Tape reading books

[DionysusToast]

I'm at odds with you here DT.

As far as I can tell, the approach that TRAW takes is keeping track of stock fundamentals and looking for trading opportunities when the fundamentals change. This, as a non-stock trader, makes perfect sense: Look for where the flow will be and front run / fade it as apppropriate using DOM/T&S as a cue.

Actually - that's what Mr C does. What TR does is multiple positions using L1 info.

With DOM/T&S - you mostly look at a single stock to enter at any one time BUT you get a more refined entry, which TR claims is impossible. He specifcally says that you can't use L2/DOM to get a good entry - so you just have to get in and manage it by scaling up & down. It is true that with TRs method you don't have to have a specific directional opinion. Mind you - neither does Mr C.

With L1 - you get a less refined entry and so the method is to get in to a stock that will move. You scale in when it does your way and scale out when it doesn't.

You can see on the video how it pans out..

If we look at 6:43 - we can see 46,600 shares traded.

ABM short 1000 - Profit $20.50
SCHL short 200 - Profit -$27
GIS Long 3400 - Profit -$88
ATU Short 2800 - Profit -$48.13

Close P&L - $396

At this point value of positions is $228,804

Now - as the day goes on - if trades go against, there's scaling out. If trades go your way you scale in.

So - nothing wrong so far but it is clear that the method is more of a scattergun approach - you don't try to predict direction, you try to follow it and trade enough stocks so you get a runner to make up for the losses. TR also says any other method of day trading stocks will not work.

Fast forward to 7:07 and we have over 53,000 shares traded and we stand at.

ABM - short 1200 - 25.07 - P&L $9.40
GIS - Long 7000 - 36.46 - P&L $935.22
ATU - Short 1200 - 26.57 - P&L -$111

At this point closed P&L is -$416 and open P&L is $786.

Margin is now $317k. There's $250K riding on the 7000 share position.

Now - TR makes a profit on the day of $600 and a total of 62,400 shares traded. From the videos I have seen the pattern is similar. Building up bigger and bigger positions of the runners as the day progresses. I haven't seen a video where the market goes against aggressively and I don't know what safeguards are in place to protect against this.

So - we get in with a small amount of contracts, scale up as it goes our way, scale out if it goes against - keep doing this all day and based on the stocks selected, you stand to benefit from the runners.

Now - is this the only way to trade ? Of course not. Is it risky ? You decide.

Using less information - i.e. just L1 info means you have to get into more positions and manage them aggressively. Using more information (L2 /T&S) means you can get into less positions at the right time. This is as you'd expect.

Both methods are equally valid but will suit different people depending on their account size and attitude to risk.

 

[tradingRAW]

Actually - that's what Mr C does. What TR does is multiple positions using L1 info.

With DOM/T&S - you mostly look at a single stock to enter at any one time BUT you get a more refined entry, which TR claims is impossible. He specifcally says that you can't use L2/DOM to get a good entry - so you just have to get in and manage it by scaling up & down. It is true that with TRs method you don't have to have a specific directional opinion. Mind you - neither does Mr C.

With L1 - you get a less refined entry and so the method is to get in to a stock that will move. You scale in when it does your way and scale out when it doesn't.

You can see on the video how it pans out..

If we look at 6:43 - we can see 46,600 shares traded.

ABM short 1000 - Profit $20.50
SCHL short 200 - Profit -$27
GIS Long 3400 - Profit -$88
ATU Short 2800 - Profit -$48.13

Close P&L - $396

At this point value of positions is $228,804

Now - as the day goes on - if trades go against, there's scaling out. If trades go your way you scale in.

So - nothing wrong so far but it is clear that the method is more of a scattergun approach - you don't try to predict direction, you try to follow it and trade enough stocks so you get a runner to make up for the losses. TR also says any other method of day trading stocks will not work.

Fast forward to 7:07 and we have over 53,000 shares traded and we stand at.

ABM - short 1200 - 25.07 - P&L $9.40
GIS - Long 7000 - 36.46 - P&L $935.22
ATU - Short 1200 - 26.57 - P&L -$111

At this point closed P&L is -$416 and open P&L is $786.

Margin is now $317k. There's $250K riding on the 7000 share position.

Now - TR makes a profit on the day of $600 and a total of 62,400 shares traded. From the videos I have seen the pattern is similar. Building up bigger and bigger positions of the runners as the day progresses. I haven't seen a video where the market goes against aggressively and I don't know what safeguards are in place to protect against this.

