Advanced Structured Forex Trading

Hello and Welcome All!

This is an Advanced Trading Concepts Thread for Structured Trades.

This is a thread geared specifically to accelerate a portion of my private research by conducting Public Certification Tests of a new trading technology for non-commercial use. This system is not for sale, lease, or in any way will be offered as a paid-for service. Though there is absolutely nothing wrong with offering trading services of various kinds, this is not for sale. This is the final stage of a 6 year long research project culminating in the final public trials.

Some components of the system are still in BETA, while other components have moved on to the Certification stage. These are the critical final stages that have been created for the purposes of closing this development program/project and moving 100% into full Production Mode revenue generating trading. I like doing public trials, as they provide a psychological confirmation process that goes beyond merely blind private test confirmations.

You may or may not learn anything from this thread. Some will be able to quickly catch on to the concepts discussed here, while others might not. Please feel free to offer your on subject, on topic, relevant input in the form of questions, concerns, or specific comments regarding this thread.

Immature, petty, childish, offending, insulting, or rude posts will be immediately rejected and left un-responded to. This thread created by an Adult, for Adults and with Adult topics in mind (no not that kind - lol! This is at heart a "G" Rated thread, though serious topics might get discussed). If you find that you are un-interested in this thread, please offer the same respect that you would wish in your thread and depart company respectfuly.

I’m looking for a couple Advanced Traders to work out a few issues. You will need the ability to trade the same currency pair in two different directions simultaneously without issues. You need to know how to use a Limit Order without issues. You need to already have in place, 24 – 48 hour pivots for the EURUSD and all other major pairs that contain the USD as either the base or the counter currency.

The goal is to locate the optimal framework within which certain types of trade set-ups will work a high percentage of the time with the system pic that you see in this thread.

This is not a guessing thread, fingers crossed thread, best Christmas wish thread, happy birthday I just traded against news that should have gone the other way thread, I’m the center of attention thread, or I’m a frantic trader looking to jump the first thing that moves thread. This will be an Advanced Trading Concepts Thread with discipline at its core looking to tweak, modify, alter, adjust and spool-up a highly precise trading system.

The basic trade structures will sometimes involved Naked Trades or what I call Covered Pair Trades. The Nake Trades will simply be entering in a single direction with no cover. The Covered Pair Trades will often times include three (3) different trades at the same time. Some will involve four (4) simultaneous trades. The variations on those two themes are what will be at issue here. All Nake Trades will involve the simultaneous entry of a Long and Short Trade with what I call Apex Trades at certain points down-range or up-range in the market.

It has been said that 90% of all new Forex traders either quit or get their lunch taken from them in the school cafeteria. My goal is to become a permanent member of the top 1% of the top 10%, to join the top .01% of all traders. Whatever your goals are, I wish you the best!

If you wish to be a part of my final round of research, then please check-in and introduce yourself below within the next couple of days until I return. In the mean time, please feel free to chat amongst yourselves. I’ll go into further details at that time and post my first Structured Trade, should there be enough open interest in this thread.

Enjoy the week!

Best Regards,
7thSignalTrader

P.S. Below is a pic of the trading technology that I use. It is loaded with EURUSD data. I want to compare trades against other USD encumbered pairs using the same Trade Structures but with different/YOUR pivots for a “relative” comparison test of sorts. The trading system that you see here took 6 years to build and I am in the final phase of development/testing/BETA and Certification of certain aspects of the system. This thread is but one small part of the entire project scope that I am current engaged in right now. This should give you some idea of what’s behind this thread.

Absolutely NOTHING is for sale. I’m not a fund manager, financial planner, trading coach, trading mentor, or salesman. I’m a researcher, engineer and trader (among other things) trying to complete a project. Along the way, you might learn something about a new and different way to trade. I have charts, but I do not use them other than for confirmation of the Trading Panel that you see in this pic. Thank you!

Hello, do you know Tradevector at all?

fxmarkets said:

Hello, do you know Tradevector at all?

