Top 3 Spread Betting Firms

[Jack o'Clubs]

Options / MB,

I haven't explained this terribly well. Can I suggest you look at the TwoWayFutures website and see for yourselves that it is DMA.

"Direct access trading is where you are quoted the 'live market price' from the exchange, and you trade at that price. They add their fixed commission to you, (whatever it may be) for the privilege of trading with them." and "For DMA you must pay commission, and trade a non-fixed spread." That is exactly what happens.

"TwoWayFutures state that they "hedge" client positions. ie they trade against your position.". No, they 'hedge' your position by ensuring that the underlying transaction is placed on your behalf on the exchange.

What happens is that you have a futures trading screen that gives you DMA, shows market depth via a scalping ladder, etc, effectively through a 'mirror' site. You place your trade, or position it on the ladder - instantaneously 2WF place the same trade on the exchange and you see it go through and get filled. But your intermediary is 2WF, not the exchange, and somehow that is classified as a spreadbet rather than a direct transaction. Their commissions are a bit higher than one might pay through IB or similar, since you're getting the tax advantages of a s/bet.

 

[adrianbuthee]

Dear Options and Martin Brown

I work for TwoWayFutures and just wanted to clear up a little bit about the product we offer.

Clients trade on a futures trading platform, and deals are executed into the exchange and matched just like a normal futures trade to give your fill. You trade a number of lots, not a specific number of £ per point (Of course each instrument has a specification anyway, like 1 lot of FTSE = £10 per point).

The trade you place into the market acts as the hedge for the company, offsetting any risk. The trade is then booked to your account as a spreadbet, at the spreadbet price. For Example:

You are trading FTSE, which is quoted 5800 - 5800.50 on LIFFE. You buy at market and are filled at 5800.50. Because you trade between 251-1000 lots per month, you are charged 0.25 per side as spread (equivalent to £2.50 commission per lot). This means the trade is then instantly booked to your account at 5800.75.

As a spreadbet, you are long from 5800.75, which is no different to being long at 5800.50 and being charged £2.50 commission.

So, is this direct market access? In a nutshell YES. You can work bids and offers, trade on the ladder, work orders with the exchange etc. All these orders you place are on behalf of the company and act as the hedge for your spreadbet position. Simple as that.

So for simplicity, it works like this:

You buy FTSE at 5800.50 (Company is Long FTSE at 5800.50)

The trade is then booked to your account:

The company sells you the FTSE trade at 5800.75 (Making the company flat)
You buy the FTSE trade at 5800.75

This makes the company in profit of 0.25 and you long from 5800.75.

If anyone would like a demo of the productand dealing platform, please PM me and I would be happy to clear up an further ambiguity.

All the best


Adrian Buthee

 

[Sambar]

Information

Adrian
How safe are client monies at twowayfutures. Are funds held in segregated account. Can twowayfutures trade client monies

Thanks
Sam

 

[adrianbuthee]

Hi Sambar

Yes, funds are in fully segregated accounts, with Barclays in the docklands.

Client monies are not traded by the company. No propriatery positions are taken since all trades are hedged upon execution, leaving minimal risk.

Kind regards

Adrian

 

[Jbat001]

If that's true adrian, you may just be the ultimate SB company!

 

[longandshort]

Hi , I'm new here but not new to sb companies.

Interesting reading everyones opinions on sb comps, I have and still am, a client of many of the comps talked about, I also us sb comps for sports investing(betting) as well as financial.

Dont you think that it is all down to personal experiences that tend to cloud your opinions of one company against another?

As the original question was for stakes from £1-£10/point, for what it is worth I would say the following would be my top 3 :-

1) I.G.Index ... a great platform and a nice easy combination of finance and sports.

2) Finspreads...I have found it to be easy and fast to get around.

3) World Spreads ..a shock to a lot I know, I have been reading the threads with amazement, I truly have not had a single problem with either the back service or the site, honest.

I like to have variation and an eye on the odd arb so I also have accounts with CI and TradeIndex for good measure. Cheers for now, nice site. good luck.

 

[adrianbuthee]

If that's true adrian, you may just be the ultimate SB company!

Jbat001

Well, I would like to think so, we certainly have some whopping advantages. May I suggest attending one of our webinars and seeing for yourself exactly what we offer?

Please PM me if interested.

All the best

Adrian

 

[LevII]

Jbat001

Well, I would like to think so, we certainly have some whopping advantages. May I suggest attending one of our webinars and seeing for yourself exactly what we offer?

Please PM me if interested.

All the best

Adrian

Adrian,

Amongst other things I trade liquid US stocks intra day.

My broker is Interactive Brokers whose commissions / terms are published on their web site.

can you match those terms or get anywhere near?

