Best Thread Capital Spreads
tar
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I didnt say spiking , what happens is sometimes the ftse at CS is like other SB firms and sometimes the diffrence is 10 points i noticed this b4 few month i dont watch them these days but if i notice this again when i have time i will post screenshots promise ...
Phil Mibbutz
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Nudging the quote around a few points is another way of hedging their overall position. Can't see how you'd be able to arb anything, though, when SB companies are so quick to weed out clients who take 'unfair advantage' of any unfair prices.🙂
Many traders on this forum scream out load about SB quotes not following the movement of the underlying asset. When you ask for proof, the only thing you get is silence.
I see these differences quite often on FTSE and sometimes Wall St.. Quite often various SB firms will all be quoting different prices but the differentials will remain constant for some time and they will all be moving in tandem with the market. This can be frustrating if you are watching one chart with open trades and the SB firm price is at a different level. Whether it is an arb oppo I doubt because at some stage prices will level out again and all the SB's may fall in line but that could be at any time day or night so you'd have to screen watch permanently until it happens. What do you think will happen when you finally relent and take that long overdue toilet break????? Sod's law plays a big part in this game!!!
Phil Mibbutz
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Why not, when we also know that they also make it difficult or impossible to scalp?
We all know some of the SB play games, but they are smart people and will not let traders print money by setting an individual price that is not in line with the movement of the market.
Morning GLE, they may well be using the same parameters, hence the constant differentials so no advantage to be gained until such times as the diff's. are narrowed/closed but there is no way of knowing when this will happen. Also for any arb to be successful both prices would have to be accurately taken in order to procure that difference. Certainly with FTSE that isn't easy given the way price jumps around every nanosecond so very high risk for arbs I'd suggest.
current ask on FTSE ~ DD - 4330; Etrade - 4332; ODL - 4332; IG - 4332.5.
rgds.
Just seen your comment back to Phil. Although the prices might vary they do all remain constant (most of the time) and all do move in tandem with the market so no advantage there for the punter and as you say the SB's aren't exposed.
current ask on FTSE ~ DD - 4330; Etrade - 4332; ODL - 4332; IG - 4332.5.
rgds.
Just seen your comment back to Phil. Although the prices might vary they do all remain constant (most of the time) and all do move in tandem with the market so no advantage there for the punter and as you say the SB's aren't exposed.
No, not at all ( mind you we see plenty of conspiracy theories on here so you might have opened up a completely new can of worms now).
I think th various SB's calculate their price correlation to the underlying market and keep that as a constant factor. This factor obviously varies between the different SB's but I don't believe it is anything other than individual SB's calculating their own personal price set-up. The differences in the FTSE prices above are still maintained so they would have been no advantage to anyone.
As a matter of interest, a few minutes ago the mid prices on Wall St were ~ DD - 8621; ET - 18; ODL - 14; IG - 18. ( have quoted mid prices as they all have different spreads from 2 to 6)
I think th various SB's calculate their price correlation to the underlying market and keep that as a constant factor. This factor obviously varies between the different SB's but I don't believe it is anything other than individual SB's calculating their own personal price set-up. The differences in the FTSE prices above are still maintained so they would have been no advantage to anyone.
As a matter of interest, a few minutes ago the mid prices on Wall St were ~ DD - 8621; ET - 18; ODL - 14; IG - 18. ( have quoted mid prices as they all have different spreads from 2 to 6)
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Sorry, I missed out on the word "constant" which is a very important factor. This is exactly my point. Sure, the price differs between the SB, but this is not the issue here. As you point out, the price is correct and with a constant difference against other SB (with an exception of off hours prices), as it reflect the movement of the underlying asset.
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Phil Mibbutz
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Wouldn't want to start a conspiracy theory🙂, but I think that a SB co could easily arrange for a quote to jump around a bit to minimise its overall position, rather than maintaining an exact distance from the underlying future. Just a few points for a few seconds could have a significant effect on whether they need to hedge when there are orders littered around.
