Becoming a proffessional through prop shop?

[Shakone]

Another benefit of having a job at one time in your life is that it helps to build capital - something essential if you want to trade for a living. Unless you have rich parents or an incredibly generous wife that is.

 

[BSD]

Thing is tho, once you've had the security, will ya ever get the balls to go out on your own ?

I'm sure there some, but most salaried people who've traded OPM don't make it on their own.

ANd once you get a family, mortgage, etc eventually going out just becomes harder and harder.

 

[tar]

Another benefit of having a job at one time in your life is that it helps to build capital - something essential if you want to trade for a living. Unless you have rich parents or an incredibly generous wife that is.

To make a good living in London you need alot of capital , some of it will be gone in the learning process , the rest will be used to make a living from it afterwards , so i assume 50K pounds isn't really enough .

 

[wallstreetwarrior87]

Ok, with regards to the OP his questions about getting jobs with various outfits – well there’s only one person who can answer that and that is himself, try various routes and see what happens. Personally I have never had the desire to want to be involved in “the city” so I am not qualified to offer any advice on that.

But maybe a suggestion or two –

With regards to what one is trying to achieve;
There are too many comparisons that are not like for like. This business has so many ways/paths available to achieve a desired outcome, so it’s up to the individual to decide what they want to do. But I think (maybe way off base) that most here are concerned with day trading (a bit of swing too). So there are 2 options – discretionary or mechanical, both are rule based, but the foundations of these rules come from totally different angles.

So, the brain analogy - discretion needs creative thought to a logical question, the question must come first (left brain) and the answer comes from the right side. The greater the use of right brain activity, the more willing you will be to probe/investigate to generate the conclusions you seek.

Mechanical traders, tend to stay on the left side when thinking things through and developing a way to trade profitably, how do we know? Well systems are based on yes/no answers, they are not concerned with asking why. That’s why there is a massive difference in the returns of a competent discretionary trader and a competent mechanical trader.

Sounds a load of mubo jumbo, but when you read all the posts and conversations you can see clearly how people think as they are typing their thoughts into text.

Then you add in various levels of academic intelligence (IQ) and levels of emotional intelligence(EQ) and you can see why there is such a diverse quality of debate (which is good), but no always helpful to the reader if they have not firstly understood enough about themselves, to know which direction they must take.

Finally, with regards to another thread which was discussing the value of risk levels in trading;
If a trader deposits their account with $10,000 and runs it up to $50,000 over and over (each time taking out the $40,000 profit) until the 6th account blows up; does this make the trader a success or failure in the eyes of others?

It’s the end game that counts, aggressive traders who have a plan don’t listen/care what Joe public say about 2% risk etc.

There are so so so many ways to do this, like a big sweetie shop, but you must know which sweets you want before you go in!

The risk element is relevant due to the fact people always have an assumption – being that a trader always leaves all of their money in the account. It’s the strike rate relative to the risk/reward that should always determine risk, and then be as aggressive as you can within these risk parameters.

There are too many threads at the moment where people are over complicating the relevant issues. Like all businesses, simple and clear, makes for the best route. My opinion of course, each to their own.

Overcome delusion first, then make the dream become reality.:cheesy:

 

[Forexmospherian]

There are so so so many ways to do this, like a big sweetie shop, but you must know which sweets you want before you go in!

So very true - Even life is not just "black or white"

A very interesting debate with some great comments from all - I am a typical alpha male - who from the age of 16 only wanted to be my own boss - mainly because I thought I had everything needed to get to the top in what ever career I decided on

So I am more of a BSD type of guy - but for me it was also one of my failings

Yes I got the degree in Economics ( but only a 2 2) went on to do Business studies and Accountancy before I opened a wine bar at the age of 24 - knowing nothing about wine - but saw the opportunity - and milked it

6 yrs later I sold out and was in a totally different business and then within another 4 yrs was advising RB on how to run his condom business and then within another 4 yrs did a MBO along with 2 other guys - borrowing $2.5 million and paying it all back in 4 yrs.

But when I think about it - I was from a business family - I had seen my Father "wheeler deal" from the age of 10 and so grew up knowing I wanted to be my own boss and make it in the world.

I retired at the age of 50 - but within 5 yrs lost large amounts of money in various ventures both sides of the pond.

I now look back and some of my buddies from the 70's and 80''s who went work in various businesses - and have never been at the real "sharp end" - ie making the "hero or zero" decisions have actually ended up far better off than me

I sent both of my children to private school and emphasised to them the importance of a qualifications and that sometimes "steddy eddies" come out just as well as the young high flying go getters

Its interesting both of RB's children have gone through a great education and his daughter studied to be a Doctor. I don't think either have the real "entrepreneural spirit" - not as though it matters if you father is worth 3 billion or so.

As in anything in life - the top 2- 5% whether in Business or Sport or whatever are really "special people" - totally focused - driven - born winners etc - different to the 95% who are looked upon as normal human beings

I therefore do see Shakone's point of view and he always makes sensible comments - even when I don't alway's agree with them - it does not mean he is wrong.

BSD - you ought to be a motivational speaker if you not already earned a few millions - you have such a PMA - and I just hope it rewarded you well

We have not even mentioned "luck" in the mix neither yet

To me RB was the luckiest person I know - if anyone could walk on water - it would be him. It's OK saying you create your own luck - that's partly true - but I have never really studied to see if you can always sit in the right seat in a plane or car crash and always walk away unhurt ( David Coulthard holds that award)

Look forward to reading more of all the comments

Regards

F

 

[wallstreetwarrior87]

Luck, the interaction point between opportunity and time.

Can not remember where/whom I heard this from, but I thought its was very accurate for most things in life. Also a major factor that is missing is choice.

 

[darktone]

Darktone, if I remember correctly, I think he mentioned an example in which he had a hard stop at 50 pips, but when it went 20 pips offside he would consider the trade to be wrong and go into exit mode and exit on a retrace.

He did receive a lot of resistance for his posts, but what he mentioned about putting stops at local lows being bad conceptually seems sensible to me. If you trade breakouts, then you're entering at what is locally the worst price in recent times, and if you leave your stop under the low, you're willing to exit a loser at the worst price recently. It's certainly worth thinking about imo.

Would be interesting to get his views now as this was all a while ago.
When alls said done,imo its just about trying to operate at a better than current price. Thats basically all it boils down to for me.

 

[BSD]

Yes I got the degree in Economics ( but only a 2 2) went on to do Business studies and Accountancy before I opened a wine bar at the age of 24 - knowing nothing about wine - but saw the opportunity - and milked it

6 yrs later I sold out and was in a totally different business and then within another 4 yrs was advising RB on how to run his condom business and then within another 4 yrs did a MBO along with 2 other guys - borrowing $2.5 million and paying it all back in 4 yrs.


As in anything in life - the top 2- 5% whether in Business or Sport or whatever are really "special people" - totally focused - driven - born winners etc - different to the 95% who are looked upon as normal human beings

BSD - you ought to be a motivational speaker if you not already earned a few millions - you have such a PMA - and I just hope it rewarded you well

To me RB was the luckiest person I know - if anyone could walk on water - it would be him.

Great post mate, always love hearing others success stories, and yeah, I've really always loved that Branson guy, he just oozes positivity, success and fun.

One day you can set up a drinks party for us if you stayed in contact.



Had to go google pma haha.

Positive mental attitude ?

Yeah I have that usually, although I do get my dark phases too.

Re the motivational speaking part, it's really quite interesting you mention that, I have been thinking of joining toastmasters, give that a go and see what happens.

http://www.toastmasters.org/