Click to expand...

i read a similar type thread a few months back ,in the archives, based on velocity, completely specified by a magnitude and a direction with regards to price , similar historical work input, and request for testers. sounded familiar.

Hello 7ST,

I'm an experienced trader. I'd be willing to provide my existing pivot levels across the six major pairs in the dollar block. Will be interesting to compare the traditional stuff to your system's levels. Ready when you are.

Punch said:

Hello 7ST,

I'm an experienced trader. I'd be willing to provide my existing pivot levels across the six major pairs in the dollar block. Will be interesting to compare the traditional stuff to your system's levels. Ready when you are.

Click to expand...

Sounds good to me! I trade the EURUSD as you can probably tell by the prices in the Dashboard. But, I'd like to try some stuff using the other USD tied majors and some conventional pivots. I'd also hope to find traders that have unconventional pivots that they have developed away from the traditional "R-Type" pivots. But, I need these to be in the 24 to 48 hour range. Any further than that and the comparisons become muted and eventually completely moot.

Are your pivots within that time-frame?

Do you trade more than one pair per week, or do you focus on just one at a time?

How many years of trading experience (round number is fine)?

Likewise, to avoide getting side-tracked - do you know of other traders with "their own" unique 24-48 hour pivots on these particular pairs?

Thanks for the on-topic response!

fxmarkets said:

Hello, do you know Tradevector at all?

Click to expand...

The trading technology GUI that you see in this thread has been in Prototype form for almost 5 years and in Production form for almost 1 year. I've been in the online trading community for about 6 years total. This trading system has passed through several generations of code, from the 1st Generation to the now current 5th Generation. In each prototype phase, I gave the system a unique identifier to separate it from its previous generation.

The 1st Generation of code was the "TradeVector" prototpye. I used that userid online as the TradeVector project was a spin-off from the very first "X"-project when the system had no name. The 2nd Generation of code was the "StealthTrader" prototype and I used that userid online for quite sometime as the system grew. Because there was major overlap in the code and major rapid change in the underlying system, I tended to use StealthTrader AND TradeVector online at the same time identifying TradeVector as the creator of StealthTrader (for online purposes). However, there were basically two system concepts being designed at the same time. Most will know me by StealthTrader, the original.

Over the years and as the system grew through its generations of code changes and system prototype identifiers/names (userid), I eventually Certified the application and converted it from Prototype, to Production. The Production name for the trading application is 7thSignalTrader. It is the first production version of the system now in its 5th generation of code at version 6.0.

Multiple prototype names, multiple userids to represent the generational gaps over the course of multiple years (6 to be exact), and in every case, always discussing the exact same content, issues and substance relative to the excact same system as it developed over the years regardless of the prototype name, code generation or application version number. I could have done things differently, but that is the way I chose to do them. Another person might choose a different path.

I also have other userids for aviation sites, math sites, science sites, politics, sports, cars, business, art, etc. I don't use the same userid on every site I've ever visited on the internet and I'm not sure who does do that. 7thSignalTrader, does not work at www.aviationforum.org, or www.airliners.net, etc - it just does not fit. So, I use a relevant userid for the type of forum I'm using.

Dashboard Update Times (excluding Holidays recognized by Interbank)

Dashboard Panel snapshot taken at the start of the trading session on Feb 12. Session terminates on Feb 13. My session start times are 000GMT, 7:00pm pacific and 4:00pm Eastern, Mon - Thurs. Friday, my sessions end at 1:00pm and start again on Sunday night at the time stated above. No trading between Friday after 1:00pm pacific and Sunday 4:00pm pacific.

Every Dashboard Panel will show the Session Start Date and the Session End Date on the top of the Panel. My Trading Mode will always be in the upper left hand corner of the Panel in either blue or yellow. Right now, the Trading Mode indicates "Production" for this particular trade. However, I am in "BETA" and "Certification" testing at this time. I simply have not turned off the Production Mode light - I will on the next Panel.

These Panels spell out everything I need to know in order to trade. I happen to think that they are better than hand-typed trade calls for a number of different reasons. I'll go into more Panel details later in this thread, if the interest level is high enough. I'm only posting this one now, to give you an idea of what the Panel looks like at the start of this week. The first Panel posted was how the system looked at the end of the last week. It also shows last week's Swing Trade results.

