Doesn't matter what Marty Schwartz did. It's you that has to do it. There are plenty who say that they can do these percentages and better. Neither you, nor I, know whether their statements are true. I have to be content with what I can do and try to improve on it. Telling you guys is not going to make me any better.
Day traders making 50+% returns per month lets talk money managment
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Doesn't matter what Marty Schwartz did. It's you that has to do it. There are plenty who say that they can do these percentages and better. Neither you, nor I, know whether their statements are true. I have to be content with what I can do and try to improve on it. Telling you guys is not going to make me any better.
B
Black Swan
Day traders making 50+% returns per month lets talk money management
Why, does MM make you 50% per month? If you do 1% a day (most days) you are Da Man..
Why, does MM make you 50% per month? If you do 1% a day (most days) you are Da Man..
SpiritBeing
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EXACTLY...i started this post to talk to people of a similar mindset...not fend off haters!
Im not trying to make anyone believe me...like i keep repeating....only time will tell.
I mentioned Marty as an example only.
Spiritbeing, which broker/instrument do you plan to use for your actual live trades?
I'm not saying your objectives cant be acheived but I'll just let you know what I've seen in my 6 years of trading and having seen the performances and trading statements of perhaps 3,000+ other traders (seen due to my nature of business).
I would guess about 5% are long term profitable. Ive NEVER seen any of these successful traders do more than say 300% in a year (sample of more than 3000 retail/pro/institutional clients). Most of the long term successful guys will do under 100% return.
ALL the traders I've seen make much larger gains have blown up within 6 months.
But as you say, your max draw down for the day is 6%. Thats still quite a lot in my view. Sure, you wont hit 18 losing days in a row (I'm not sure why you took 18 though as this number isnt actually relevant) but as you know the law of small numbers is going to hurt you if you hit a losing streak early in your live trading. Good luck tho, Im not a hater, just believe (mostly) what I see.
Back to my first question...
Spiritbeing, which broker/instrument do you plan to use for your actual live trades?
and what is your account size btw?
t30
I'm not saying your objectives cant be acheived but I'll just let you know what I've seen in my 6 years of trading and having seen the performances and trading statements of perhaps 3,000+ other traders (seen due to my nature of business).
I would guess about 5% are long term profitable. Ive NEVER seen any of these successful traders do more than say 300% in a year (sample of more than 3000 retail/pro/institutional clients). Most of the long term successful guys will do under 100% return.
ALL the traders I've seen make much larger gains have blown up within 6 months.
But as you say, your max draw down for the day is 6%. Thats still quite a lot in my view. Sure, you wont hit 18 losing days in a row (I'm not sure why you took 18 though as this number isnt actually relevant) but as you know the law of small numbers is going to hurt you if you hit a losing streak early in your live trading. Good luck tho, Im not a hater, just believe (mostly) what I see.
Back to my first question...
Spiritbeing, which broker/instrument do you plan to use for your actual live trades?
and what is your account size btw?
t30
We all know full well their statements are false. If they were true who would be counterparty to their trades?
edit: And dont try and foist some BS about the Fx market being X gajjilion per day.
Sorry. I thought that you were trying to impress me with all those percentages.
yes, lets let time tell..
What all these guys here are telling you is we see claims from newbies stating this sort of stuff and the majority of them fail...
30 days paper trading is nothing
you won't lose 6% 18 days in a row, but you may have 2 losing days, then 1 win, then 2 more losing, then 2 wins, then 3 losing, etc... see the trend yet...?
Any way best of luck trying this live, and come back in 6 months and tell all these guys how you did...!
nunrgguy
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50% in a month very doable, month on month? C'mon
!
Also depends on how you trade and how you do your calculations.
Are you more of a position trader with a long term plan i.e. trading off price extremes initially with small positions then when they turn good agressively pushing the position with the market's money or are you a scalper/day trader trading in and out?
50-100% on one trade with only 2% initial risk using low leverage definitely achievable but requires patience, planning and balls of steel and you have to be prepared for it to come to nothing if the market comes back to your average price. It's not a nice feeling to see days of planning and waiting and a large unrealised profit come to nothing, but that is where the big money is and personally I've experienced worse.
