All you need is... The Further Tales

[TheBramble]

Tony,

My comments were not on this thread originally but have been moved here as the original was split in two. What happened was that a thread was started by FW and before it even got started there were several posts of verbal banter that had nothing to do with the theme of the thread and that is what I commented on.


Paul

My apologies Paul. Another example of inappropriate moderation where all context has been lost and unnecessary aggravation caused.

 

[black bear]

I thought you were given hell because you were a yank mp 🙂

"my situation is i got miffed over seeing what i say so often (now backed up by nine on that thread) repeated by yet another person, when i was originally given so much hell over saying it in the first place !"

"THATS why i got testy --- not you, neanderthal weedhopper quick fingered honey dipper, but because, plain and simple, i WANT my credit for going thru the crap to tell how it works !"

"I dont understand you, but i think i like you, but im not sure cause i dont ever know what youre saying !"

mp

late last night so..................an answer


I thought you were given hell because you were a yank mp 🙂

Serious.... my only problem with your posts was Stops, even if you yourself do not use them for whatever reason you see fit

I fail to see how your method would be affected or be less effective by saying its a VERY good idea to use them say over the 4 hr tf or days and manage your risk in a phisical way ?? why a disclaimer, your saying ok I will put a disclaimer but I will not budge my stance on it or the general tone of posts regarding them even if it is a good idea for new traders to use them (Its a good idea for all traders to use them imho)

I just think it gives out the impression that Stops are for pussy"s and imho thats not the case

I understand fully what you say regards Stop runs in the lower tf / noise / getting Stopped out when your trades still valid etc

Why not post more detail on trade management mp :?:

It seems to be an issue thats worth covering, td did mention it 1st and covered it a little in a number of posts but I am sure he will not mind at all, not having invented trade management himself anyway 🙂


I think you have made some very good valid points in many posts on many threads 🙂

Regards News trade information you posted, I said at the time and posted to the effect that I had no problem with your opinion and I even agree with many of the points you have made mp. (cannot be bothered looking them up. but they are there unless LM "s broom as been out spring cleaning 🙂)

Credit = do not be a big baby mp, I posted ages ago in a serious / humourous way regards market manipulation / price moved or held by large traders or whoever, who cares anyway really as long as price moves and we can find low prob trades in desired direction

"See my MEN IN BLACK POSTS on Dow 07 and FTSE 07 threads" .......I want credit I said it 1st 🙂

Its playground stuff mp, who cares who said it, or who said it 1st

Fw posts an overlap of something that you covered 1st and someone else covered 6 months ago etc etc

Others who perhaps do not like your posts or charts mp etc or just plain did not see them at the time can appreciate better what you were trying to say and the knowledge you were trying to inpart in your posts and thread

Well done mp you have spread the word and like a snowball its gathering pace :clap:


"neanderthal weedhopper quick fingered honey dipper"

a complement mp 🙂

 

[mp6140]

Well done mp you have spread the word and like a snowball its gathering pace :clap:

"neanderthal weedhopper quick fingered honey dipper"

a complement mp 🙂[/QUOTE]
=======================================================

thnx -- not nearly as upset as posts might suggest, but i always tend to go over the top !

and the rest --- absolutely meant as a compliment !

mp

 

[firewalker99]

Fw posts an overlap of something that you covered 1st and someone else covered 6 months ago etc etc

Before anybody says I'm copying someone else's material, I don't think I've seen mp's thread where he discussed the same topic. Perhaps anyone could point me in the right direction?

But even if I did, there are only so many principles, that some are bound to resurface here or there. For all I know, mp might have a much better understanding of this than I have 🙂

 

[mp6140]

Before anybody says I'm copying someone else's material, I don't think I've seen mp's thread where he discussed the same topic. Perhaps anyone could point me in the right direction?

But even if I did, there are only so many principles, that some are bound to resurface here or there. For all I know, mp might have a much better understanding of this than I have 🙂

=================================================================

not really miffed firewalker -- lets just get on with the subject and throw away the rest

theres nothing new under the sun, and that certainly describes me !

mp

 

[Lightning McQueen]

Tony,

My comments were not on this thread originally but have been moved here as the original was split in two. What happened was that a thread was started by FW and before it even got started there were several posts of verbal banter that had nothing to do with the theme of the thread and that is what I commented on.