The Panel is easy for me to use as no charts are required for trading. More details when I get back.

With a system of this scale (there is an enormous amount of code behind the scenes driving the "easy to look at" Dashboard seen here) and complexity, there will from time to time be small anomalies that get brought to my attention.

You can see one now if you note the “Target Status” for the “Swing” trade. It reads: “Inbound”. But, the “Trade” status for the “Swing” trade reads: “Off”. Therefore, no “Target Status” should be shown on the Panel, even though the system’s Engine/Server is doing the calculations in the background in real-time waiting for the Swing “On” light to come on. It should read: “Waiting”, just like the “Initial” move trade signal does. So, I missed one it looks like.

Anyway, I will be back later to discuss those elements in the Dashboard that are now in BETA and Certification, as well as discuss the difference between the two, as I see them. I will go and fix this non-critical bug later tomorrow – nothing for me to worry about fixing on a Sunday.

Oh, what the who. The code required to turn the Target Status light off for the Swing trade under these conditions was very minimal - only took 15 minutes. So, I made the change and made the appropriate Mode Switch back to Test, where this session belongs.

Here is the resultant pic of the Panel at 7:40pm pacific, about 4:40 minutes after the start of my session. The price is still below the Day signal Entry point. I'll let you know if I spot any other minor bug fixes in the display of the Panel.

This is a real-time (dynamic) system, so you can see how some of the values in the Panel have changed from the pic using the data at the start of the session (000GM, 7:00pm East, 4:00pm pac) and now at about 7:40pm pacific. The Panel runs in real-time with ever tic from the market. I'll try to post each Panel at the start of my session and one at the end of each session so that the results can be seen between the two from session start to session end.

Will be back later....

not very sure how or what it is, I am in pacific time zone and willing to try it out.

Feb 12 - Feb 13
Mid-session Panel Update: (2:13pm est)

nextgen said:

not very sure how or what it is, I am in pacific time zone and willing to try it out.

Click to expand...

Sounds good.

Which part of the Dashboard is unclear? (note: it is not for sale - so it was built for my custom use)
Do you have 24-48 hr pivots on pairs involving the USD?
How many years of trading experience do you have?

Thanks.

Dashboard Feb 12 - Feb 13 Notes.

Everything looks pretty nominal at this point.

The Swing "Trade" status light being "Off", but "Long" (green up arrow) was a very good projection of this sessions Day Trade Signal "Long", having a rather slow start. So, far the activity in the EURUSD was 22 pip down and 21 pips up with the current close price above the Open shown on the Dashboard. Combined with the opposing Outlook Signal "Short" (red down arrow) at a hefty 83+%, the sideways motion of the EURUSD was pretty much well determined by the system yesterday at the Open. So, nominal is the course for now as the system has indicated from the start.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Digital Dashboard Panel Basics:


Initial Move Trade:

Entry at the Open of each Daily session when its Trade status is “On”. Will indicate between 5 to 25 pips Expected. Is the first trade to terminate for the session. Leads into Day Trade entry. Typically terminates within 12 hours.


Day Trade:

Entry at the Open of each Daily session when its Trade status is “On”. Will indicate between 20 to 90 pips Expected. Is the second trade to initiate and terminate for the Daily session. Stands alone. Typically terminates within 24 – 48 hours.


Swing Trade:

Entry at the Open of each Weekly session on Monday’s when its Trade status light is “On”. Will indicate between 100 to 300 pips Expected. Provides good synthesis with the Day Trade. Used to counter any anomalistic behavior in the Day Trade during the week. There are four (4) of these Swing trades per month – entry always on Monday’s but I often use it to counter any ill effects that might come from any failed Day Trade. Stands alone. Typically terminates within 3 – 5 days.