Trading the other way, I find even harder: HUGE focus on entry whereas if you're trading a position the only entry that needs to be perfect is the first one. Even if it's something that has been back tested to death, manually, as you would trade it live and you KNOW you can do it, it's another thing sitting through 5 losing trades in a couple of days and watching your life savings disintegrate before your very eyes, the mind is a funny old thing.
Real-life risk tolerance and initial perceived risk tolerance are two very different beasts. Ultimately it comes down to you have to be trading small enough that you don't give a sh1t about the money.
Sitting there watching price go against you and seeing 30% of your account wiped out in a couple of minutes is not a nice feeling, did your child just die?? Maybe I over dramatise but it does feel like that, it's not just a logical response, there's an emotional one too. PURE FEAR. We've all done it and hopefully learned from it.
Can I change my nic to 'Random?'
!Also depends on how you trade and how you do your calculations.
Are you more of a position trader with a long term plan i.e. trading off price extremes initially with small positions then when they turn good agressively pushing the position with the market's money or are you a scalper/day trader trading in and out?
50-100% on one trade with only 2% initial risk using low leverage definitely achievable but requires patience, planning and balls of steel and you have to be prepared for it to come to nothing if the market comes back to your average price. It's not a nice feeling to see days of planning and waiting and a large unrealised profit come to nothing, but that is where the big money is and personally I've experienced worse.
Trading the other way, I find even harder: HUGE focus on entry whereas if you're trading a position the only entry that needs to be perfect is the first one. Even if it's something that has been back tested to death, manually, as you would trade it live and you KNOW you can do it, it's another thing sitting through 5 losing trades in a couple of days and watching your life savings disintegrate before your very eyes, the mind is a funny old thing.
Real-life risk tolerance and initial perceived risk tolerance are two very different beasts. Ultimately it comes down to you have to be trading small enough that you don't give a sh1t about the money.
Sitting there watching price go against you and seeing 30% of your account wiped out in a couple of minutes is not a nice feeling, did your child just die?? Maybe I over dramatise but it does feel like that, it's not just a logical response, there's an emotional one too. PURE FEAR. We've all done it and hopefully learned from it.
Can I change my nic to 'Random?'
SpiritBeing
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THANK YOU FOR YOUR HONEST & PRODUCTIVE COMENTS
I am looking to use Velocity futures until my account gets to $20000 and then move to Prospreads.
My starting balance will be $10,000
I will be trading:
mini gold ($5 per pip per contract)
mini oil ($5 per pip per contract)
gbp/usd ($6.25 per pip per contract)
eur7usd mini ($6.25 per pip per contract)
I have been trading for 6 YEARS also. I didnt think i would get to this point either, I was happy to take whatever the markets give me...i was just happy to trade.
It just happens that i can make this level of return. Im sure by what I have said you can see im not completely mad....there is method to the madness
çHere is a point..........
This is an example..
There are alot of trading firms that allow you to pay roughly $5000 and they teach you how to trade. Now im not saying they are all legit but i know guys who have paid and the strategies and techniques the companies were teaching just happens to suit their personalities and they started with roughly $3-4k and they have made double money before in a month on a few occassions. Obviously each persons approach is different and only the acceptional do it regularly but call up wall street and companies will happily confirm there are guys doing it out there!
I HAVE NEVER PAID FOR ANY COURSE TO TEACH ME HOW TO TRADE....ALL MY TECHNIQUES ARE PERSONALLY DERIVED!
ANYWAY.....
My point is, i have found a way to be consistent and I have traded everything under the sun. I have looked at every approach to the market and now im ready.
The highest bank roll i have traded is $200,000 in the past(3 years ago) and I made over 100% in 6 months!...WITHOUT EXCESSIVE RISK!
Dont ask where that money is gone!.....It wasnt lost trading btw!
SpiritBeing
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thats cool
SpiritBeing
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I will....let you know
Yes i could have a streak like you said....but again.....IF I FALL HALF WAY BETWEEN THE LOSING STREAK YOU SHOWED AND MY 600 TRADES I HAVE TAKEN THEN I WILL STILL BE A VERY RICH MAN
I have full confidence in myself because to me the only question is can i keep hitting winners?...and statistically if you keep punting trades you have just as much chance of the trade wininning big as you do geting a loss.....people forget this fact all to often and take action in the market personally!.....I DONT :cheesy:
SpiritBeing
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50% in a month very doable, month on month? C'mon
Also depends on how you trade and how you do your calculations.
