My very own trading system

[L33bets]

Please forgive me if this has been posted before, but being new to trading and to trade2win, i hope you'll forgive me.

As i said above, i'm fairly new to this game, but it would be my dream to be able to make a living out of trading. I earn around £20000, so if i can earn that trading, thats my dream. Simple eh??

So i posted a thread a couple of weeks back on another site, and got slated. I hust wanted to ask some basic questions, but i think they were a bit too basic for some. So hopefully, i'll post them now, but word them a little different, and fingers crossed, i'll get a nicer reply/replies.

Being new to trading, i as of yet, not developed my own method of making consistent profits trading. Am i right in saying, that if you find a method, wether it be looking at charts, or ema's etc, that gives you more profits than loses, then this is a trading system? Have you just got to find a method?

Also, are there certain days when you could confidently say the Dow is going to go up or down, eg, it may always move down on christmas day for example. (not that it does or anything, just purely an example. Eh, hang on, its closed then isnt it? You know what i mean though )

Also, i get hundreds of letters telling me that they have a system i can buy which will make me money, and sucker me always falls for it, ending up with loses!
Is there any one out there who offers advise or shows you there system for free???

Hope someone can help. I dont want to be a millionaire or anything, just make enough extra money to pay for a holiday every year. Am i asking too much??? All i want is my very own trading system, or at least some advice on how to find it.

Thanks,

L33.

 

[TheBramble]

So hopefully, i'll post them now, but word them a little different, and fingers crossed, i'll get a nicer reply/replies.

Don't bank on it L33 - we're a nasty bunch in here....

Being new to trading, i as of yet, not developed my own method of making consistent profits trading. Am i right in saying, that if you find a method, wether it be looking at charts, or ema's etc, that gives you more profits than loses, then this is a trading system? Have you just got to find a method?

Sums it up nicely. What you'll also need is risk and money management.

Also, are there certain days when you could confidently say the Dow is going to go up or down,

Confidently as in 100% - Not as far as I've seen on these (or any boards), but do let me know if you find a definite winner.

Also, i get hundreds of letters telling me that they have a system i can buy which will make me money, and sucker me always falls for it, ending up with loses!
Is there any one out there who offers advise or shows you there system for free???

The commercial systems are not worth paying for. The freebie systems are worth looking at for the earnest and genuine intention to help from fellow traders, but caveat emptor even if there's no emptoring as such. You still invest your time in checking out any system. Some of the freebies are well used and overall profitable. The trouble is, people will tinker and make them less so. Human nature. Far better having your own.

Hope someone can help. I dont want to be a millionaire or anything, just make enough extra money to pay for a holiday every year. Am i asking too much??? All i want is my very own trading system, or at least some advice on how to find it.

You're are in the right place, but there isn't a short-cut that I'm aware of. These boards are extensive, but you will need to put in the hours to trawl what you need from them.

Most of the members on t2w will be helpful, informative, humorous and sheer brilliant at times and don't worry about the few who seem terse and unhelpful - they've just had a bad day. Again!

 

[timsk]

L33,
Spend 5 minutes on T2W and you'll read that there is no 'holy grail'. There are people here who make consistent profits and, all of them, as far as I'm aware anyway, have achieved this through many hours (years!) of hard work. As the cliche goes - they 'plan the trade and trade the plan'. One thing is for sure, they ALL have a plan. They most definitely do NOT short the DOW on Christmas day because it plummeted last year! That's gambling, and consistently profitable traders do not gamble. They take carefully calculated risks which, as a result of experience and / or back testing, they know have a high probability of success. So, to answer your question, it is possible to achieve your goal, but it wil take a lot of work and commitment on your part. As for buying someone else's system 'off the peg' - well, there a prevailing view throughout this BB that the vendors of such systems only make money from the sale of their systems and not from trading them. I can testify to that, having forked out for someone else's system in the past and regreted it. My advice would be to trawl through the many threads on T2W and, after a while, certain people will say things which resonate with you. Find out about those traders and take your lead from them. That's what I did anyway. Naturally, the next reply you get may completely negate the comments that I've made and advise you differently. That's one of the great benefits of being a member of a site like this.
Good luck,
Tim.

 

[schoe]

L33. I spent 5 years and thousands of pounds on methods, courses etc learning what Tim has just told you.

Very very wise and true words digest them and they will stop you looking for the Holy Grail that does not exist.

