Best Thread Capital Spreads

[kwickwool]

Yes guys we are talking about the same things, I am saying that whatever is not balanced or hedged on a winning trade they lose so are they going to set things up for a short term profitable trader to work well, no they are not?

Think of this analagy which i think sums up SB's. They are to the trading world what hotel gyms are to the fitness world. You can go to the hotel gym, do some cycling, running etc on a machine, build up your fitness etc and do feel nice and relaxed and it provides a purpose to your catagory of fitness requirements as in wrapped in cotton wool. So they do have a purpose in the financial world.

If you are a serious runner or cyclist you would never use the hotel gym for your training as is not good enough or professional enough to fit your needs?

So I am saying that SB has a market and rightly so, but any real trader would not near them for all the obvious reasons, the same as a serious athlete would not use a hotel gym to train in?

 

[Shakone]

Said this before but a bit like stating you get wet going for a swim? A company that makes money when you lose and loses money when you win there is always going to be a conflict of interest when you start winning? An absolute fact.

Therefore, get over to an ECN account or direct access, easy enough nowadays where the company only profit from your commission therefore they want you to win and want you to trade more, which means there is no longer a conflict of interest and their whole agenda and perspective is the opposite of a market maker?

With CS you have a good few days and take 10K from them, that is straight off their profit book, what would you do in their position?

What do you think of the likes of MB Trading then?

They are an ECN that pays for limit orders, so you can trade with them and they pay you.

So then the obvious question is, where does their money come from? And the answer is one that will put them in conflict with you. I do trade ECN, but not every ECN is perfect either. I think ECN term is a bit abused lately.

 

[gle101]

And that is why I say that complaining that you were put on dealer refferal etc with an SB is a bit like saying you will get wet going for a swim? If you trade short term with them finding it difficult to hedge they will slow you down, and cant blame them.

If you are put on referral by a dealer by a SB, you simply have to move on, thats all. Not a big deal really. Not that I like the SB for doing this, but it is part of the game. As long as the regulators don't take action in discourage this kind of practice by the SB we trading with them have to live with it and it is a matter of choice that most of us do. This for reasons that the pros still outweigh the disadvantages of trading SB.

 

[gle101]

Yes guys we are talking about the same things, I am saying that whatever is not balanced or hedged on a winning trade they lose so are they going to set things up for a short term profitable trader to work well, no they are not?

Think of this analagy which i think sums up SB's. They are to the trading world what hotel gyms are to the fitness world. You can go to the hotel gym, do some cycling, running etc on a machine, build up your fitness etc and do feel nice and relaxed and it provides a purpose to your catagory of fitness requirements as in wrapped in cotton wool. So they do have a purpose in the financial world.

If you are a serious runner or cyclist you would never use the hotel gym for your training as is not good enough or professional enough to fit your needs?

So I am saying that SB has a market and rightly so, but any real trader would not near them for all the obvious reasons, the same as a serious athlete would not use a hotel gym to train in?

So you are a "real" trader, what a relief.

 

[PipStar]

If you are put on referral by a dealer by a SB, you simply have to move on, thats all.

Glad to see you finally realise this. The SB or market maker business model is to obstruct, delay and eventually chase away the winners. So once this happens it all goes quiet as you say for a while until the next winner comes along and that whole cycle starts again. To win will bring obstruction, delay, refer to dealer.

 

[kwickwool]

Gle, typical trader responce as in sarcastic and defensive, you been trading for 17 years and still happy kicking around with CS, I could have commented on that but did not.

I am just stating facts as in SB's............

 

[gle101]

Gle, typical trader responce as in sarcastic and defensive, you been trading for 17 years and still happy kicking around with CS, I could have commented on that but did not.

I am just stating facts as in SB's............

Not at all meant to be sarcastic, sorry if you took offence to my choice of word. But you have to realize that SB traders do trade SB by own free will.

 

[gle101]

Glad to see you finally realise this. The SB or market maker business model is to obstruct, delay and eventually chase away the winners. So once this happens it all goes quiet as you say for a while until the next winner comes along and that whole cycle starts again. To win will bring obstruction, delay, refer to dealer.

So why am I sill around after all these years of trading SB? Because I know what and with whom I am trading. I know the risk parameters involved trading SB and take full personal responsibly for this choice. Most of the DMA traders also vanish after a while and new comes around, the same thing, and this simply due to the fact that the precentage of losing traders are about the same.

 

[kwickwool]

sure, and horses for courses so to speak, and as always g/l to you

 

[tar]

What do you think of the likes of MB Trading then?

They are an ECN that pays for limit orders, so you can trade with them and they pay you.