If so I will almost certainly transfer my account to you.

LII

 

[adrianbuthee]

Adrian,

Amongst other things I trade liquid US stocks intra day.

My broker is Interactive Brokers whose commissions / terms are published on their web site.

can you match those terms or get anywhere near?

If so I will almost certainly transfer my account to you.

LII

We have our own charging structure at TWF, which is also posted on the site. We charge based on volume. The more you trade, the cheaper we are, like any broker. The most we charge is 7 cents per side, going down to 2.5 cents if you trade large volume (+16mln per month).

Have a look on our site and view the "spread rate card" for more information on our charging sructure.

We are most probably not as cheap as IB, but we do offer greater leverage and of course, tax free* trading.

Regards

Adrian

*Tax free under current UK legislation.

 

[LevII]

We have our own charging structure at TWF, which is also posted on the site. We charge based on volume. The more you trade, the cheaper we are, like any broker. The most we charge is 7 cents per side, going down to 2.5 cents if you trade large volume (+16mln per month).

Have a look on our site and view the "spread rate card" for more information on our charging sructure.

We are most probably not as cheap as IB, but we do offer greater leverage and of course, tax free* trading.

Regards

Adrian


*Tax free under current UK legislation.

Thanks for the response.

IB charge USD 0.005 per share - $5 per 1000 shares.

I think yours works out at between $25 & $70 per 1000?

The point about gearing is a good one but at that rate it will be a while before I change over I'm afraid.

LII

 

[simonbrew]

Why not use Worldspreads?

Who do you use?


If you are looking for a new provider, don't use Worldspreads.

As a matter of interest, why not use Worldspreads?

I went to one of their Alpesh Patel evening seminars recently and was impressed by the personal touch and very tight spreads on indices, though I haven't yet checked their spreads on FTSE350 shares.

FYI I currently use Capitalspreads & CMC and am reasonably happy with both, though for different reasons - easy platform and tight spreads respectively.

 

[Pippppin]

Alpesh Patel? He seems to be in on most things.....I have just had an offer to attend a one-day seminar of his for nearly a grand

Don't know if he knows much about trading, but he sure knows how to promote himself

 

[CityTrader]

Dear Options and Martin Brown

I work for TwoWayFutures and just wanted to clear up a little bit about the product we offer.

Clients trade on a futures trading platform, and deals are executed into the exchange and matched just like a normal futures trade to give your fill. You trade a number of lots, not a specific number of £ per point (Of course each instrument has a specification anyway, like 1 lot of FTSE = £10 per point).

The trade you place into the market acts as the hedge for the company, offsetting any risk. The trade is then booked to your account as a spreadbet, at the spreadbet price. For Example:

You are trading FTSE, which is quoted 5800 - 5800.50 on LIFFE. You buy at market and are filled at 5800.50. Because you trade between 251-1000 lots per month, you are charged 0.25 per side as spread (equivalent to £2.50 commission per lot). This means the trade is then instantly booked to your account at 5800.75.

As a spreadbet, you are long from 5800.75, which is no different to being long at 5800.50 and being charged £2.50 commission.

So, is this direct market access? In a nutshell YES. You can work bids and offers, trade on the ladder, work orders with the exchange etc. All these orders you place are on behalf of the company and act as the hedge for your spreadbet position. Simple as that.

So for simplicity, it works like this:

You buy FTSE at 5800.50 (Company is Long FTSE at 5800.50)

The trade is then booked to your account:

The company sells you the FTSE trade at 5800.75 (Making the company flat)
You buy the FTSE trade at 5800.75

This makes the company in profit of 0.25 and you long from 5800.75.

If anyone would like a demo of the productand dealing platform, please PM me and I would be happy to clear up an further ambiguity.

All the best


Adrian Buthee

Interesting. I was at lunch with the MD of a Spreadbetting firm last week, and his view on any form of direct market access is that it would blur the lines between CFD's and Spreadbetting - to render them virtually indistguishable. Sounds like your punters might have to expect a call from the Inland revenue sometime in the future?

CT

 

[gle101]

Alpesh Patel? He seems to be in on most things.....I have just had an offer to attend a one-day seminar of his for nearly a grand

Don't know if he knows much about trading, but he sure knows how to promote himself

Well like in real life, a good teacher and coach doesn't necessarily have to be an excellent practitioner in the same game. Sven-Goran Ericsson isn't that good as a soccer player either, but he sure is an excellent coach and strategist, all that coming from a Swede, ha ha!

 

[jas-105]

Interesting. I was at lunch with the MD of a Spreadbetting firm last week, and his view on any form of direct market access is that it would blur the lines between CFD's and Spreadbetting - to render them virtually indistguishable. Sounds like your punters might have to expect a call from the Inland revenue sometime in the future?