Paul

My apologies Paul. Another example of inappropriate moderation where all context has been lost and unnecessary aggravation caused.

My humble apologies gents, I had other urgent tasks on the go as well as this one. I rushed it and admit doing a sloppy job 😱

I have made belated amends by clarifying where this thread originated from, with a link back to the original thread in the first post.

 

[mp6140]

I never,ever pay any attention to the news whatsover. Be it 9/11 or NFP. I have no news feed and I read (books not newspapers etc) whilst trading. The news may help move the markets but do you need to know what, why, when etc...... NO.

Even afterwards I have looked back to where news cam out and see it would not have helped knowing.

(Sorry FW, would have posted sooner but your thread keeps getting lost in the new posts whilst mine stays on top! :cheesy🙂)

============================================================

most likely, if you looked back, you would have seen the price came right back to its original trend and probably to its original price before the news "deviated" its move !

its what "channeling" is all about, and why tight stops will kill ya graveyard dead, cause its the trend and not each tick, that REALLY matters !

unfortuately, the newbs dont know that AND that is the reason they fall by the wayside before getting to stand on their own 2 feet !

i DONT use sl's BUT THERE HAS TO BE SOMEONE WHO REALLY KNOWS HOW TO USE THEM and can teach the newbs what to do !

enjoy and trade well

mp

 

[wasp]

============================================================

most likely, if you looked back, you would have seen the price came right back to its original trend and probably to its original price before the news "deviated" its move !

its what "channeling" is all about, and why tight stops will kill ya graveyard dead, cause its the trend and not each tick, that REALLY matters !

Couldn't have more opposite views there MP. Rarely see channels nor use them and whilst what you say may have happened (price deviates then back on track), unless you entered incorrectly, tight stops should not have been hit.

unfortuately, the newbs dont know that AND that is the reason they fall by the wayside before getting to stand on their own 2 feet !

i DONT use sl's BUT THERE HAS TO BE SOMEONE WHO REALLY KNOWS HOW TO USE THEM and can teach the newbs what to do !

enjoy and trade well

mp

I use tight stops because my entries allow it. I think they are the most sensible tool in a traders toolbox TBH.

This thread is not about stops though. The chart tells all and there is still no need to pay any attention to the news releases.

 

[Paul71]

============================================================

most likely, if you looked back, you would have seen the price came right back to its original trend and probably to its original price before the news "deviated" its move !

its what "channeling" is all about, and why tight stops will kill ya graveyard dead, cause its the trend and not each tick, that REALLY matters !

unfortuately, the newbs dont know that AND that is the reason they fall by the wayside before getting to stand on their own 2 feet !

i DONT use sl's BUT THERE HAS TO BE SOMEONE WHO REALLY KNOWS HOW TO USE THEM and can teach the newbs what to do !

enjoy and trade well

mp

Channels don't exist. How can you trade something that doesn't exist?

 

[mp6140]

MP --- then youre part of the problem and certainly not the solution

Channels don't exist. How can you trade something that doesn't exist?

for something that "doesnt exist", ive put forth an awful lot of charts with very graphic ghosts on them.

If you insist on maintaining that UNBELIEVEABLE statement, and a single newb listens to you then YOU carry the weight of their losses and YOU can live with it, if indeed there is a moral fiber inside of you !

WHAT ABSOLUTE IDIOCY YOU PUT FORTH !

mp

 

[mp6140]

Couldn't have more opposite views there MP. Rarely see channels nor use them and whilst what you say may have happened (price deviates then back on track), unless you entered incorrectly, tight stops should not have been hit.



I use tight stops because my entries allow it. I think they are the most sensible tool in a traders toolbox TBH.

This thread is not about stops though. The chart tells all and there is still no need to pay any attention to the news releases.

=======================================================

months and months ago i posted that everything is in the charts and part of the meaning behind "the news is priced in" so you dont get any disagreement from me.

fireguy and i both called the bottom bounce point and while i dont know what he uses, i use s+r overlays (which are crazy good) and the LRC (linear regression channel) which appears to always show you current tops and bottoms.

if you DONT use them, i would suggest you take a look --- it should make ANY trading better.

mp

 

[Paul71]

for something that "doesnt exist", ive put forth an awful lot of charts with very graphic ghosts on them.