So - we get in with a small amount of contracts, scale up as it goes our way, scale out if it goes against - keep doing this all day and based on the stocks selected, you stand to benefit from the runners.

Now - is this the only way to trade ? Of course not. Is it risky ? You decide.

Using less information - i.e. just L1 info means you have to get into more positions and manage them aggressively. Using more information (L2 /T&S) means you can get into less positions at the right time. This is as you'd expect.

Both methods are equally valid but will suit different people depending on their account size and attitude to risk.

"You can see on the video how it pans out."

Yes that's one selective video to prove your point but to get a clearer picture of how it truly pans out you must spand out across 30 days of trading which I've posted back to back. What truely pans out is consistency because skills pull though to get a trader up everyday. It takes time to develop, just like any other skill.

"I haven't seen a video where the market goes against aggressively and I don't know what safeguards are in place to protect against this."

The content strategy and actively managing are safeguards. We trade stocks that have its own reason to move. Has no baring on the broader market which is also key. You never seen a stock up while the market is down or a stock down while the market is up? On the day th market was up 250pts on econ data was shorting all day. We react to price action, if the stock is strong we long if weak we short and not because of broader market influences. No mental "what if" games.

"Is it risky ?"

Trading is risky, actively managing your position and scaling in and out help you manage that risk.

"Now - is this the only way to trade ?"

Of course not, ...My arguement is this, 90% of new traders fail. The current market place focus on perfect system guarantee easy effortless trading. I say it's far from reality on the ground and I'm confident many viewers can back me up on that. What is needed is more skill development prior to risking real capital.

"So - we get in with a small amount of contracts, scale up as it goes our way, scale out if it goes against - keep doing this all day and based on the stocks selected, you stand to benefit from the runners."

Yes, those small amount of contracts you mention are essentially 200 shares involvement trades. Involement trades can turn into cut or add depending on how the tape reads. Involvement positions are very important. It gets traders in the stock and forces them to watch closely the tape action on level I, adding when its working cutting if it doesn't. Do nothing when the stock do nothing. We are must closer to the stock if we are in it and risking something. That in itself is risk management unlike one shot 1k shares if you are wrong you lose on 1k shares. Here we are trying to develop a feel for where the stock ultimate direction maybe. Many times losses are the cost of paying for information on the stock's ultimate direction.

"Using less information - i.e. just L1 info means you have to get into more positions and manage them aggressively. Using more information (L2 /T&S) means you can get into less positions at the right time. This is as you'd expect."

I can trade 1 stock as affectively as any one using L2/T&S, there are many videos that show trading only one or two stocks. I get into more position because I can and not because I need to to make money. I'm just trying to catch more things. I'm not tied down to tracking multi L2/T&S windows therefore, I can apply level I accross many stocks otherwise my screen would be bloated with lots of L2/T&S and my eyes would miss allot of things trying to keep up with a bloated screen. If you ever see the movie "Floored" http://www.babelgum.com/5003511?action=share one trader said "the only thing that matters is this part of the screen everything else is eye candy." She was talking about level I. But let me clearify again why Level I is important for what we do. We are trading fast pace stocks that is reacting to the news at hand its very hard to go beyond level I and lead the price action, maybe midday when things slow down, L2/T&S is much more discernible.


" TR also says any other method of day trading stocks will not work."

Your persisent with this statement is kinda fishy. From MrGecko own words who is a legendary member, he should be commended for actually putting forth the challenge. Might actually be something T2W memebers should do regularly rather quick to shout scam. Those that don't accept such challenges, Let them have it! Shout scam all you want.

"I'm at odds with you here DT.

As far as I can tell, the approach that TRAW takes is keeping track of stock fundamentals and looking for trading opportunities when the fundamentals change. This, as a non-stock trader, makes perfect sense: Look for where the flow will be and front run / fade it as apppropriate using DOM/T&S as a cue.

This is what I have gathered from the limited time I could be arsed to browse his website. He hasn't said that whatever anybody else does can't work, and when presented with the accusation that the reviews of his service were dishonest he gave Amit a free trial to see what he thought.

I could go on, but I believe my position is clear."

 

[DionysusToast]

Before I go on - this is a thread about tape reading - not about you. I will therefore try to keep on topic.

