So where are we heading?

Where are we heading over the next couple of years?

  • Steady climb

    Votes: 5 16.1%

  • Bear market

    Votes: 13 41.9%

  • Rocky ride

    Votes: 13 41.9%
  • Total voters
    31
Once folk realize, that the culture creation industry is not only a "for profit" organization, but also a top down control mechanism,..they would comprehend that it's in the "Established" orders interest to keep folk believing in a certain "ideology/system".
When intelligent folk get on board with the "conspiracy theorist" bandwagon,..they are usually taunted with slogans like the afore mentioned and many others, e.g,. Illuminati,Reptilians etc, etc
Those in the know, call it "counter intelligence".
Most psychologists are fully aware of the power of conformity in the human species, and know how to ostracize the few, who understand the machinations of the system in which we live, and whom try to propagate it's workings,...
Something to ponder,..." Those that are to idle to use their minds, are like meat on the table, and beasts of burden by choice and consent" ! : )
BTW: This isn't my speculation piece Rossini,..I just couldn't resist robster970's retort
 
I had to ask Hilary, I needed to know whether you were a conspiraloon or not. Incidentally, all you are articulating is the two sides of the same coin which are power corrupts and religion (now being replaced by political/cultural ideology) is the opium of the people. It's merely a rebranding of human falibility.
 
If you want to find out about our future, look at our past. We're wired to survive and those primitive ingrained behaviours are not going to go away quickly, if at all.

So as I said in my original post, empires will fall and empires will rise based upon failures of old ideologies and the rise of new ideologies. People will follow, tribalism will ensue and wars will occur. People will continue to reproduce and we will continue to consume resources. Ultimately the forces of nature will eventually wipe us out whether we have contributed to that or not.

Playing the game of ideology vs contra-ideology just shows affinity to a different herd, ergo more of the same.
 
robster970,..your post reads as if events unfold by happenstance,..Am I correct in my assumption?
For instance,..(for my edification) Why do empires rise and fall?
Who do people follow, and why?
Why do wars occur?
"the forces of nature will eventually wipe us out",...quite the statement of "fact",..tell me more, I'm intrigued. : )
 
I'm quite enjoying this (not in a sarcastic way btw) as it's rare that this kind of stuff gets discussed.

Hilarymannah said:
robster970,..your post reads as if events unfold by happenstance,..Am I correct in my assumption?
Click to expand...

No but I don't believe it is as orchestrated as people like to believe and it is down to more fundamental and simple reasons. Human's are wired to come up with more and more convoluted answers to things they don't understand, often ignoring that the simplest answer may be the right answer. Ocaams Razor if you like.

For instance,..(for my edification) Why do empires rise and fall?
Who do people follow, and why? Why do wars occur?
Click to expand...

Ultimately because we're wired to try and become alpha males/females or align with them. So, some Alpha male uses increasingly sophisticated ideological reasoning to grow their tribe. Some other competing Alpha male does the same using a different ideology. They have a fight, using increasibly sophisticated methods (all based ulitmately on fighting or trade), someone wins, others lose and then the masses in the losing crowd slowly align with the winner.

It's social dominance at play and it's hard wired into all of us on a very, very primitive basis.

"the forces of nature will eventually wipe us out",...quite the statement of "fact",..tell me more, I'm intrigued. : )
Click to expand...

Change in environment that prohibits survival (ice age, warm periods, basically significant changes on geological timeframes that dwarf human existence).
Sun runs out of hydrogen eventually engulfing Earth before dying as a Red Giant
Heat death of Universe based upon Laws of Entropy

So there was three where nature finishes us off, unequivecolly.

In the meantime, we carry on doing the same thing, time and time again, deluding ourselves that we're smarter than we actually are.
 
Robster970 "No but I don't believe it is as orchestrated as people like to believe "

By that, I'm assuming you think armies just get together, haphazardly, and create war?
Whole populations/cultures, (by coincidence) all think along the same lines?
Money is a natural product of evolution?
Television is for entertainment purposes only?
 