If you insist on maintaining that UNBELIEVEABLE statement, and a single newb listens to you then YOU carry the weight of their losses and YOU can live with it, if indeed there is a moral fiber inside of you !

WHAT ABSOLUTE IDIOCY YOU PUT FORTH !

mp

Good luck with the channeling, MP!

 

[wasp]

=======================================================

months and months ago i posted that everything is in the charts and part of the meaning behind "the news is priced in" so you dont get any disagreement from me.

fireguy and i both called the bottom bounce point and while i dont know what he uses, i use s+r overlays (which are crazy good) and the LRC (linear regression channel) which appears to always show you current tops and bottoms.

if you DONT use them, i would suggest you take a look --- it should make ANY trading better.

mp

Being an intraday trader I don't try to call tops and bottoms as there are many but I get in as close enough to not worry.

Thanks for the recommendation but I don't require anything else on my chart other than price to produce better results, and in comparison to the charts of yours I have looked at, my results wouldn't have been improved.

Anyhow, sorry FW, back to the news (or not as the case may be!)...

 

[firewalker99]

Channels don't exist. How can you trade something that doesn't exist?

for something that "doesnt exist", ive put forth an awful lot of charts with very graphic ghosts on them.
mp

Whether it exists or not is debatable imo. If we see constellations, do they exist?
We only see patterns because we have chosen a certain way of representation. But price doesn't react because the trader has drawn a line somewhere.

fireguy and i both called the bottom bounce point and while i dont know what he uses, i use s+r overlays (which are crazy good) and the LRC (linear regression channel) which appears to always show you current tops and bottoms.

mp

I use price, support and resistance basically. Which are horizontal lines. Next to that, I have trend-, demand- and supplylines to help me in determining the exit of a trade.

This thread is not about stops though. The chart tells all and there is still no need to pay any attention to the news releases.

That is correct. As much as all of this is very interesting topic for debate, there are a couple of threads discussing the use of stops (good ones I might add), for example this one: Stop Losses

 

[mp6140]

MP -- last time i ran into a group like this --- never mind !

Whether it exists or not is debatable imo. If we see constellations, do they exist?
We only see patterns because we have chosen a certain way of representation. But price doesn't react because the trader has drawn a line somewhere.

you steal my whole discussion from months ago, put it forth as if you were just handed the information from G-D, give me no credit for the 10 or so posts on the subject, and then have the nerve to tell me software driven programs that show ALL trends and support and resistance DOESNT exist --- tell your friend hes using too much grease on his hair because his mind appears to be slipping !

I use price, support and resistance basically. Which are horizontal lines. Next to that, I have trend-, demand- and supplylines to help me in determining the exit of a trade.

exactly what anyone who trades well would use and having said you use TREND LINES, youve already said you use ONE HALF of the LRC, so your neigh saying is only HALF correct at the moment --- what the heck do you think they are, after all !

That is correct. As much as all of this is very interesting topic for debate, there are a couple of threads discussing the use of stops (good ones I might add), for example this one:

a casual reference to a stop loss is not a DISCUSSION, and no one except you and your cronies would see it as that -- even if were wrong, if we all stick together maybe someone will think were right !

Stop Losses

truly unbelieveable actions for those in high places

mp

 

[firewalker99]

truly unbelieveable actions for those in high places

mp

mp, I'm not sure what ideas you got in your head, but my comments on Paul71 and your post, was actually giving you the benefit of the doubt. You obviously interpreted this the other way around, so before you start throwing insults around... 😕

...perhaps you should read again what I posted, instead of putting worths in my mouth. I said I used diagonal lines myself, but it's not because the trader draws a line somewhere that price will act on that line. Unless that line represents something fundamental. This thread however, isn't about your system, or about mine, or about anybody's system, it's about showing that you don't need anything else than a chart. You've contributed to this discussion with some good points, but please can we keep it calm and rationally. I have not attacked you anywhere, I'm sorry if you felt it that way.

It seems to me like you're taking this all a bit too personal. Whether or not this has been discussed before is irrelevant, especially if I never took place in the previous discussion. Given that there are almost 100000 members on this board, it's very likely a number of elements will come back and be discussed by other people.