Outlook Trade:

Entry at the Open of each Monthly session on the first trading day of each month when its Trade status light is “On”. Could indicate between 200 to 600 pips Expected. Can be used to overcome anomalistic trades for the Day or Swing. Typically, holds the most weight in the system and when it opposes the Day Trade or the Swing Trade, it can either cause the Day Trade to be flat or super volatile during its 24 hour session. It is the system’s long range outlook typically terminating within 21 days or 1 full Month. However, its “outlook” can have effects extending up to 5 Months or more indicated by a signal that does not change from month to month.

A) I don’t trade news that I know about ahead of time, unless I can confirm that such news is in-line with the system’s Day Trade Signal. If I cannot confirm that before hand I won’t trade the session. All signals given by this system can be made invalid in a highly news driven environment instantaneously, like any other technical based system in the market. So, if news goes against the system’s signals, the news will typically win.

B) Every trade has prices for its Entry, Limit and Stop. Every trade has pip performance output showing the number of pips Expected, number of pips that Remain, number of pips that have been Captured, and the current Draw.

Those are the basics needed in order to follow the Digital Dashboard Panel.

Hi, I trade all currency pairs that have USD as main or counter currency.

I have bespoke pivots based not on Support or Resistance, but on heuristically algorithmic dynamic volatility and liquidity extended to reversion, fulcrum and inflexion points.

More than willing to help you work out your system, but will not divulge my pivots calculation unless I get a cut of eventual global sales revenue.

Feb 12 - 13
Dashboard Panel Update at the close


Well, about 20 minutes before the closing "bell" (my bell rings at 0000gmt, 4pm pac, 7pm east) and all seems quiet with a tiny profit on low volume pending the first BernekeSpeak event of his new career. Here’s the Dashboard Panel with about 20 minutes left in this session on the EURUSD. No surprises and on track thus far.

In Production Mode trading, I’d manually bank the small pip cache shown here sometime before the end of the session and then wait for the system update at the start of the next session and resume in whatever direction the system signaled after, of course, further review of pending news. Since I know that Retail Sales, Retail Sales Ex-Auto and Business Inventories are all lined up for between 8:30am Eastern and 10:00am Eastern next session, I know that I am not facing any large scale momentum changing type news. Thus, that leaves the first ever BernekeSpeak event as the Fundamental-ish causality for the low volumes today.

Next, Asia and Australia could turn up the volume just a bit which could dove-tail nicely into the system next signal, if that signal is Long. I don’t know exactly what the system will generate, but being the designer I have a hunch that the next Day Trade signal will be Long as well. I’ll have to wait and see.

I’ll accept this nice gift from the market and take these smaller scraps on the table now and wait per my usual protocol for trading this system for the next signal in about 17 minutes.

TheBramble said:

Hi, I trade all currency pairs that have USD as main or counter currency.

I have bespoke pivots based not on Support or Resistance, but on heuristically algorithmic dynamic volatility and liquidity extended to reversion, fulcrum and inflexion points.

More than willing to help you work out your system, but will not divulge my pivots calculation unless I get a cut of eventual global sales revenue.

Click to expand...

I don't need anyone's system for trading, as you can see. But, the comparisons, while I am finishing my certification process is what might interest me. Now, the system that you see here will generate signals every session - there is no standby period or wait on the sideline periods with this system other than for holidays and events such as FOMC, EU, BOJ, etc., etc., type of known announcements - critical political events, etc.

So, if you were sitting on the sidelines today because your system found the range to be too small, then that probably wont qualify for a comparison with a system that generates signals regardless of market width. However, if yours can generate a tradable signal every 24 hours, then that would be a "like" comparison - keeping apples to apples as the the normative comp.

When the market is under this much suppression, I know that I should expect about 50% performance on the session, which was pretty much on par for today. The draw was bit closer than I like to see but still within specs. So, on a session where many were sitting on the sidelines not participating, I am more than happy to go after 50% of normal production while keeping the cash flowing at the same time.

Dashboard Panel: Feb 13 - Feb 14

7thSignalTrader said:

Sounds good to me! I trade the EURUSD as you can probably tell by the prices in the Dashboard. But, I'd like to try some stuff using the other USD tied majors and some conventional pivots. I'd also hope to find traders that have unconventional pivots that they have developed away from the traditional "R-Type" pivots. But, I need these to be in the 24 to 48 hour range. Any further than that and the comparisons become muted and eventually completely moot.