So then the obvious question is, where does their money come from? And the answer is one that will put them in conflict with you. I do trade ECN, but not every ECN is perfect either. I think ECN term is a bit abused lately.

BTW re MB they were asked to change their status to EXN instead of ECN i wounder why . Not all ECNs are genuine , most are not it is just a marketing ploy . LMAX could be a good choice as they are an exchange , they have indices and commodities as well ...

 

[gle101]

sure, and horses for courses so to speak, and as always g/l to you

Meaning what, please elaborate.

 

[tar]

sure, and horses for courses so to speak, and as always g/l to you

Many thinks that SB is for small traders but it isn't , there are many big traders and investors do use SB but ofcourse not in a professional level . The good thing about SB is that you can trade wide range of markets from one account with a small stake size , it is a place to take a bet on the market but it is definitely not that suited for scalping or HFT IMHO ...

 

[gle101]

Many thinks that SB is for small traders but it isn't , there are many big traders and investors do use SB but ofcourse not in a professional level . The good thing about SB is that you can trade wide range of markets from one account with a small stake size , it is a place to take a bet on the market but it is definitely not that suited for scalping or HFT IMHO ...

You also have the huge CFDs market. Many really big investors is hedging into this market.

 

[kwickwool]

Meaning what, please elaborate.

Just that if their set up suits your needs and style then thats fine, some hourses perform well on certain courses type thing, maybe I use too many analygies

 

[gle101]

Just that if their set up suits your needs and style then thats fine, some hourses perform well on certain courses type thing, maybe I use too many analygies

Yes I understand, although I didn't get the last part of your post.

 

[ffsear]

So why am I sill around after all these years of trading SB? Because I know what and with whom I am trading. I know the risk parameters involved trading SB and take full personal responsibly for this choice. Most of the DMA traders also vanish after a while and new comes around, the same thing, and this simply due to the fact that the precentage of losing traders are about the same.

DITTO! Now in my 5th year spread betting for a living. The odd delay, re-quote. never a problem. People who lose at spread betting, who think they will magically make money under DMA and its all down to the broker are deluded.

The only exception is high frequency scalpers.

 

[ffsear]

This hedging thing is a myth , they don't hedge individual clients trades , they just balance their whole book at certain thresholds ....

This is true. I worked at Cantor Index / spreadfair for 2 years as a dealer. We had a position monitor for every single instrument and it was treated as 1 position.

As for dealer referral, its there for a reason and it all comes down to the type of trader you are. Think of it from the dealers point of view. A known trader pops up and wants to go £250 long on EUR/USD. Big position. I gotta check my position before i accept this. I gotta look at the market, i gotta look at the charts, I gotta look at my current exposure and I gotta think about hedging, If i know this guy is likely to close the position after a couple of minutes, is it really in my interest to take this? If he's doing it 20 times a day, is it the kind or trader I want to be servicing? Not really, he's just gonna give me a headache.

Dealer referral is purely down to the type of trader you are. It nothing to do with winners or losers. Spread betting is not for everyone, but if you a small to medium size player. Making a handful of trades a day then you won't have any problems.

 

[tar]

This is true. I worked at Cantor Index / spreadfair for 2 years as a dealer. We had a position monitor for every single instrument and it was treated as 1 position.

Good to get a confirmation from an insider , but wasn't Spreadfair an exchange ...

 

[ffsear]

It was marketed as an exchange, but it wasn't really. 99% of the money available on the exchange was actually ours. Very rarely would 2 clients get matched directly.

It was a good idea, but there are not enough sports spread betters out there to fill the exchange.

 

[kwickwool]

This is true. I worked at Cantor Index / spreadfair for 2 years as a dealer. We had a position monitor for every single instrument and it was treated as 1 position.

As for dealer referral, its there for a reason and it all comes down to the type of trader you are. Think of it from the dealers point of view. A known trader pops up and wants to go £250 long on EUR/USD. Big position. I gotta check my position before i accept this. I gotta look at the market, i gotta look at the charts, I gotta look at my current exposure and I gotta think about hedging, If i know this guy is likely to close the position after a couple of minutes, is it really in my interest to take this? If he's doing it 20 times a day, is it the kind or trader I want to be servicing? Not really, he's just gonna give me a headache.

Dealer referral is purely down to the type of trader you are. It nothing to do with winners or losers. Spread betting is not for everyone, but if you a small to medium size player. Making a handful of trades a day then you won't have any problems.

Exactly what I have been saying, so why take the chance of a dealer referral that can happen when you do not need to any more? ECN platforms remove all of that WITH the right broker of course that is true ECN? Why even take any chance on SB tricks?