I believe that the first 2 things would happen just by humans behaving like humans and it does not take much to get in that state. We would always find a reason to fight and we would always find a reason to agree with each other.

The last two points are irrelevant and are not at the core of the behaviour.

So, over to you now. Can you demonstrate that you are not part of a contra-ideology that is all part of what is ultimately, animal behaviour in its simplest and purest sense?

Tribal, ideologically constrained, and just another member of the 'other herd'? Free thinking or ultimately controlled?
 
Robster970 " The last two points are irrelevant and are not at the core of the behaviour."

Fact: When a dominant "system" assimilates another,..anthropologists are sent in to learn the behavior of the less dominant "tribe",.which enable the dominant "system", to easily merge and subvert.
Question: Were you aware of this part of human "nature"?
 
Here's a fact too. When a dominant "system" wants to assimilate another, armies are sent in under the pre-text of war with subsequent economic/societal reconstruction to enable the dominant system to easily merge and subvert. Can you see how the mixed use of anthropology, psychology, fighting and economics are used as a weapons of war in a far more sophisticated means? It's part of our human nature.

That's all your saying to me - that the execution of the basic desire to fight is increasingly sophisticated now. It's no longer about stones and arrows. All in the name of our tribe and it's ideology.

When are you going to answer my question?

Can you demonstrate that you are not part of a contra-ideology that is all part of what is ultimately, animal behaviour in its simplest and purest sense?

Tribal, ideologically constrained, and just another member of the 'other herd'? Free thinking or ultimately controlled?
Click to expand...
 
"part of "our" human nature" ?

The "our" part is quite the generalization,..I would suggest, the dominant psyche in "our" system are pathological/psychopathic,..and hence the sociopaths that "copy" the system they are born into.
The marked difference between animal behavior and human behavior,e.g,. "The human being is not only an animal, but a superior creature who can understand that he is alive, and transform his personality, attaining perfection. He has to transform his violent animal behavior into a peaceful and wise human behavior, if he wants to prevent violence and live happily, instead of exploding with anger, and suffering.
http://www.bukisa.com/articles/298363_anger-control-the-difference-between-human-and-animal-behavior
 
You've hit the nub of the difference in opinion. I don't think we can transcend our primitive needs and behaviours as social animals as they are not part of a system created by others - they are inherent.

Is it easier to be told that we can change and that we are 'superior creatures' than to embrace the possibility that we can't?

Is it easier to transfer responsibility and externalise the demons within us by blaming power structures or ideologies for our behaviours?

Are all these ideological constructs there primarily to 'control' or are they self created, en masse, through story telling, discussion, sharing to handle the burden of being a complex animal that has evolved a concious that is out of kilter with our basic and largely, only needs?

Are you really free-thinking? I think not. You need to eat, **** and reproduce and you'll join any band that sits most comfortably with you to do it and demonise those not within the group to create meaning in your life.
 
"That's all your saying to me - that the execution of the basic desire to fight "

I would hasten a guess that most sentient soldiers coming home from war, would argue with your assertion that it's innate in our psyche to maim and slaughter, hence "PTSD"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posttraumatic_stress_disorder
I do believe they are issued drugs to enhance "their nature" on the battle field.
 
robster970,... Don't take this personally,..but your writing portray a certain level of naivety,..are you quite young, chronologically speaking? ; )
 
Yes the basic desire to fight for an ideology they believe in. The fact they suffer from PTSD as a consequence is not a reason to dismiss the assertion, it is a consequence of their action. It is not uncommon for humans to do things that cause themselves harm either physically or psychologically.
 
Hilarymannah said:
robster970,... Don't take this personally,..but your writing portray a certain level of naivety,..are you quite young, chronologically speaking? ; )
Click to expand...

LOL - I was having the same thoughts about you. One dimensional single truth mentality, avoidance of discourse, unsophisticated arguing style lacking dynanism and breadth, etc

Yes I'm 40 and therefore quite young :)

Maybe we should just part, safe in the knowledge that we are both right in our own minds.
 
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