CT

City Trader
this begs the question "when is a bet not a bet ?" and it is an interesting point that you make.
if an SB firm decides to hedge its own clients bets directly into the "real" exchange rather than make no hedge
at all , does this mean that the punter is not actually making a bet as such ?
surely the reason that these DMA firms hedge all their bets is that their price spreads are too tight to do otherwise ?
isnt this the same as a bookie at a horse race who decides to hedge his punters bets on betfair ?
am i missing the point here ?

 

[gle101]

As a matter of interest, why not use Worldspreads?

I went to one of their Alpesh Patel evening seminars recently and was impressed by the personal touch and very tight spreads on indices, though I haven't yet checked their spreads on FTSE350 shares.

FYI I currently use Capitalspreads & CMC and am reasonably happy with both, though for different reasons - easy platform and tight spreads respectively.

Yes I agree, why not Worldspreads? I am very happy with the overall performance of the platform, instant execution and 1 point spread. With this kind of trading environment, one really has a fair chance of making a profit. Also an overlooked but extremely important feature, the feed follows the underlying instrument (on the instruments that I am trading). Thus the trade is so much easier to monitor, you know exactly where you stand.

I am really puzzled over why there isn't more buzz on the spread betting threads, about a company that offers this kind of service. Because the difference between 1 spread and 2 spread, is in fact 100%, the odds are just overwhelming in favor of trading with Worldspreads. Yes I know that many parameters must be considered before choosing the right broker, trading style being one of them, the spread might not be that important if you are a position or a news trader. Also the possibility of having a chart service comes to mind. However, I don't find it necessary for Worldspreads to implement graphs. There are so many good graphical packages around, not to forget the free Medved QuoteTracker (I do hope QuoteTracker will remain free after the take over). Also, more features in the order handling would certainly come in handy.

Anyway trading is a lot about understanding odds, how much are the odds in favor or against you at different levels. This is the main reason why I think trading with Worldspreads is such a good deal.

 

[CityTrader]

City Trader
this begs the question "when is a bet not a bet ?" and it is an interesting point that you make.
if an SB firm decides to hedge its own clients bets directly into the "real" exchange rather than make no hedge
at all , does this mean that the punter is not actually making a bet as such ?
surely the reason that these DMA firms hedge all their bets is that their price spreads are too tight to do otherwise ?
isnt this the same as a bookie at a horse race who decides to hedge his punters bets on betfair ?
am i missing the point here ?

A few things distinguish a Spread bet from a CFD - Spread bets have finite end dates, where as CFD's are open end dates. One of the other things is the fact that the Spread betting firms makes you a market per se, and if this company is going to roll out DMA to their spread betting clients ie remove the market making aspect of the price, what makes it still constitute a Spread bet? Just because they call it a spread bet doesn't make it so! I'd love some more input from this firm?

 

[marlintrdg]

A few things distinguish a Spread bet from a CFD - Spread bets have finite end dates, where as CFD's are open end dates. One of the other things is the fact that the Spread betting firms makes you a market per se, and if this company is going to roll out DMA to their spread betting clients ie remove the market making aspect of the price, what makes it still constitute a Spread bet? Just because they call it a spread bet doesn't make it so! I'd love some more input from this firm?

Could you please say who this "SB" is, this looks very interisting.

edit: Never mind found it: TwoWayFutures, I had a look at them, all seams very good their, anyone trading with them, if so, whats your experience like?

 

[gle101]

Could you please say who this "SB" is, this looks very interisting.

If I am not all together mistaken I think they are referring to http://www.twowayfutures.com. They operate as a spread betting company but with a DMA platform. you have the DMA spread plus the commission to consider. You will on the platform get the real direct market quotes without their commission included. They are not a Market Maker so you can buy within the spread itself and of course no interference by dealers. They become rather expensive if you only have a few trades per day. The concept is interesting but I think to really compete with futures brokers and other DMA brokers they have to lower their commission. The platform isn't all that slick but a a really good thing is that you can trade using Ninja Trader.

 

[marlintrdg]

If I am not all together mistaken I think they are referring to http://www.twowayfutures.com. They operate as a spread betting company but with a DMA platform. you have the DMA spread plus the commission to consider. You will on the platform get the real direct market quotes without their commission included. They are not a Market Maker so you can buy within the spread itself and of course no interference by dealers. They become rather expensive if you only have a few trades per day. The concept is interesting but I think to really compete with futures brokers and other DMA brokers they have to lower their commission. The platform isn't all that slick but a a really good thing is that you can trade using Ninja Trader.

gle101 Yes I I remember looking at them and talking to their people sometime back, (gray mattter is old), they all seams nice enough, not much to offer beyond that.