"You can see on the video how it pans out."

Yes that's one selective video to prove your point but to get a clearer picture of how it truly pans out you must spand out across 30 days of trading which I've posted back to back. What truely pans out is consistency because skills pull though to get a trader up everyday. It takes time to develop, just like any other skill.

In terms of my being selective on the videos - I just took the most recent one on Youtube - to save me trawling through more -perhaps you could suggest some on the other end of the scale.

"I haven't seen a video where the market goes against aggressively and I don't know what safeguards are in place to protect against this."

The content strategy and actively managing are safeguards. We trade stocks that have its own reason to move. Has no baring on the broader market which is also key. You never seen a stock up while the market is down or a stock down while the market is up? On the day th market was up 250pts on econ data was shorting all day. We react to price action, if the stock is strong we long if weak we short and not because of broader market influences. No mental "what if" games.

That is fine. On the other hand, there are people that enter less positions and use a little more information on the entry. The additional information being the order book and for some the full tape. There are also people that use the DOM/T&S to enter and then don't look at it again.

I did look at your most recent videos. I will take time to look at a few more. Still you did have a 7000 share position which you scaled up, which averages up your price and so at the point you had 7000 shares, your profit was 13 cents per share. This is fine and I am sure it's just par for the course in your model.

You say you can do just as well with L1 as anybody else can with L2 & full Time and sales. Fair enough but the people I know that use L2 - one of them running a hedge fund & does not chase positions up and down all day. His favourite line is "Think like a market maker" and he enters positions based on his theories of how markets are played. He trades similar stocks to you but in a very different way. The L2/Tape is done to refine the entry and then he leaves the position alone. One of his other favourite saying is "we are DAY trading, not 5 minute trading".

Like I say - it's a different style and people like Hotch, who started this thread looking for information on tape reading needs to understand that the order flow can be read in a few different ways and that some of them do allow you to get good entries. It is not a mental "what if" game, it is a game of interpreting the action that plays out. You can of course have an opinion on what should happen - you just can't trade off that, only of what actually happens.

"Is it risky ?"

Trading is risky, actively managing your position and scaling in and out help you manage that risk.

"Now - is this the only way to trade ?"

Of course not, ...My arguement is this, 90% of new traders fail. The current market place focus on perfect system guarantee easy effortless trading. I say it's far from reality on the ground and I'm confident many viewers can back me up on that. What is needed is more skill development prior to risking real capital.

I totally agree. A lot of people are looking for an easy way to do this. I agree with your analogy about trading being a sport.

"So - we get in with a small amount of contracts, scale up as it goes our way, scale out if it goes against - keep doing this all day and based on the stocks selected, you stand to benefit from the runners."

Yes, those small amount of contracts you mention are essentially 200 shares involvement trades. Involement trades can turn into cut or add depending on how the tape reads. Involvement positions are very important. It gets traders in the stock and forces them to watch closely the tape action on level I, adding when its working cutting if it doesn't. Do nothing when the stock do nothing. We are must closer to the stock if we are in it and risking something. That in itself is risk management unlike one shot 1k shares if you are wrong you lose on 1k shares. Here we are trying to develop a feel for where the stock ultimate direction maybe. Many times losses are the cost of paying for information on the stock's ultimate direction.

"Using less information - i.e. just L1 info means you have to get into more positions and manage them aggressively. Using more information (L2 /T&S) means you can get into less positions at the right time. This is as you'd expect."

I can trade 1 stock as affectively as any one using L2/T&S,

Following your method of getting in, scaling in/out and reversing I can believe that you can trade as well on L1 as anyone can on L2.

Other methods will of course require varying levels of information. Some of which is not on L1. Or are you saying that for all methods of trading stocks - regardless of how the order book and time and sales are being used - that these methods can be all executed using just L1?

Now - in terms of futures trading. There are a lot of people employing techniques where the whole order book is used and these people could not use just L1 information. If they could, TT would be out of business. I am not sure how many of the guys here actually use T&S in conjunction with the order book I would presume few.

TR - would you say your L1 method could be applied to other markets such as futures and that you could also trade as well as any futures trader using a full DOM/T&S?

 

[DionysusToast]

Hotch - if you want a FREE insight into someone that uses DOM/T&S have a look at the free videos and posts on here : http://www.futurestrader71.com/2010/11/chat-session-archive.html - this is a futures trader with his own prop shop and he is also using DOM/T&S to confirm entries. These entries are directional and they are precise.

