The end of the EU

[new_trader]

This whole mess has nothing to do, in my view, with anything other than bankers' greed and the ineptitude of our leaders to stop the rot in time but it is obvious that this is not a nasty Greek, Irish, Portugese, Spanish, Italian plot. Our mistake is that we created, and failed to properly control, a common currency. The British are pointing a finger at us, when their own financial system is, also, in as bad a state.

Well Split, you've got me beat...how can a Government that can't afford to make interest payments on its own debt be the fault of greedy bankers? Is this one of those cases like where the drink driver blames the barman for selling him too much alcohol?

 

[Splitlink]

Well Split, you've got me beat...how can a Government that can't afford to make interest payments on its own debt be the fault of greedy bankers? Is this one of those cases like where the drink driver blames the barman for selling him too much alcohol?

Yes, it is. But Greek debt, for instance, was organised by Goldman Sachs as well as the Greek government. This was turned into some derivative deal so as to fool Brussels.

Look, I'm not trying to excuse anyone, I'm trying to prevent the pot from calling the kettle black. The scramble for everyone to get out from under is a sight to behold!

 

[counter_violent]

split

....and some may say that the current mess is all a deep laid plot to create a United States of Europe by force majeur.

You blame the bankers but there was always going to be increasing imbalances between euro countries if their economies deviated from the relative position they were in when they joined the euro. Without central european control "rules" were created which would ensure (theoretically) minimal deviation, but those rules were just bent, twisted or downright ignored by country after country. That's not the bankers' fault - it's governments.

Sorry had to frame this.

So, how much govt do we really need...my guess would be about 1/4 to 1/5 what we have now.

We need all these ******s out of our lives

 

[Atilla]

Well Split, you've got me beat...how can a Government that can't afford to make interest payments on its own debt be the fault of greedy bankers? Is this one of those cases like where the drink driver blames the barman for selling him too much alcohol?

It's called socialism. Tax payers bailing out the capitalist bankers.

Keep up dude.

 

[new_trader]

It's called socialism. Tax payers bailing out the capitalist bankers.

Keep up dude.

That is fascism.

 

[Pat494]

The reason I criticised greed is because :-

Greedy bosses are helping themselves to huge amounts of the lifeblood of the company i.e. it's money. They are the servants of the compnies they are meant to be working for not the owners. The shareholders are becoming more aware of their ownership fortunately and are objecting to Martin Sorrell etc .ripping them off. He expected a 60% pay rise on a whopping great salary. How much of a raise did the rest get ?

Paying greedy bosses huge amounts also creates dissatisfaction within a company. A divided company will not do as well as a fair and happy company.

Bring on a windfall tax on the fatcats or are the politicians on their payroll as in America.

Glad to see Marcus Agus has got some form of honour and resigned. One less honourable man though.

 

[barjon]

Sorry had to frame this.

So, how much govt do we really need...my guess would be about 1/4 to 1/5 what we have now.

We need all these ******s out of our lives

It's the standard company evolution writ large but without the final imperative - it does keep a lot of people in work though.

small - very little back-room bureaucracy (brb), everyone focussed on business

small/medium - increasing brb

medium/large - increased brb an irritant and begins to inhibit business focus

large - massive increase in brb strongly inhibiting business

At this stage companies reach the final imperative and bring in the Management Consultants. They either carve off a massive chunk of brb to re-focus on business and move forward; or they slice up brb a bit and just lumber along; or they don't do anything and face a lingering death.

 

[new_trader]

The reason I criticised greed is because :-

Greedy bosses are helping themselves to huge amounts of the lifeblood of the company i.e. it's money. They are the servants of the compnies they are meant to be working for not the owners. The shareholders are becoming more aware of their ownership fortunately and are objecting to Martin Sorrell etc .ripping them off. He expected a 60% pay rise on a whopping great salary. How much of a raise did the rest get ?

Paying greedy bosses huge amounts also creates dissatisfaction within a company. A divided company will not do as well as a fair and happy company.

Bring on a windfall tax on the fatcats or are the politicians on their payroll as in America.

Glad to see Marcus Agus has got some form of honour and resigned. One less honourable man though.

By that definition, Governments are the greediest institutions on the planet as they take the largest portion of all...40% of my income...

 

[Pat494]

By that definition, Governments are the greediest institutions on the planet as they take the largest portion of all...40% of my income...

As you well know Govts can't run on hot air alone. They used to just take taxes in the old days, usually by force. Now one is supposed to agree to taxes and what the beaurocrats spend them on. Personally I wouldn't give a single penny to the taxman so the EU slugs, benefit cheats etc. can live in comfort.

Ever heard of the K2 tax avoidance scheme ?
Well to remind those that need reminding it is a scheme whereby the very rich pay big money to accountants to avoid paying a their share of tax. All legal but grossly immoral.

 

[Atilla]

I simply can't believe just how greedy bus drivers are? Can you?

I mean £500 for working through a month of hellish olympics driving a bus around London, putting up with spitting juvenile delinquents and sweaty ******** in the middle of summer. Really really greedy.