Hard work and practice are the only ways to succeed you will then develop your own plan based on your psyche and personality. This is the true way to master the markets

 

[rglenn]

L33

The best advice I can give you is whatever plan, system or method you finally arrive at please remember that you have to lose to win in this game.

That have been one of my biggest mistakes in the past, in thinking that a system will always win regardless and not taking into consideration the losing days , weeks or maybe months.

Once you have got a system that works for you,that have been tried and tested by yourself over a long period, a year at least , then you will feel confident when you have a short losing run that there is no need to chuck the whole system in the bin and start again but be patient until it returns to it's winning form -which it will do if you have done your home work properly.

All the best

 

[Bigbusiness]

Also, are there certain days when you could confidently say the Dow is going to go up or down,...
.

Have a look at 1st June. I have looked back to 1984 and the Dow has closed up on that day 13 out of 14 times. The only day it was down was by just a few points and it had been nicely in to positive territory during the day. I know that just because this has happened in the past doesn't mean it will happen next year but I do think it is worth taking in to consideration. It certainly persuaded me to buy on June 1st this year when the Dow was down and I thought it was going to reverse. That trade alone was worth the time and effort of working out the stats. Now I just have to get as good on all the other days in the year

 

[TWI]

Bb - Exciting to think that with Very BIG balls and this knowledge in hand you could cut down the screen watching to one day per year.
timsk - I do not think there is a problem shorting/getting long Dow on a certain day because that is what it did last year or the last x years, after all, most systems are created by looking at historical data in some form or another. Important thing that IMO differentiates what I would call a "trade" from a "gamble" is that there is a reason for entry and just as important a disciplined exit strategy. All that matters with regard to entry is that whatever the criteria you use to get involved is giving some sort of probabilistic edge, this edge is of course quite a subjective area but definitely becomes clearer as money is won or lost.

 

[L33bets]

Thanks for all the advise so far.

So i've obviously got to find my own system and test a system i find. But how does one actually go about findind his/her system?? Where do you start?

 

[theblackmamba]

l33 re no. 8 - where do you start? this question could take a book to answer.
a couple of points to think about.
what type of trader are you going to become ie

day trader - do numerous trades during day. advantage - no overnight positions, disadvantage you have to be at your screen, you need the right type of personality. for this you need hardly any reasearch

position trader - typical holding position 1-8 days. advantage not so frantic, look for bigger trends, disadvantages - holding overnight, need wider stops so bigger drawdown. a lot of research is needed.

intermediate trader 8- month or so advantage dont have to monitor screen all day, disadvantages, bigger drawdowns, and wider stops required.

you also need to decide if you are going to use charts, fundamental info, or combination of both.

this is a start, if got time will continue later

 

[L33bets]

Cheers Black Mamba,

I am interested in all types of trading, but would love to day trade. But why do you not need a lot of research to day trade?

 

[theblackmamba]

Cheers Black Mamba,

I am interested in all types of trading, but would love to day trade. But why do you not need a lot of research to day trade?

what i mean is you don;t need as much compared to position trading. this is just my opinion others may disagree. i would say for daytrading you need about 45 minutes prep a day, whilst position trading at least 2 hours.
in theory in daytrading you could have your core of about 10 shares, and daily trawl the news for a few more candidates, look at vix etc, overnight markets, plan your stratergy. in position trading you have to look at many more charts( i look through 700+ daily and even though you become quick at it it still takes time ), you then have to work out buy/stop points etcc.
unfortuantely trading requires a lot of work.

 

[stevet]

try to get a job in a trading company or a company associated with trading

trading is either a full time job where you can make a lot of bucks - or a hobby which can cost you a lot of bucks

 

[L33bets]

try to get a job in a trading company or a company associated with trading

trading is either a full time job where you can make a lot of bucks - or a hobby which can cost you a lot of bucks

With living in the NW UK, is it possible to get a job in a trading company???

 

[timsk]

L33,

In my earlier post, I recommended finding trader(s) who you 'click' with (or words to that effect) and taking your lead from them. I recommend that you head the words of 'theblackmamba' - he does not post often - as you can see - but his reputation precedes him!

He acknowledged that the views of others may be different to his - as did I. You will note, I hope, that twalker challenged a comment I made re. trading the DOW. This is very positive. From experience, I know from your point of view that it's outputting to have people saying different things and appearing to disagree with one another. Go with the flow, stick to what your 'inner voice' tells you makes sense ( which often ISN'T what you want to hear) and pursue that line of enquiry. When it comes to the basics of trading, I doubt very much that twalker and I would disagree about anything at all. I suspect that that goes for most of the consistently profitable traders on this site. For thew record, I'm sorry to say that I ain't of 'em . . . yet! :cheesy:

Cheers, Tim.