What you didn't mention yet is why you actually want to use this information.
- Are you looking to become a scalper - looking for say a point at a time on the ES?
- Are you looking to use it to refine entry on short term trades?
- Are you looking to use it as final confirmation to get in or not?
- Are you looking to use it to manage your trades once in?

It's probably a good idea if you outline what you want to get from it.

 

[DionysusToast]

Here's a sample from Friday Hotch. Sadly my replay data hasn't loaded in Ninja so I can't take screen shots of this but I can tell you what was happening at the time.

ES Futures were at 1237.50 when the cash market opened, they initially went down to 1236 and then headed back up. On the way back up - it hit 1237.75 but only 200 contracts traded and 1237.75 never became the offer. The result was that we were sitting on bid 1237.25, offer 1237.50. At that point a lot of market buy orders came through hitting that offer - which initially was about 2 or 3000 contracts offered. Those offers did not get pulled as market buy orders hit it, in fact, the offers were getting refreshed. Something in the region of 7000 contracts went through at 1237.50 without the price ticking up at all and there were still 2000 offered. This is a fair amount when you consider the number of contracts it had taken to move the price up so far. At the same time this was going on there was no real selling to speak of - so this was not 2 heavy hitters battling it out.

At this point, the little parrot on my shoulder AKA the missus who is interested in these things got told that the probability was that we'd see a move down at least 5 or 6 ticks from this point. In actual fact, the move down was a little more than that. This move down was swift and price did not tick up 1 tick beyond this point where someone sat on the offer and absorbed all that buying.

Now - I didn't trade it, it's just one of the things you see when you watch the tape and you have some rough frame of reference to look for. It's almost a gut feel. You can never be 100% right - but you can be more than 50% right.

If you read 20 or 30 descriptions like the above, it would be tough to keep them in your head. I think this is why books on tape reading don't exist. The medium can't convey the message.

 

[tradingRAW]

Before I go on - this is a thread about tape reading - not about you. I will therefore try to keep on topic.



In terms of my being selective on the videos - I just took the most recent one on Youtube - to save me trawling through more -perhaps you could suggest some on the other end of the scale.



That is fine. On the other hand, there are people that enter less positions and use a little more information on the entry. The additional information being the order book and for some the full tape. There are also people that use the DOM/T&S to enter and then don't look at it again.

I did look at your most recent videos. I will take time to look at a few more. Still you did have a 7000 share position which you scaled up, which averages up your price and so at the point you had 7000 shares, your profit was 13 cents per share. This is fine and I am sure it's just par for the course in your model.

You say you can do just as well with L1 as anybody else can with L2 & full Time and sales. Fair enough but the people I know that use L2 - one of them running a hedge fund & does not chase positions up and down all day. His favourite line is "Think like a market maker" and he enters positions based on his theories of how markets are played. He trades similar stocks to you but in a very different way. The L2/Tape is done to refine the entry and then he leaves the position alone. One of his other favourite saying is "we are DAY trading, not 5 minute trading".

Like I say - it's a different style and people like Hotch, who started this thread looking for information on tape reading needs to understand that the order flow can be read in a few different ways and that some of them do allow you to get good entries. It is not a mental "what if" game, it is a game of interpreting the action that plays out. You can of course have an opinion on what should happen - you just can't trade off that, only of what actually happens.



I totally agree. A lot of people are looking for an easy way to do this. I agree with your analogy about trading being a sport.



Following your method of getting in, scaling in/out and reversing I can believe that you can trade as well on L1 as anyone can on L2.

Other methods will of course require varying levels of information. Some of which is not on L1. Or are you saying that for all methods of trading stocks - regardless of how the order book and time and sales are being used - that these methods can be all executed using just L1?

Now - in terms of futures trading. There are a lot of people employing techniques where the whole order book is used and these people could not use just L1 information. If they could, TT would be out of business. I am not sure how many of the guys here actually use T&S in conjunction with the order book I would presume few.

TR - would you say your L1 method could be applied to other markets such as futures and that you could also trade as well as any futures trader using a full DOM/T&S?

"TR - would you say your L1 method could be applied to other markets such as futures and that you could also trade as well as any futures trader using a full DOM/T&S?"