On the other hand we have Bob Diamond a real gentleman, who sipps ice tea from silverware sitting in air conditioned offices, who can afford to pay the bonuses of all the London bus drivers put together from his single bank bonus for halving shareholder value from 300 to 160p and still have change left over for some crass charity trying to improve peoples lives - being hounded for doing a solid days work.

Yet people are asking questions of him for bringing the banking profession and City of London's reputation into dissrepute.

People and politicians can be so ungrateful.

WTF is the world coming to???

 

[new_trader]

As you well know Govts can't run on hot air alone. They used to just take taxes in the old days, usually by force. Now one is supposed to agree to taxes and what the beaurocrats spend them on. Personally I wouldn't give a single penny to the taxman so the EU slugs, benefit cheats etc. can live in comfort.

Ever heard of the K2 tax avoidance scheme ?
Well to remind those that need reminding it is a scheme whereby the very rich pay big money to accountants to avoid paying a their share of tax. All legal but grossly immoral.

Ever heard of spread betting? You know profits are tax free! There are bus drivers slaving away putting up with spitting juvenile delinquents and sweaty ******** in the middle of summer, while some morons sit in comfort of their living rooms, click some buttons and make money without paying a penny in tax. It's criminal.

 

[forker]

Ever heard of spread betting? You know profits are tax free! There are bus drivers slaving away putting up with spitting juvenile delinquents and sweaty ******** in the middle of summer, while some morons sit in comfort of their living rooms, click some buttons and make money without paying a penny in tax. It's criminal.

It's only tax free if it isn't your only income

 

[barjon]

It's only tax free if it isn't your only income

not true - it's ok if it's your sole source of income but not necessarily ok if it's associated with other related income - eg: selling trading tips - when it might be regarded as part and parcel of an overall business

 

[forker]

not true - it's ok if it's your sole source of income but not necessarily ok if it's associated with other related income - eg: selling trading tips - when it might be regarded as part and parcel of an overall business

http://www.financial-spread-betting.com/Tax-free.html
Second paragraph states "
However it is important to point out that spread betting may only be tax free if it is not your main source of income. For that reason it is probably not wise when opening a spread betting account to put your job description down as 'day trader' or 'trader' as it would then be rather difficult to claim at a later date that trading was not your main income if the Inland Revenue was to query where you made your money!!!"

 

[barjon]

So is Spread Betting really tax-free?
Second paragraph states "
However it is important to point out that spread betting may only be tax free if it is not your main source of income. For that reason it is probably not wise when opening a spread betting account to put your job description down as 'day trader' or 'trader' as it would then be rather difficult to claim at a later date that trading was not your main income if the Inland Revenue was to query where you made your money!!!"

go to the horses mouth - neil post the links again here http://www.trade2win.com/boards/gen...-i-bet-not-lot-people-know-8.html#post1894980

 

[new_trader]

go to the horses mouth - neil post the links again here http://www.trade2win.com/boards/gen...-i-bet-not-lot-people-know-8.html#post1894980

Look at all those immoral members of this forum...there are people driving busses in London...

 

[Atilla]

Ever heard of spread betting? You know profits are tax free! There are bus drivers slaving away putting up with spitting juvenile delinquents and sweaty ******** in the middle of summer, while some morons sit in comfort of their living rooms, click some buttons and make money without paying a penny in tax. It's criminal.

Answer the proposition dude.

Stop going off at tangents

Pesky bus drivers should all be sacked and their salary should go to help Bob Diamond earn the credible salary he needs to justify his poor lil existence. Bless his cotton socks that Bob Diamond. Diamond geezer he is. Not greedy like those bus drivers.

 

[forker]

go to the horses mouth - neil post the links again here http://www.trade2win.com/boards/gen...-i-bet-not-lot-people-know-8.html#post1894980

Is that the argument you are using to support your standpoint, a corner case about a guy betting on horses? Do you honestly think the government will turn a blind eye to a guy spread betting for a living with no other form of income?
You need to get a new account

 

[new_trader]

Answer the proposition dude.

Stop going off at tangents

Pesky bus drivers should all be sacked and their salary should go to help Bob Diamond earn the credible salary he needs to justify his poor lil existence. Bless his cotton socks that Bob Diamond. Diamond geezer he is. Not greedy like those bus drivers.

What proposition...dude...?

All you and Pat know is what the television tells you. I see it in every incomprehensible and illogical Government apologist post you make. I would bet(only if profits are tax free) that neither of you had even heard of the
K2 tax avoidance scheme until the BBC told you about it.

"ANY LEGAL TAX AVOIDANCE SCHEME IS IMMORAL" said the spread better...

 

[barjon]

Is that the argument you are using to support your standpoint, a corner case about a guy betting on horses? Do you honestly think the government will turn a blind eye to a guy spread betting for a living with no other form of income?
You need to get a new account

sigh, this has been chewed over so many times and the links to HMRC are the precedent case law for the time being. The clue is in "betting" - doesn't matter if the "instrument" is horses or shares.

That's not to say that things won't change in the future but, if the figures are to be believed, the exchequer would lose more than it gains by making it taxable - all those losses to be set off against gains made elsewhere!!