As for stops, this thread is not about stops, there are at least a dozen others out there that debate stops. If you want to engage in a discussion about that, by all means. But this is not the thread to do so.

Please, can anyone who wishes to reply on this or the previous post, do it in the other thread here:
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/general-trading-chat/31864-all-you-need-further-tales.html
Thank you.

 

[mp6140]

mp, I'm not sure what ideas you got in your head, but my comments on Paul71 and your post, was actually giving you the benefit of the doubt. You obviously interpreted this the other way around, so before you start throwing insults around... 😕

"benefit of a doubt " - - im giving you the benefit of a doubt and not calling it outright plagurism ! When you started this I remarked how loud the ECHO of my own words were in your thread, and thats what im upset about !

...perhaps you should read again what I posted, instead of putting worths in my mouth. I said I used diagonal lines myself, but it's not because the trader draws a line somewhere that price will act on that line. Unless that line represents something fundamental. This thread however, isn't about your system, or about mine, or about anybody's system, it's about showing that you don't need anything else than a chart. You've contributed to this discussion with some good points, but please can we keep it calm and rationally. I have not attacked you anywhere, I'm sorry if you felt it that way.

Its NOT about anyones system --- here we are in full agreement. I was commenting on Pauls statement that they dont "exist" and since they appear on everyone of my charts, its funny how good something that isnt really is --- there is nothing more fundamental and accurate than an LRC, as the programs algorithms keep it self adjusting as pertains to support and resistance --- it is a point of VERY careful study and to be observed continuously, as we see the DOW bounced at the bottom LRC, went to the top and bounced down again, showing where it will arrive on the downside --- once that point is reached, we watch for a breakdown or a bounce --- pretty good stuff for something that DOESNT EXITS and nice to know that it also predicted the down move and the tp point 2 days prior to the event !


Im not pushing the LRC on this thread, although its simply two VERY ACCURATE trend lines and its pretty DARNED GOOD FOR SOMETHING THAT DOESNT EXIST, PAUL !


It seems to me like you're taking this all a bit too personal. Whether or not this has been discussed before is irrelevant, especially if I never took place in the previous discussion. Given that there are almost 100000 members on this board, it's very likely a number of elements will come back and be discussed by other people.

when i spend weeks discussing something that NO ONE SEEMS TO HAVE DISCUSSED BEFORE -- how to play news based on price action, received the disagreement from all the senior "guru's" on this site, put up with the arguements i received while others started trying those ideas and found they worked, and then watch as someone comes along and puts forth my words almost to the sentence, i get a mite rankly !

Ive brought forth approx 5 NEW ideas to a bunch very set in their ways, gotten a heck of a lot of rep points in a very short period of time cause i must be saying something right, and I DONT LIKE OTHER PEOPLE TURNING AROUND AND SAYING IT AS IF IT WAS THERE ORIGINAL THOUGHTS, not after ive already taught how its done only a week before !

As for stops, this thread is not about stops, there are at least a dozen others out there that debate stops. If you want to engage in a discussion about that, by all means. But this is not the thread to do so.

i MENTIONED stops, not discussed them -- not as part of a system or methodology, but simply in passing, as one might mention a decent wine, hamburger or women !

I have said before, and ive said it again --- everything thats bothering me is there for the reading, and it aint stops, LRC's or support and resistance overlays ---- its what this thread is about and what prompted you to start it !

mp

 

[firewalker99]

i MENTIONED stops, not discussed them -- not as part of a system or methodology, but simply in passing, as one might mention a decent wine, hamburger or women !

I have said before, and ive said it again --- everything thats bothering me is there for the reading, and it aint stops, LRC's or support and resistance overlays ---- its what this thread is about and what prompted you to start it !

mp

If you're seriously thinking that anything you, me, or anyone else, is saying here on this forum is "original" in the sense that no-one has said it before, than I'm sorry to disappoint you.

If all of this bothers you, than start your own thread or continue where ever you left of, but stop getting mine off topic! Whatever you said or told might be true, but I'm not following each and every one of the thousand posts made on a daily basis, and I certainly didn't spot yours, because this is the first time I hear about 'LRC'. I even asked you to direct me towards your thread, so I could have a look at it (who knows it might be interesting), but you still haven't replied to that.