I only day trade US equity, trading reaction to catalyst. And what it take to do that successfully, consistently and I simply back it up with real-time tradng videos. transparency is paramount....there is nothing better than sitting behind a trader and watch him/her trade...desktop recording allows that. Why doesn't that exist and why shouldn't we demand more of that from a vendor and members?

"Youtube - to save me trawling through more -perhaps you could suggest some on the other end of the scale."

Doesn't matter 1 stock 5 stocks all off level I.

12-17-2010 trading RIMM on earnings after all else failed.
12-15-2010 couple stocks at a time.
12-14-2010 HCP trade..one stock level I
12-13-2010 couple stock at a time.

What you are seeing on these video is solid content strategy and just tape skills to catch the move because market participants become positive or negative to the catalyst and react aggressively and accordingly. Its hard to talk about just tape alone because its just a tool like any other.

We must look at the bigger picture to why tape can be so affective at times and yet can fail equally because its far from being a perfect tool. Nothing is, but catalyst plays a critical role in that...if stocks didn't move the way it did in these videos money will be lost I assure you. But that's the thing they moved cause there is an underlying catalyst causing them to, a shift in a company's fundamental will do that to their stock price. But if i need to get into more positions in case things fail like on video 12-17-2010 I can. To be up i had to enter the volatilty and test my skills to come out on top to be up for the day. This is the second time I traded RIMM, a monster stock but i'm so condtion to the tape that i'm every step along the way and ahead of the tape cause I know how it should be read if its weak or strong before prints transpires. If it breaks i'll catch it. This is how consistency can be reign for the way we trade, but skills take time to develop. The ability to be flexible is critical because who really knows how our stocks will treat us once it begins trading.

 

[tradingRAW]

Here's a sample from Friday Hotch. Sadly my replay data hasn't loaded in Ninja so I can't take screen shots of this but I can tell you what was happening at the time.

ES Futures were at 1237.50 when the cash market opened, they initially went down to 1236 and then headed back up. On the way back up - it hit 1237.75 but only 200 contracts traded and 1237.75 never became the offer. The result was that we were sitting on bid 1237.25, offer 1237.50. At that point a lot of market buy orders came through hitting that offer - which initially was about 2 or 3000 contracts offered. Those offers did not get pulled as market buy orders hit it, in fact, the offers were getting refreshed. Something in the region of 7000 contracts went through at 1237.50 without the price ticking up at all and there were still 2000 offered. This is a fair amount when you consider the number of contracts it had taken to move the price up so far. At the same time this was going on there was no real selling to speak of - so this was not 2 heavy hitters battling it out.

At this point, the little parrot on my shoulder AKA the missus who is interested in these things got told that the probability was that we'd see a move down at least 5 or 6 ticks from this point. In actual fact, the move down was a little more than that. This move down was swift and price did not tick up 1 tick beyond this point where someone sat on the offer and absorbed all that buying.

Now - I didn't trade it, it's just one of the things you see when you watch the tape and you have some rough frame of reference to look for. It's almost a gut feel. You can never be 100% right - but you can be more than 50% right.

If you read 20 or 30 descriptions like the above, it would be tough to keep them in your head. I think this is why books on tape reading don't exist. The medium can't convey the message.

I not familiar with ES futures, didn't recall or see what Hotch was trading. he generically mention tape reading. is t2w all ES futures trading? If you are trading just ES Futures you can have allot of tools to help you, L2/time&sales because you're tracking one instrument.

 

[DionysusToast]

"TR - would you say your L1 method could be applied to other markets such as futures and that you could also trade as well as any futures trader using a full DOM/T&S?"

I only day trade US equity, trading reaction to catalyst. And what it take to do that successfully, consistently and I simply back it up with real-time tradng videos. transparency is paramount....there is nothing better than sitting behind a trader and watch him/her trade...desktop recording allows that. Why doesn't that exist and why shouldn't we demand more of that from a vendor and members?

My opinion on this:
Most vendors are not making money and therefore can't show videos.
Most members are also not making money. For those that are, I can't imagine what would motivate them to show videos.
A number of members here claim to have a 'secret edge' which would be exposed on video (even though it's nonsenes).

["Youtube - to save me trawling through more -perhaps you could suggest some on the other end of the scale."

Doesn't matter 1 stock 5 stocks all off level I.

