are you sure about that? I didnt think government has much control over our money in any significant way.

"How also does credit work because fiat money uses credit to increase the money flow."
Im lost there too tbh.

"If I lend from institution ABC can they then lend out more money based on a ratio of deposits?"
I didnt think that lending depended much on deposits. In fact I thought deposits are created by borrowing.
Who really has control of and creates our money? and who gets to allocate where its first spent?

The government has the sole right to print money. It also controls money in the system through various mechanisms including rates, reserve ratios, open market operations, discount window and QE (there are more but less widely used). They essentially control how much money the system has, how much it costs, how much banks can lend out. How exactly do you see the government not having much control over money?


Lending depends on deposits or reserve ratios. Approximately 97percent of money is created by commercial banks (only 3 percent by the central bank) and this is where the reserve ratio comes in. In the USA it's 3 percent so if counter_violent deposits 100k into an account there, the bank only has to keep 3k and can use the rest for new loans.



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[counter_violent]

Who gives these people permission to create money out of thin air?

Certainly not me and the momentum is with my side.
As more and more people realise what's going on and why they are becoming poorer through money printing and inflation theft whilst earnings stagnate, then the revolution gathers pace.

 

[FXX]

Who gives these people permission to create money out of thin air?

Certainly not me and the momentum is with my side.[emoji106]
As more and more people realise what's going on and why they are becoming poorer through money printing and inflation theft whilst earnings stagnate, then the revolution gathers pace.

The government who you elect does. I know you think of it as a ponzi scheme but it's there to accommodate economic and population growth. They did away with the gold standard for this very reason (they didn't have enough gold to back it). How can you use a currency associated with a fixed amount and cater for economic and population growth? How exactly to you envisage this working in crypto currencies?


People becoming poor has nothing to do with money printing. People were poor when the gold standard was active!

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[FXX]

Here is a silly example of how ridiculous you sound complaining about how money is crated.

There are 10 people on a planet and they all have 100 hypothetical dollars each. Over time they buy and sell from each other and everyone is happy. Now all of these people get together and make babies and now there are 15 people on the planet. Now there is approximately 66 hypothetical dollars per person.

Can you see where this is going or am I just trying to persuade an Eskimo that my ice is better than his and he should buy it?

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[darktone]

The government has the sole right to print money. It also controls money in the system through various mechanisms including rates, reserve ratios, open market operations, discount window and QE (there are more but less widely used). They essentially control how much money the system has, how much it costs, how much banks can lend out. How exactly do you see the government not having much control over money?


Lending depends on deposits or reserve ratios. Approximately 97percent of money is created by commercial banks (only 3 percent by the central bank) and this is where the reserve ratio comes in. In the USA it's 3 percent so if counter_violent deposits 100k into an account there, the bank only has to keep 3k and can use the rest for new loans.



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Woha, theres a lot of technical terms in there, reserve ratios, open market operations, discount window etc, bit overwhelming tbh . Its I remember seeing a few videos a while back that suggested that loans do fact create deposits, and although the government/sovereign does have the sole right to print money, it actually doesnt. Im sure I also remember seeing somewhere that lending, or the quantity of wide money doesnt depend on reserves as described in some economics textbooks.

Im still a bit confused by some of your comments tbh

 

[counter_violent]

He is trying to describe fractional reserve banking, where new money can magically be created and lent out based on some ratio of money on deposit, population increase, asset increase or any combination thereof.

Which is totally different to the money that has been created in the name of QE. Basically this means turning on the printing presses and creating whatever sum is required to stop the system from collapsing. This is fine for a little while and for as long as those in charge can get away with it , because the population as a whole understands none of it. But at some point, they all wake up and ask awkward questions of the elites. QE does not follow any logical ratio of increase. It is just printed and created from nothing as required by govt.

Unfettered money printing eventually leads to inflation and eventually hyperinflation. Money becomes worth less. This is theft by dilution of everyone else's money. Government does not have money, they are tax collectors and spenders of other people's money. Government is allowed to spend more money than they collect in, this is called deficit. Government are allowed to carry on raising not only the deficit, but also the accumulated debt.

Cryptos are all about taking back control from those who got us into this mess, namely bankers and govt's. Cryptos are about sharing any wealth creation amongst users and not about elites skimming off the top at every opportunity.

 

[FXX]

Woha, theres a lot of technical terms in there, reserve ratios, open market operations, discount window etc, bit overwhelming tbh . Its I remember seeing a few videos a while back that suggested that loans do fact create deposits, and although the government/sovereign does have the sole right to print money, it actually doesnt. Im sure I also remember seeing somewhere that lending, or the quantity of wide money doesnt depend on reserves as described in some economics textbooks.

Im still a bit confused by some of your comments tbh

Yes loans create deposits. If I lend money from bank A, then that gets marked as a deposit on my account. Printing money and creating money are dissimilar. A better way to describe it -
The government has the right to create money, and it also issues that right in the form of a banking license. The government however has the sole right to print money on paper and stamp coins.

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[FXX]

because the population as a whole understands none of it.

You said it

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