For someone who's not pushing LRC, he's sure going on about it a long time... Now if you want to discuss channels or diagonal lines, fine, I'll happily engage in the discussion. But again, this is not the thread to do so.

All this seems to come from some sort of frustration that you weren't taken seriously, but I am. Perhaps you should look for the answer within yourself, instead of accusing me. Especially since I haven't seen or heard from anything you posted.

I do like to add something more, I've added a couple of example charts in this thread (DAX) in post #9. Those are two charts I originally posted somewhere in August 2006. At that time, I already talked about news reversal. As you weren't a member of trade2win yet, you'd have a pretty hard time convincing anyone I'm copying your posts.

and I DONT LIKE OTHER PEOPLE TURNING AROUND AND SAYING IT AS IF IT WAS THERE ORIGINAL THOUGHTS, not after ive already taught how its done only a week before !

And where exactly did I say this? I even quoted other people in italic to illustrate my point.

 

[firewalker99]

mp6140, let's not forget you called for a down day (see above), as did many others. It was indeed a very strong momentum day, price set higher highs and higher lows and there just was no reason to short along the way.

you missed what was said and then you missed my apology for using the 240 min chart on an index as my charts are set for forex --- kindly note by the end of a 24 hour "forex" day, it was moving on down smartly ! --- as can be seen by my chart, it hit rock solid support, and thats simply that !

I haven't seen proof that there is a specific time window in which reversal are more likely to occur, but I haven't studied this to the extent that I can fully deny the possibility. So, in contrary to people who automatically assume this or that can't work because they failed to make it work, I'm going to keep an open mind on this matter.

you sure are a hard butted guy, arent you --- If you havent seen them then its either because you are not capable, or you simply dont want to ----- WATCH and log the times the market reverses, ESPECIALLY the really big reverse just before the rollover ! (i think i have 15 posts on that one) so PLEASE dont start a new topic about trading times without crediting me, ok ? I thought this was a nice little site to hang out at, but i find the "guru's" here to be SO unreceptive to new ideas and not just a little prone to simply ignoring what those with experience have to say !

mp6140. Do you understand plain English, or don't you?

I said "I haven't seen proof that there is a specific time window in which reversal are more likely to occur, but I haven't studied this to the extent that I can fully deny the possibility."

What part of that sentence do you not understand? And why all the attacks? I'm keeping an open mind towards what you're saying. Most people by know would've gotten fed up by your constant attempts to go off in another direction.

I'm sorry if your little ego has been bruised because you didn't get whatever credits you think you were entitled to.

I even said "I'm going to keep an open mind on this matter." yet you accuse me of not being capable of seeing something which is obvious to you. Fine. If it's that obvious, by all means, I strongly urge you to START A NEW THREAD, without getting mine messed up. I'm not ignoring what you are saying, I'm saying this is not the place to discuss it. If you choose to discuss it elsewhere, we can continue there. <- Keep in mind this is the third time I had to say this.

 

[mp6140]

Being an intraday trader I don't try to call tops and bottoms as there are many but I get in as close enough to not worry.

Thanks for the recommendation but I don't require anything else on my chart other than price to produce better results, and in comparison to the charts of yours I have looked at, my results wouldn't have been improved.

Anyhow, sorry FW, back to the news (or not as the case may be!)...

==========================================================

LOL -- LAST thing i would expect is for others to emulate my charts, but understand the meaning of all the "spaghetti" on them ---- i WANT to know WHY something did or didnt happen -- I want to see the ma's, price points, fibs and s+r points passed or halted at -- IF I KNOW, DURING TIMES OF MOMENTUM THAT I CAN CHART AND GRAPH, then i can know (or at least expect) that the next time i should see the same performance !

Ive traded naked many times -- its fun, but its doing a high wire act without a net and ill fully admit im chicken.

There also seems to be a "thing" on this site about naked trading, as a badge of honor, and while i still feel i dont need no stinkin badges, i also recognize that those who do not CONTINUE their education will fall behind, so I LOOK AT EVERYTHING THAT COMES ALONG and only reject that which ive tried many times before and know does not work !

I bring information, but i cant get people to use it, especially if its a badge of honor to trade naked !

just the way it is

mp