12-17-2010 trading RIMM on earnings after all else failed.
12-15-2010 couple stocks at a time.
12-14-2010 HCP trade..one stock level I
12-13-2010 couple stock at a time.

What you are seeing on these video is solid content strategy and just tape skills to catch the move because market participants become positive or negative to the catalyst and react aggressively and accordingly. Its hard to talk about just tape alone because its just a tool like any other.

We must look at the bigger picture to why tape can be so affective at times and yet can fail equally because its far from being a perfect tool. Nothing is, but catalyst plays a critical role in that...if stocks didn't move the way it did in these videos money will be lost I assure you. But that's the thing they moved cause there is an underlying catalyst causing them to, a shift in a company's fundamental will do that to their stock price. But if i need to get into more positions in case things fail like on video 12-17-2010 I can. To be up i had to enter the volatilty and test my skills to come out on top to be up for the day. This is the second time I traded RIMM, a monster stock but i'm so condtion to the tape that i'm every step along the way and ahead of the tape cause I know how it should be read if its weak or strong before prints transpires. If it breaks i'll catch it. This is how consistency can be reign for the way we trade, but skills take time to develop. The ability to be flexible is critical because who really knows how our stocks will treat us once it begins trading.

I agree with everything you say here. Especially on the skills aspect.

I like the analogy of driving. When you first learn, it feels like there's 1000 things to think about when you drive. Once you are proficient, there will be times where you'll catch yourself having driven for an hour and you can't really recall the driving itself -there was no thought involved.

 

[DionysusToast]

I not familiar with ES futures, didn't recall or see what Hotch was trading. he generically mention tape reading. is t2w all ES futures trading? If you are trading just ES Futures you can have allot of tools to help you, L2/time&sales because you're tracking one instrument.

Nope - not all futures here, I get the idea that a lot of members are using forex. There aren't many stock traders here. A lot of the people that come & go appear to be starting with a really low capital base which means they gravitate towards forex as they don't have the funds to day trade.

Some people go to Futures because again, you don't have the PDT rules and so you see people starting up a futures trading account with low capital. You might get a guy with $5k starting a futures trading account, which is really too low.

With the ES - there's a lot of supplementary tools that people use like trin, tick,prem but I think they are a distraction if you are daytrading.

 

[DionysusToast]

" TR also says any other method of day trading stocks will not work."

Your persisent with this statement is kinda fishy. From MrGecko own words who is a legendary member, he should be commended for actually putting forth the challenge. Might actually be something T2W memebers should do regularly rather quick to shout scam. Those that don't accept such challenges, Let them have it! Shout scam all you want.

Allow me to clarify.

My understanding of what you have said in this thread, specifically in statements like this...

"The idea that you can gauge order flow through level II or time and sales will not allow you to achieve the level of consistency a trader needs to make a solid living....I've seen it time and time again."

...is that you say L2/T&S CANNOT be used to take a single, refined, accurate directional entry. Same for DOM/T&S.

Is this correct or did I misinterpret?

It is just that this is what Amit does - he has a thread on here about trading breakouts (which I don't personally like to do) with L2/T&S to refine a single, directional entry. Mr C on here also make calls backed on price action and L2/T&S to make a single directional entry. In this case, a full position is taken and in one case, they scale out, not in. They do not reverse and pyramid as you do but they will cut the position if it turns out their original entry was not correct. Their size will be smaller - but as they are not averaging up, the profits from a similar move would be about the same from what I can see.

Now - either method is valid in my opinion but my interpretation of your comments is that you are saying the method Amit & Mr C uses would not actually work. This is where I take exception to what you wrote but I could certainly have misinterpreted.

This does pertain to tape reading in that we seem to be discounting the way other people use the information.

BTW - I am against squiggly likes just as much as you...

 

[Hotch]

Here's a sample from Friday Hotch....

Thanks for that, was rather enlightening.

 

[Devilicus]

Mr Charts just shows after-the-event charts though(which anyone can do). I guess nobody really knows if he does or doesn't make money trading. Maybe not the best example.
Recorded footage is quite neat, although, 'harvey walsh' turned out to be a scammer and he also recorded his daily trading for youtube. (he also employed a strategy nearly identical to Mr Charts)
Grey1 has been the most transparent trader and not even a veendor. He 'coached' for using a free chatroom, software to show his desktop and automated stock enginem and called trades through the microphone. Awesome.