Are you more of a position trader with a long term plan i.e. trading off price extremes initially with small positions then when they turn good agressively pushing the position with the market's money or are you a scalper/day trader trading in and out?
50-100% on one trade with only 2% initial risk using low leverage definitely achievable but requires patience, planning and balls of steel and you have to be prepared for it to come to nothing if the market comes back to your average price. It's not a nice feeling to see days of planning and waiting and a large unrealised profit come to nothing, but that is where the big money is and personally I've experienced worse.
Trading the other way, I find even harder: HUGE focus on entry whereas if you're trading a position the only entry that needs to be perfect is the first one. Even if it's something that has been back tested to death, manually, as you would trade it live and you KNOW you can do it, it's another thing sitting through 5 losing trades in a couple of days and watching your life savings disintegrate before your very eyes, the mind is a funny old thing.
Real-life risk tolerance and initial perceived risk tolerance are two very different beasts. Ultimately it comes down to you have to be trading small enough that you don't give a sh1t about the money.
Sitting there watching price go against you and seeing 30% of your account wiped out in a couple of minutes is not a nice feeling, did your child just die?? Maybe I over dramatise but it does feel like that, it's not just a logical response, there's an emotional one too. PURE FEAR. We've all done it and hopefully learned from it.
Can I change my nic to 'Random?'
HELLO PAL
I have been in the position down 30% and chewing my own face off!
So i know eactly what you mean...and im all to aware that we are all treding water as traders.....we are always sinking before we swim....thats why in these posts I have detailed mainly about losing and I fully understand my parameters....
I know 30 days trading seems short but 6 years of studying and trading many other forms is NOT short!
in that 30 days i took over 600 trades and continue to take trades!...with success!
My entries are not important....66-80%% of my trades lose.....its the fact i maximise my gains is why i make money...
You are right though...with this technique you can give back significant profits and you do everyday!.........
im glad you made this point independantly because it confirms my claims of having trades that lose me only the cost of trading and slippage(It starts to validate my claims even though validation is redundant)...these are the trades that were hugely in the money but came back to my entry price!.... I exit trades like a trend follower!
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SpiritBeing
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SpiritBeing
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This is a scalable method!....my strategy makes between 50-100% per month.
I compound my money everytime i double my money.
eg.....1 contract at $10k, 2 contracts at $20k, 4 contracts at $40k etc.......
This way..although im trading pips...it allows me trade a fixed fraction trading strategy that is scalable...at a compounded rate of 100%.
I will maximise the scalability once i get to $2m and then forever look to make 50%-100%($1m-$2m) every month. ..
Thats the plan anyway...WHETHER YOU THINK IM CRAZY OR NOT!
Read the history of the post and you will see my approach depends hugely on being able to compound!
I dont agree with non-scalable methods to.....i think if a stratgegy isnt scalable then there must be something wrong...if you chose not to scale then thats fine, but in essence every system with a positive expectancy must have the ability to compound eventually.
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Mr. Charts
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SpiritBeing,
Don't talk about it, just do it.
There are plenty of "haters" on t2w, but I've got to tell you, none of them have posted yet ! LOL
Good trading to you and hang on to that optimism.
Don't talk about it, just do it.
There are plenty of "haters" on t2w, but I've got to tell you, none of them have posted yet ! LOL
Good trading to you and hang on to that optimism.
the hare
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This is a serious question, why stop at 2M ?
Dont get me wrong, 1-2M a month is better than working at maccy D's but why limit yourself ? Will the strategy scale above that level ?
SpiritBeing
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No....Unfortunately it will not.
Because....when i get to this level my money management says to trade 100 contracts. With the way i enter and exit my trades then keeping my slippage managable becomes adverse above 100 contracts. Too much above this level and profitability arodes away!
Im 100% sure my strategy will evolve and adapt over time...Im a very open minded person and I adopt what work not just what suits me!....
IN FACT....I would be disappointed if in a few years my trading hadnt evolved or got better!
Plus I have an EOD strategy that can make TRIPLE digit returns on a regular basis and i can handle hundreds of millions..even billions with my EOD strategy. So once I max out my day trading method I will EOD trade the excess funds....then open a Hedge Fund..but this is all in the distant future...I have work to do for now