Yes they can do anything, but they have a client base they would like to keep from moving somewhere else. With 45.000 clients I would be very careful of manipulating the price feed.
capitalspreads
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phil
as i have mentioned before CS never bias' its prices. Any SB could move the 'fair value' to do as you say but if there was a complaint they would have to prove to a client (and the FOS) that the fair value was reasonably consistent during a session.
If for instance the difference between the future and the cash was 20 points when the client entered the trade in the morning and then moved to 14 pips and back up to 20 again (taking the stop out in the process) the client would be justified in their suspicion.
All I can suggest is that you put the daily fut and the rolling cash in your portfolio and then watch it.
It might change slightly during a session as the cash market does alter slightly as Major constituents of the index shift a bit during the day but this should be a very occassional adjustment. If the difference is widening and narrowing all the time then all I can suggest is that you jump ship to another provider. To be fair to my dealers there is generally a bit of adjustment in the first hour of dealing as the fair value settles down but even this should not be more than a couple of points.
In reality we do not watch the order monitor in this fashion and only see stops when they are activated (we call it "redlined") so with CS it is a moot point anyway.
simon
as i have mentioned before CS never bias' its prices. Any SB could move the 'fair value' to do as you say but if there was a complaint they would have to prove to a client (and the FOS) that the fair value was reasonably consistent during a session.
If for instance the difference between the future and the cash was 20 points when the client entered the trade in the morning and then moved to 14 pips and back up to 20 again (taking the stop out in the process) the client would be justified in their suspicion.
All I can suggest is that you put the daily fut and the rolling cash in your portfolio and then watch it.
It might change slightly during a session as the cash market does alter slightly as Major constituents of the index shift a bit during the day but this should be a very occassional adjustment. If the difference is widening and narrowing all the time then all I can suggest is that you jump ship to another provider. To be fair to my dealers there is generally a bit of adjustment in the first hour of dealing as the fair value settles down but even this should not be more than a couple of points.
In reality we do not watch the order monitor in this fashion and only see stops when they are activated (we call it "redlined") so with CS it is a moot point anyway.
simon
capitalspreads
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ffsear
i will have a look
simon
i will have a look
simon
SB manipulation
Simon
I suddenly started facing execution delay, re quotes, requotes on requotes and execution if price moved against me (generally). My only crime was that my winnings had multiplied 2.5 times over 6 months. So I did an interesting study. I got my friend to open a spreadbet account with the same company and we compared the behaviour on both accounts by placing identical trades , simultaneously on both accounts on different machines on the same network (We swapped the machines halfway to make sure there was no delay from our system) . We placed these orders during busy and not-busy periods (including some at 3 am in the morning!) We placed over a hundred 'live' orders and the result was:
Winning account (my account) :
93% delayed execution of 15 - 90 seconds
45% requotes
12% re quotes AFTER accepting the requote
New Account (friend's account):
100% execution in < 1 second
0% requotes
I have moved my account to another SB but I think my study clearly shows the manipulation that we so often hear about. I believe that it is illegal for a SB to 'Flag' a winning client and make it harder for him to win. I think I have grounds to get this companies license taken away.
What do you think?
Simon
I suddenly started facing execution delay, re quotes, requotes on requotes and execution if price moved against me (generally). My only crime was that my winnings had multiplied 2.5 times over 6 months. So I did an interesting study. I got my friend to open a spreadbet account with the same company and we compared the behaviour on both accounts by placing identical trades , simultaneously on both accounts on different machines on the same network (We swapped the machines halfway to make sure there was no delay from our system) . We placed these orders during busy and not-busy periods (including some at 3 am in the morning!) We placed over a hundred 'live' orders and the result was:
Winning account (my account) :
93% delayed execution of 15 - 90 seconds
45% requotes
12% re quotes AFTER accepting the requote
New Account (friend's account):
100% execution in < 1 second
0% requotes
I have moved my account to another SB but I think my study clearly shows the manipulation that we so often hear about. I believe that it is illegal for a SB to 'Flag' a winning client and make it harder for him to win. I think I have grounds to get this companies license taken away.
What do you think?
tar
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I am not surprised