Are your pivots within that time-frame?

Do you trade more than one pair per week, or do you focus on just one at a time?

How many years of trading experience (round number is fine)?

Likewise, to avoide getting side-tracked - do you know of other traders with "their own" unique 24-48 hour pivots on these particular pairs?

Thanks for the on-topic response!

Click to expand...

7ST,

I've been trading full time for 4 years. I use traditional pivots combined with unconventional pivots and a custom application that predicts the daily high and low. My daily existence is similar to a scientist working in his lab. I just do my own thing, research all day, and don't make much effort to reach out. I'm sure they're out there, but I don't know of anyone else who uses unconventional pivots, sorry.

My pivots are valid for a 24 hour window. If necessary, I could modify my calculations to produce pivots oriented around a 48 hour window, but I suspect the accuracy would decrease. Haven't tried it though.

I scan all six major pairs in the dollar block for strong setups, but I trade mainly EUR/USD and USD/JPY. If I am getting clean signals in the Euro and the Yen, then there is no need for me to look elsewhere because I am most in tune with these pairs.

Quite frankly, this is a first. This is the first time in tons of back-testing where I have seen the Swing Trade Signal's status light in the "Off" position for two consecutive days or more. So, this indicates that the system is having no success in finding the optimal Swing direction for the week. Very interesting indeed! I thought I had seen it all with this system, having been the one that built it, but this is a rather anomalistic event for this system.

Anyway, we'll see where she goes on the Swing side. I've got my marching already. I enter orders first and THEN post the Dashboard Panel here. So, I'm already in my test Initial Move which you are seeing for the first time.

Notice the smaller pip expectation on the Initial Move Short at 22 pips (which I think might be a bit deep, but we'll see) followed by the Day Trade initiating Long at 72 pips Expected with a Stop at $1.1861.

Total up/down risk here is 25 pips. The system automatically and dynamically assigns the Stop values, Limit values and Entry values for each trade - so I don't have to spend time worrying about making manual adjustments.

Note the Initial Move signal. It has next to it, a % value. That value is not like the others. That value is like a fuel tank gauge as it shows how much initial move is remaining for the session. Just another visual aide for me to use when trading Day Signal’s off of the Initial Move trade. As I am typing, the Initial Move fuel gauge is now down to 36.36% remaining and the low is now $1.1895 with a close of $1.1900.

Also notice, the Channel Indicator (lower left hand corner of Panel). I was Outside Channel Short last session, indicating heavy short side suppression for that session. Now, it reads “Inside Channel Short”. So, the system still sees the EURUSD as being in a very short-term channel and slowly reversing. The next phase in that reversal should read: “Inside Channel Parity”, which would indicate a virtual balance between short-term upside and downside pressure.

You will also note that the state of the trade is “Unsynchronized” – which basically tells me that the system is not seeing the purest signal clarity possible. In other words, the Day Trade Signal is slightly “dirty”. But, that is OK and within specs. Purest clarity is easy to obtain. In fact, it has been weeks since I’ve seen a trade state that was “Synchronized”. They are just not easy to come by in this system – they are rare events, but when they come, it is an automatic Hold Signal.

The part of the system that is going through Certification testing now is the Initial Move Limit and the therefore, the Day Trade Entry. I’m tweaking those variable to find the optimal range such that I don’t miss Day Trade Entries, while at the same time not underestimating the strength of the Initial Move’s Limit. It is a balancing act that is now being tweaked to locate where I should set the final optimal specs.

The parts of the system that are in BETA testing right now (one step below Certification) are the Blade and Apex trade profiles below the primary trade profiles on the Dashboard Panel. I’ll discuss those only when they come up as active (“On”) in the Dashboard Panel, or if someone asks questions about them as they are part of the advanced aspects of the system.

Now, here’s the Panel at about 1hr after the open with some of the real-time changes seen (compare the two to see the changes).