 

[wisestguy]

mamba ,


what about scalpers ? or do they come under daytraders ?


L33 bets ,


I know I'm going against the grain here but I subscribe to the adage that there's no such thing as a free lunch not even here .

 

[L33bets]

Okay guys, good advice so far. But i'm so frustrated!!! I'm prepared to study for the knowledge i need. And i have been spreadbetting for a while now, and buying/selling shares for 'practice'. And if its true that you have to first lose money before you make money, then i'm due a massive windfall!

But i'm so keen to get started in this buisness that i am getting frustrated. There are people on here talking about making money and using various systems that work for them. Does anybody have a system that i could 'try', just to give me a head start. I have purchased dozens of e-books, Goldline (which is ok, but not brill), Startrader(extreme rip off and i'm still recovering from the costs now, never do that again), Clickvolume(just asked for a refund) and various other. And theyre all a waste of time!

I'd like to day trade, and have long term trades. But not sure where exactly to start. Yes, i have read books etc etc, but if i had a system that kind of works, i can paper trade for a while to practice and see the kind of thing i need to look for. Any takers?

The other thing is, i am constantly getting mail throgh the door. The other day, i was given some info about shares, and it recommeded some not to buy, as they were guaranteed to go down. There was a long list of reasons but i wondered, where do people get this info? And as it happens, i have placed a short bet on this stock to see if it really is going down.

Any help in these matters will be appreciated. As i have said previous, i hate my job, and would love to be a full time trader. But i need help, and i get the feeling this is the site.

Cheers,

L33.

Ps. Just out of interest, are there a lot of people within these forums that do trade for a living.

 

[Bigbusiness]

You could try this to start with:-

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=10044

Or this:-

http://thetradepit.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=46

 

[fudgestain]

Okay guys, good advice so far. But i'm so frustrated!!! I'm prepared to study for the knowledge i need. And i have been spreadbetting for a while now, and buying/selling shares for 'practice'. And if its true that you have to first lose money before you make money, then i'm due a massive windfall!

But i'm so keen to get started in this buisness that i am getting frustrated. There are people on here talking about making money and using various systems that work for them. Does anybody have a system that i could 'try', just to give me a head start. I have purchased dozens of e-books, Goldline (which is ok, but not brill), Startrader(extreme rip off and i'm still recovering from the costs now, never do that again), Clickvolume(just asked for a refund) and various other. And theyre all a waste of time!

I'd like to day trade, and have long term trades. But not sure where exactly to start. Yes, i have read books etc etc, but if i had a system that kind of works, i can paper trade for a while to practice and see the kind of thing i need to look for. Any takers?

The other thing is, i am constantly getting mail throgh the door. The other day, i was given some info about shares, and it recommeded some not to buy, as they were guaranteed to go down. There was a long list of reasons but i wondered, where do people get this info? And as it happens, i have placed a short bet on this stock to see if it really is going down.

Any help in these matters will be appreciated. As i have said previous, i hate my job, and would love to be a full time trader. But i need help, and i get the feeling this is the site.
Cheers,
L33.
Ps. Just out of interest, are there a lot of people within these forums that do trade for a living.

I have only bad news for you. You are a bull in china shop.

Study, research, data assembly, trading model construction, paper trading, test trading. Time 1 to 2 years; waking and living dedication as you work through, by elimination, and acquire sufficient knowledge of the market in which you choose to play (ie YM or ES). Doesn't sound like something you are ever going to do and which overwhelmingly most individual traders don't do.

This is an A to B process. The aim is to assemble your target money pile .. minimum 7 figures.
Trading for a living .. is a joke; this means continuously removing part or all of your profits (if you make any) so that you remain on an endless treadmill and never get to B.

So welcome to continuous disappointment and bloodied optimism.

 

[Roberto]

So i've obviously got to find my own system and test a system i find. But how does one actually go about findind his/her system?? Where do you start?

You could do a lot worse worse than starting by reading "Trading For A Living" by Dr. Alexander Elder and follow it up with "Trade Your Way To Financial Freedom" by Van K. Tharp. If nothing else, these two excellent books will help you to appreciate why it will take longer than you think. But possibly they will also suggest some good and practicable ideas to you, too.